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Old February 6, 2013, 11:16 AM   #1
sigcurious
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Chicago's New Policy: Decreased 911 Response

Video
Article

I came across this topic and immediately thought to my self of the advice often given here. "If you come home to a suspected break-in, call the police and wait outside until, they arrive to clear the home". It appears now that unless you know(or worse find out by entering) the thief is still inside they may not respond by sending officers.

No matter how the carry laws wind up being implemented in IL, this seems like a step in the wrong direction. To force citizens, armed or unarmed, to confront potentially dangerous situations. In an effort to curb one variety of crime, it seems they're opening the door to other crime where offenders know that police response is unlikely or will be delayed even further due to the back and forth.
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Old February 6, 2013, 12:31 PM   #2
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All right, I can understand that with the city being broke some changes have to be made. Any reasonable person can understand that. What I am having trouble muddling through is that it if they don't have time to respond to a crime, how is it they are able to give out traffic tickets and the dreaded boot with seemingly 100% perfection. As a citizen, I would rather police address crime and in disregard minor traffic infractions. Not being a police officer or a lawyer there is probably something here I'm missing.
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Old February 6, 2013, 12:37 PM   #3
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All right, I can understand that with the city being broke some changes have to be made. Any reasonable person can understand that. What I am having trouble muddling through is that it if they don't have time to respond to a crime, how is it they are able to give out traffic tickets and the dreaded boot with seemingly 100% perfection. As a citizen, I would rather police address crime and in disregard minor traffic infractions. Not being a police officer or a lawyer there is probably something here I'm missing.
There's money in handing out citations and the boot, and drug arrests.

No money, just risk, in clearing houses or running toward the sound of guns.

Follow the money.
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Old February 6, 2013, 04:28 PM   #4
Lt. Skrumpledonk Ret
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F Chicago

Police Chief McCawthy says "Crime is down" right before he says, "the police are responding to too many 911 calls blah blah blah"
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Old February 6, 2013, 05:20 PM   #5
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There's money in handing out citations and the boot, and drug arrests.
That could be some of it, but also the officers who do these tasks may not be sworn gun-toting officers. In Seattle, the parking enforcement isn't done by armed officers. I have no knowledge, but suspect they don't even have arrest powers. It would be kind of embarrassing as well to have them show up at your door to investigate your break-in and ask if they can borrow your gun.
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Old February 6, 2013, 07:17 PM   #6
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Police Chief McCawthy says "Crime is down".....
Over 500 murders last year, and over one murder a day so far for 2013. Yep, crime is down in the murder capitol of the USA.
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Old February 6, 2013, 07:31 PM   #7
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You have to read between the lines, they are tired of people calling 911 to complain that they got a cold Big Mac, or they did not get fries with thier happy meal.

WK
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Old February 6, 2013, 07:40 PM   #8
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they are tired of people calling 911 to complain that they got a cold Big Mac, or they did not get fries with thier happy meal.
Agreed. Reading the article, the way they're singling out "garage burglary" makes me think that they'll still send an officer out if you return to find your home has been broken into.
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Old February 6, 2013, 08:01 PM   #9
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Follow the money
THIS!!

This is true in almost every situation where there is money involved. Its too bad the majority of decisions are based on greed instead of moral responsibility.
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Old February 6, 2013, 11:44 PM   #10
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I've been thinking about this much of the day and the logical extension of this policy would be just to have a web site where people could file reports of their burglaries, assaults, rapes whatever, whenever the criminal elects to leave the scene. This could be available in several languages and be automatically filed with the other unsolved crimes.
This would permit the police to spend more time on traffic duty, which is the only place they catch criminals anyway. All of that CSI & DNA is nonsense. Think of it

Warren Jeffs arrested in routine traffic stop

Timothy McVeigh Oklahoma City bomber-caught because of driving without license plates

Ted Bundy caught because police noticed his VW was lacking a front passenger seat and there was a rape/murder kit sitting in the back seat.

If criminals only took cabs they'd never be caught, but the rest of us would spend a lot in tickets.
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Old February 7, 2013, 04:03 AM   #11
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I missed the part where they talked about all the administrative positions in city govt they cut long before they considered cutting police response. It sounded like crickets...
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Old February 7, 2013, 10:43 AM   #12
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Reduced police protection and they don't want citizens to own firearms. Interesting concept.
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Old February 7, 2013, 04:27 PM   #13
spacemanspiff
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The solution could be a lot simpler than everyone thinks...
"911, what is your emergency?"
"Just before reaching my driveway, I saw two men going into my front door that has been kicked in."

Whether you saw it or not, that little lie doesnt put the resident in any more danger.
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Old February 7, 2013, 05:20 PM   #14
sigcurious
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Whether you saw it or not, that little lie doesnt put the resident in any more danger
While that is a solution, it doesn't address the part where you would have to lie to get the police to respond to a potentially dangerous situation.
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Old February 7, 2013, 05:35 PM   #15
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While that is a solution, it doesn't address the part where you would have to lie to get the police to respond to a potentially dangerous situation.
I've read the article (and others on the topic) several times now, and I think the police will continue to respond in the situation you described (coming home to find your front door kicked in).

