The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old February 3, 2013, 04:46 AM   #51
Hook686
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2005
Location: USA The Great State of California
Posts: 1,899
Personally I find DA, either autoloader, or revolver, a whole lot safer than SA autoloaders. I have seen numerous LEOs have an accidental discharge during three gun matches at my club. Although the discharge could be called a 'Double tap' by some, I have seen the dirt behind the target kick up and I doubt ther shooter was pleased at the need to do an extra reload.

Different strokes for different folks. There are enough choices to please just about everybody. I personally like DA revolvers. I have a S&W 3913 which is DA on the first shot. This is not my first choice, but I do use it as a backup.

It may take a little more practice, but then this is not for Bullseye competition. At bad breath distances DA can easily find all shots in the black.

Practice with what you prefer.
__________________
Hook686

When the number of people in institutions reaches 51%, we change sides.
Hook686 is offline  
Old February 3, 2013, 07:55 AM   #52
wpsdlrg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 18, 2009
Posts: 448
In my view, it is not about the specific trigger design. It's about training.....and what one becomes accustomed to, period. A lousy quality trigger is a lousy quality trigger. But, that is NOT dictated by whether it is DAO, or SAO, or DA/SA.

As for me, I shoot my DAO just as well as any other design - as long as I am "in the groove" with it. By that, I mean, as long as I have not skipped a few weeks of shooting with it. If I stay current and shoot DAO a lot, then no problem. The same mostly holds true with my DA/SA pistols - if I stay current, then no problem - if not, then I get "rusty".

One difficulty I do have however, is in switching back and forth between DAO and DA/SA. That DOES give me problems, at least until I get "back in the groove". I haven't quite figured out a solution for that, though. The obvious solution is to specialize - go exclusively with one design or another. In future, I probably will do that, as I think I have too many pistols now (and spreading myself between them is affecting my training). But, I haven't decided which way to jump. It could be either DAO or DA/SA.
wpsdlrg is offline  
Old February 3, 2013, 08:11 AM   #53
Sarge
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 12, 2002
Location: MO
Posts: 4,886
The best you can do with these guns is to grip them firmly, block the sights on target and pull the trigger straight back in one smooth, fast motion.
__________________
Visit us at The Sixgun Journal or the archive, at http://sargesrollcall.blogspot.com/
Sarge is offline  
Old February 3, 2013, 08:16 AM   #54
wpsdlrg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 18, 2009
Posts: 448
"The best you can do with these guns is to grip them firmly, block the sights on target and pull the trigger straight back in one smooth, fast motion."


And that usually gets the job done. That "smooth, fast motion" is the KEY to shooting DAO well. Well put, Sarge.
wpsdlrg is offline  
Old February 3, 2013, 09:39 AM   #55
bonefamily
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2012
Location: central Ohio
Posts: 304
Thanks for the replies and tips. I find that when I move the trigger faster is when I pull more. I know I need much practice with them (DAO), but I find myself to be more accurate with a slower moving pull. Of course this does not help much in SD situation, but I need to lerarn to walk before I can run with that DAO trigger, right?
__________________
Bryan
bonefamily is offline  
Old February 4, 2013, 08:14 AM   #56
MrBorland
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 31, 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 1,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by bonefamily
I find that when I move the trigger faster is when I pull more.
Here's a tip: Dry fire to a metronome. If you don't have one, use the link below. A metronome sets a tempo you can follow, so you can pull smoothly without yanking. Don't set too high a tempo, lest you practice yanking. Set one that you can smoothly pull, then increase the tempo bit by bit (wouldn't that be beat by beat? ). Once you've improved your pull, incorporate keeping a good sight picture through the pull. Again, though, only go as fast as you can see.

http://www.metronomeonline.com/
MrBorland is online now  
Old February 4, 2013, 02:29 PM   #57
bonefamily
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2012
Location: central Ohio
Posts: 304
That sounds like a good tip and practice, MrBorland - thanks. Being a musician for more than 30 years, I do indeed own a few metronomes

What tempo do you recommend starting with?
__________________
Bryan
bonefamily is offline  
Old February 4, 2013, 03:32 PM   #58
MrBorland
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 31, 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 1,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by bonefamily
Being a musician for more than 30 years, I do indeed own a few metronomes
Excellent!

