The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Semi-automatic Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 30, 2013, 04:52 PM   #26
michael t
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 17, 2004
Location: Out back Ky
Posts: 3,455
Some police leaving 40 and going to 45 or back to the 9mm $0 doesn't seem to be all that was hyped up to be. I will keep my 9mm's and 45's thank you

Both have been putting people in the ground or in hospitals for over 100 years Long before HP ammo.
__________________
Colt Defender ,Colt Mustang ,Dan Wesson CBOB, PPK/S, American Classic,
Bersa Thunder 380
http://bersachat.comHome of Bersa
American Classic new home www.americanclassic1911forum.com
michael t is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 05:05 PM   #27
mbrittb00
Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2013
Posts: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbrittb00
The situation that would warrent a .40 just don't happen to civilians.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skadoosh
Skadoosh wrote:

What situation/s would that be?
Shooting into cars, shooting into buildings, etc. Civilians won't need to do that.

Also, can someone tell me how to quote another post. I had to this one manually. I don't have the "quote" link at the bottom of each post like on other forums.
mbrittb00 is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 05:09 PM   #28
shootniron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 16, 2011
Posts: 1,147
I prefer the 9mm, 'cause I already have it and for my lifestyle it will work just as well as the .40...but, I like the 45acp better than anything.
shootniron is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 05:17 PM   #29
Jimboski
Member
 
Join Date: January 28, 2013
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 32
I agree which ever you shoot best with. I own a full size Beretta 96d fs its chambered for .40 s&w its' recoil feels the same and less than some 9mms I've had, and depending on the amount of grain for the rounds will/can dictate the amount of felt recoil. 9s are cheaper tho' usually...but they are both good calibers IMO. Yea I wanna go shooting now
Jimboski is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 06:15 PM   #30
propforce
Member
 
Join Date: October 9, 2011
Posts: 30
If shot placement is the only determining factor, then just get a .25ACP. As long as you can shoot the BG in the eyes, the bullet will mess around with his grey matter and he will not bother you any more.

Go with a caliber that gives you confidence and practice a lot. Oh yeah, also need to grow a pair so when you point the gun at the BG, your hands don't shake like Deputy Barney Fife.
propforce is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 06:21 PM   #31
TheDoubleDeuce
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2013
Posts: 108
IMO:

The difference in penetration between .40 and 9mm will vary more dependent on bullet type and manufacturer than it will by caliber. Neither will penetrate more than the other 100% of the time with all bullet types and manufacturers.

Is over-penetration not a concern? Were you considering loading FMJ's for personal defense in a .40 in case you have to penetrate car doors and buildings? I personally carry self defense JHP's in my CCW - Penetrating car doors and buildings is best left to the rifles.

Just because some law enforcement agencies use a caliber doesn't mean it's "optimal". Citing that some LEO's use the .40 doesn't mean much to me. I just read a thread that some Russian authorities still use Nagant 7.62x38 revolvers. Does that mean I'll consider it for my CCW? No. You pick what you shoot best. If you shoot them both the same, pick what's cheapest, you'll practice more often. The caliber debate with "stopping power" is a dead horse - there are too many variables in any situation to determine a clear "victor". You hit in a non-vital area, maybe hydraulic shock will be a factor - in which case both projectiles carry a sufficient velocity to produce it. I have posted examples of individuals surviving 20+ gunshot wounds (by law enforcement) from .45 ACP and 9mm. I came to the conclusion that the only weapon with the "stopping power" we're all looking for is the Apache gunship's 30mm cannon.

Either that, or practice enough so you can place your shots correctly. Who knows, maybe that last round you'll get from the 9mm will be the one you need to sever the spine.
TheDoubleDeuce is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 06:22 PM   #32
EMH
Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2013
Posts: 62
Shoot a man in the head or heart with a 9mm and .40 S&W and see which one he gets up from. Hint: he will die.
EMH is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 06:24 PM   #33
propforce
Member
 
Join Date: October 9, 2011
Posts: 30
If he still get up, does that make him a zombie?
propforce is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 06:25 PM   #34
TheDoubleDeuce
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2013
Posts: 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMH View Post
Shoot a man in the head or heart with a 9mm and .40 S&W and see which one he gets up from. Hint: he will die.
Yeah, but which one will make him MORE dead?? I want max capacity, max killing power, long range, comfort, low recoil, a cheap gun and cheap ammo.
TheDoubleDeuce is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 09:01 PM   #35
dstryr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2012
Location: IA
Posts: 105
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMH View Post
Shoot a man in the head or heart with a 9mm and .40 S&W and see which one he gets up from. Hint: he will die.
Yeah, but which one will make him MORE dead?? I want max capacity, max killing power, long range, comfort, low recoil, a cheap gun and cheap ammo.
lol, you don't ask for much, do you
__________________
dstryr, since 1986.

http://www.dstryr.com/
dstryr is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 09:43 PM   #36
Pico
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 5, 2002
Location: Ga
Posts: 468
Enough

There has been more than enough on this topic this time and the umpteen thousand times it has come up before. For Pete's sake man, go shoot some guns and decide for your self. Nobody can tell you what is right for you but YOU.

Sorry not trying to be rude but this caliber debate will never be settled. Thrre are so many people perching out there wanting to run this no winner one more time.

Now let's move to what has more knockdown, a Sidewinder 9 lima or Hellfire.