It seems to me that they're just saying "if you open up your garage door and find your tools stolen, or you come out of the mall to find your car has been stolen, don't call 911 - that's not an emergency.
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Old February 7, 2013, 05:55 PM   #16
sigcurious
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If you watch the video, the superintendent indicates otherwise. He indicates that they will not be responding to burglaries, and the news caster clarifies that they will respond if the suspect is still at the scene. If you don't see the intruder(s) from the outside, even if you're still on the phone with 911, do you want to be the first one in to find out if anyone is still on the scene?
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Old February 7, 2013, 07:05 PM   #17
+1k ammo
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That is just crazy. Politicians have no business running anything.

And yes, they are spot on with the traffic tickets because that is easy money. You can hardly contest them anymore and I even had a conversation with my lawyer when I had a couple due to an error and I was trying to contest. He made a few calls and pretty much said there is absolutely nothing you can do.

So the great state of Chicago is now going to be know world wide for Parking Tickets rather than anything else. Police hang out in the DD's all over but will not respond to a home robbery? Glad the CCW is almost ready because it looks like you will pretty much have to defend yourself.

Oh yea, and to support the crime work by traffic stops, today on the news a bandit who was holding up hair salons was caught up in Evanston (1st Suburb North of City) because a citizen saw a partial plate and phoned it in. Again, if he had taken a taxi he would not have gotten caught. And this was after 11!!! robberies.

Last edited by +1k ammo; February 8, 2013 at 12:20 AM.
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Old February 7, 2013, 11:00 PM   #18
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"Just before reaching my driveway, I saw two men going into my front door that has been kicked in."
In some jurisdictions, you could get cited for making a false report.

Note that several posts have been deleted for generalized Chicago bashing. While the temptation is there, let's resist such urges.
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Old February 8, 2013, 12:46 PM   #19
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There is a silver lining in all this. For years the anti-gun people have said if anything happens just dial 911. It now appears that before dialing 911 one should consult with an attorney and see if your situation meets with whatever the current 911 criteria is. If it's a garage burglary that involves the theft of a $3000 bicycle, this would appear to me to be felony theft and would warrant a call. If a bank is robbed of $3000 911 is normally called. As the structure is a garage then it may not warrant such a call.

At any rate statements such as "you don't need a gun, just call 911" now appear simply ludicrous.
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Old February 8, 2013, 04:45 PM   #20
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At the risk of getting kicked off I am going to summarize a posting I made on The Tribune Site.

It appears that the Chicago Mayor and Council are moving toward Mexico's method of policing.

There crime victims are required to pay the Police to write a report Additional fees are required to process reports. Fees are made in cash to the Cops at the time the reports are made and processed.

Fees to actually investigate a crime are negotiated with the investigators. Generally, 50% is required up front and the remainder is due when the perps are arrested. Separate arrangements are made with prosecutors.

This type of arrangement would generate a lot of revenue but I wonder about justice.
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Old February 8, 2013, 05:22 PM   #21
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Let me see if I've got this right.
You pull up to your house, the door is broken open, but you don't see or hear anyone.
You can't keep a gun on you, it's,for all practical purposes, against the law.
The Police won't come if you call.
You're an idiot if you go in unarmed to try to find out if they are still there.
If you're a member of this forum you probably even have a weapon somewhere inside, but the only way to get to it is to walk inside and possibly be at the mercy of a (probably armed) criminal.
Have I accurately summed the situation up? I'm not being sarcastic, I'm really asking, is this true?
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Old February 8, 2013, 06:07 PM   #22
godot
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I think you pretty well called it. Perhaps the best thing to do if you still have a land line would be to call from your cell and inquire if the burglars are finished and if not approximately what time could you get back into your building. Where I would draw the line on this procedure would be to inquire if the burglars needed help moving anything. You can call me a heartless conservative but I believe the burglars should succeed without any physical help from me.
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Old February 9, 2013, 01:48 PM   #23
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LE responses; non-emergency calls, 911....

The Chicago PD Superindendant had a valid point re; 911 calls for service but IMO it represents a double-standard in US law enforcement nationwide.
The Chicago police want to reduce or stop the "non emergency" calls(barking dogs, abandoned or disabled vehicles, vandalism, stolen property, etc.
These LE actions are not immediate or life threatening.
Citizens should use a local LE NON-EMERGENCY help line or file a report online.
I brought this topic up about 2 years ago on this forum & a few members were upset by it. It's not hard or complex to learn your local PD's non emergency # or what area/zone you are located in to expedite a call for service.

I do take issue with US police chiefs & sheriffs who gripe about "barking dog calls" then advise citizens to call 911 anytime they need anything.
It's a mixed message that causes problems.
False alarms & pranks(like the new "SWATing" scam) are a major LE concern too.
Citizens & property/business owners must understand that sworn LE agencies are not a private security force or required to protect individuals.

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Old February 9, 2013, 03:27 PM   #24
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Clydefrog I definitely see your point.
Yes, 911 calls have gotten out of hand.
I think they drew the line in the sand in the wrong place is all.
If this was any place that had reasonable gun laws I'd be a whole lot less inclined to critical.
If you disarm me, while saying that you will protect me, then you refuse to protect me adequately, there are words that describe you.
None of them are very nice.
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Old February 10, 2013, 10:59 PM   #25
godot
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"Citizens & property/business owners must understand that sworn LE agencies are not a private security force or required to protect individuals."

If we don't need them for protection, then what is their function on the planet? If it's just to give out parking tickets, I think we can eliminate the entire department. I've noticed that the mayor & governor have more body guards than the head of a Colombian drug ring and the department seems to carry on.
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