Think of your trigger as a musical instrument, and dry firing to a metronome will likely be very helpful. Imagine a new student playing a simple scale while keeping a very irregular rhythm. Their teacher would likely pull their hair out, then get them to keep constant - going up and coming down. So it is with a DAO trigger - constant pull to the end, same constant return to the end, with smooth non-breaking transitions between.

Try starting off at 50bpm. At first, just hold the pistol with 2 hands at chest level while doing your "scales". Just to get a feel for a smooth even tempo. There's absolutely no rush here. If it takes 5 minutes, great. If it takes a week, no worries. At some point when you feel ready, go to 60bpm, then 70 & 80. At some point, start aiming the pistol, too: Get a good sight picture and watch the front sight while doing your scales. You may have to go back down at this point if you notice your front sight dancing around.

BTW, I've never seen a metronome recommended before - it's something I came up with while doing some of my own dry firing, so you won't likely find much about it by Googling. Nonetheless, it's helped me a bunch.
MrBorland is online now  
Old February 4, 2013, 03:42 PM   #59
peacefulgary
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 524
I hate a heavy trigger pull.
Heavy trigger pulls were created only as a safety measure, not as an enhancement to more accurate shooting.
This why heavy triggers are not typically found on rifles.

I think a better safety measure is to keep your finger off the trigger till the target is in your sights and you are prepared to shoot.
peacefulgary is offline  
Old February 4, 2013, 03:54 PM   #60
redhologram
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 14, 2013
Posts: 229
Your metronome idea is good. It's the whole rhythm concept in your head. I don't use a metronome but I do go through sort of a standard check list in my head as I'm drawing and setting up to get my shot off. It runs quickly through my head as I am doing it but to a specific rhythm that I almost keep a beat too.
It keeps me focused and where I don't stop and dwell on any particular thing.
redhologram is offline  
Old February 4, 2013, 05:00 PM   #61
bonefamily
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2012
Location: central Ohio
Posts: 304
Wonderful - that is a great analogy and one that I can comprehend to. I will surely give this a workout.

Come to thing of it, the second to last range visit I remember using a rhythm pattern while shooting. I wasn't counting in any means, but I was using the echo of the shot to begin my next shot - you know, boom echo, reset, boom, echo reset, etc., and going with the groove. It was late in the session and just about dusk and things just started to groove. Though I know my accuracy did not getting better, the way I received felt recoil did. I was able to get back to the sight picture in a moreso mechanical way using the rhythm of the sounds.

I will try the mentronome for dry fire sessions, thanks.
__________________
Bryan
bonefamily is offline  
Old February 4, 2013, 05:59 PM   #62
MrBorland
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 31, 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 1,780
Just a point of clarification:

The metronome is to help you develop a naturally smooth DA trigger pull. When actually shooting, though, your sight picture, rather than any rhythm, must dictate the shot. Get a good sight picture before mentally committing to the shot - once committed, your pull will be smooth, so your sight picture won't be too affected. But without that sight picture, a true shot isn't a given. Take a looksee at my vid below as an example - good trigger control, but with no sight picture, only the Good Lord knows where those shots would've landed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmy5mkjpUNI
MrBorland is online now  
Old February 4, 2013, 06:48 PM   #63
bonefamily
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2012
Location: central Ohio
Posts: 304
Thanks, MrBorland - well understood.
__________________
Bryan
bonefamily is offline  
Old February 15, 2013, 03:26 AM   #64
ClydeFrog
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2010
Posts: 5,798
Get better guns!...

Why do so many members buy cheap guns then complain when they let them down?....

Save up & get a better brand; Ruger, Walther, Beretta, S&W, HK, Glock, Colt, S-A, etc.

Clyde
ClydeFrog is offline  
Old February 15, 2013, 02:36 PM   #65
bonefamily
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2012
Location: central Ohio
Posts: 304
I don't think it's a brand thing, more of a learning to control the DAO trigger. Higher $$ weapons still have DAO triggers that I would also need to master them as well.
__________________
Bryan
bonefamily is offline  
Old February 16, 2013, 02:14 AM   #66
slicknickns
Member
 
Join Date: September 14, 2012
Location: Orange County, CA.
Posts: 23
There's nothin' like a hammerless snub nose
slicknickns is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09722 seconds with 7 queries