Pico
Pico is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 09:59 PM   #37
Pico
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 5, 2002
Location: Ga
Posts: 468
OK do this

Buy a Glock 22, 23, or 27. Shoot it. If it is too much for you (IT WON'T BE) get an LWD conversion barrel and shoot 9 mm.

Meanwhile, someone tell me if I should go with the Bushmaster cannon or upgrade to a Phalanx r2d2 for my home defense weapon?

Lord, I apologize.

Pico
Pico is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 10:31 PM   #38
zincwarrior
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 1, 2011
Location: Texas, land of Tex-Mex
Posts: 1,208
Quote:
What if I shoot both equally well?
Statistically it doesn't matter. Unless you're shooting them with an RPG, odds are you're going to need multiple shots to stop the aggressor.
zincwarrior is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 11:44 PM   #39
Nanuk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 2, 2005
Location: Where the deer and the antelope roam.
Posts: 1,690
Neither.

http://www.underwoodammo.com/357sig1...ntboxof50.aspx
__________________
My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.
Nanuk is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 11:54 PM   #40
Ambishot
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 29, 2011
Location: US
Posts: 274
Not every, or even the largest police forces opt for .40 s&w over 9mm for caliber. Take for instance the NYPD that issues 9mm.

I tend to be skeptical with the "greater stopping power" of the .40 s&w over a 9mm. Considering the quality of ammunition being produced these days in 9mm, the marginal performance increase of the .40 is a negligible value IMO to the additional magazine capacity you get with a 9mm.

But whatever caliber you settle on, shot placement is key. A .22lr in the right place is more deadly than a 9mm, .40, .45 acp, or .44 mag in a glancing shot.
Ambishot is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 12:19 AM   #41
mbrittb00
Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2013
Posts: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pico
There has been more than enough on this topic this time and the umpteen thousand times it has come up before. For Pete's sake man, go shoot some guns and decide for your self. Nobody can tell you what is right for you but YOU.
I understand that this has been debated over and over again, and it will never be fully settled, but you have missed my point. It isn't about what is "right" for me. The question is does the 9mm (with the new modern rounds) perform well enough to stop an assailant, and I think the answer is yes. Especially when you consider higher accuracy from the follow up shots (due to less recoil) and more capacity.
mbrittb00 is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 12:20 AM   #42
mbrittb00
Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2013
Posts: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by zincwarrior
Statistically it doesn't matter. Unless you're shooting them with an RPG, odds are you're going to need multiple shots to stop the aggressor.
So then more shots would be better (i.e. the 9mm)
mbrittb00 is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 12:22 AM   #43
mbrittb00
Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2013
Posts: 32
I'm a little confused as to what your point is here.
mbrittb00 is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 12:58 AM   #44
Ambishot
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 29, 2011
Location: US
Posts: 274
The .357 sig...

This caliber gives you the magazine capacity of a .40, with the ballistic performance within the realm of some .38 super loads. Personally, I think the capacity alone on the .357 sig is discouraging enough.

But that's just me.

Here's a comparison of 9mm, .38 super, and .357sig for reference.

http://38super.net/Pages/comparisons.html
Ambishot is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 01:44 AM   #45
flgunguy
Member
 
Join Date: August 14, 2012
Posts: 33
i own both but carry neither. i carry .45

i find the recoil, particularly the short snappy recoil in subcompact .40s, to be an annoyance. its a hard snap back of the wrist. meanwhile i can shoot a .45 sub the same size and the pushy recoil of a .45 is hardly felt.
flgunguy is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 04:54 AM   #46
RadioFlyer8
Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2012
Posts: 34
I carry a 9mm. I'll take as many rounds per mag as I can since no pistol caliber has any sort of real stopping power.
RadioFlyer8 is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 05:21 AM   #47
Pico
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 5, 2002
Location: Ga
Posts: 468
Missed point

Don't miss my point. The potential lethality of one pistol caliber versus another is irrelevant if you can't hit what you aim. Being able to shoot and hit the gun in the first place outweighs the ballistic superiority of one caliber over another. You can only determine if you are effective by actually shooting it.

Buy the Glock .40 then you can take it down to a 9 mm with a conversion barrel if .40 is too much for you. Or else you will be here debating this until the mods close the thread.

Pico
Pico is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 06:48 AM   #48
AK103K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2001
Location: PA -- In the shadow of the Shade
Posts: 7,864
Quote:
Take for instance the NYPD that issues 9mm.
Which is probably the best and strongest case for 7 round mags in NY.
__________________
“The enemy is anybody who's going to get you killed, no matter which side he is on.”
― Joseph Heller, Catch-22

Zeitgeist - The Movie
AK103K is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 07:27 AM   #49
foxytwo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 24, 2010
Posts: 183
I have a 9mm and a 40cal and I can shoot both equally well. Most of the comments stated above are right on the money. Get the caliber you want or you could get one of each, like a lot of people.
foxytwo is offline  
Old January 31, 2013, 07:52 AM   #50
CDW4ME
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 18, 2009
Posts: 615
Any advancements to a 9mm HP would also apply to a 40
9mm typically recoils less and holds a round or two more
40 hits harder and makes a bigger entry hole
I feel more comfortable with a 40 than a 9mm
__________________
No internal lock or magazine disconnect on my pistols!
CDW4ME is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.16115 seconds with 8 queries