Jonathan Ciener

flybuddy · January 27, 2013, 04:35 PM

Has anyone bought from him in the past several months? I'm aware of all of the past issues but was wondering if he got his act together afterwards. Looking for a Taurus PT92 22 conversion. thx

Don P · January 27, 2013, 07:43 PM

Hopefully he is still in jail

Edited for graphic language - GEM

Fishing_Cabin · January 27, 2013, 08:05 PM

Don P,

The charges against Ceiner were droped back in Feb 2012.

http://news.brevardtimes.com/2012/02...veral-gun.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrevardTimes.com

The Brevard County State Attorney's Office has dropped a felony charge this week against gun conversion manufacturer Jonathan A. Ciener.

OP,

I dont know if the service Ceiner provides is better now or not. My advice would be to order through an intermediary, such as MidwayUSA, or similar, and if there is a problem, let them deal with Ceiner.

Ridge_Runner_5 · January 27, 2013, 08:24 PM

Ciener is a scam artist. Buy whatever you need from a company that you can trust.

flybuddy · January 27, 2013, 08:58 PM

Thx for the responses...Couple of things..NOBODY carries his stuff anymore and, unfortunately for a 22 conversion for the Taurus--he's the only one making them.

Rembrandt · January 27, 2013, 09:00 PM

I've got a couple of Ciener units and very pleased with them. You might want to buy one "indirect"......such as from Brownells.

Aguila Blanca · January 27, 2013, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flybuddy

Thx for the responses...Couple of things..NOBODY carries his stuff anymore and, unfortunately for a 22 conversion for the Taurus--he's the only one making them.

For which Taurus?

If you're referring to the Taurus 1911 ... a 1911 is a 1911 and all the available conversions will work on any in-spec 1911 receiver.

Aguila Blanca · January 27, 2013, 10:03 PM

Brownells dropped Ciener several years ago. Midway stopped offering his kits a few months or a year later.

The guy had a good product, but he (figuratively) shot himself in the foot by engaging in low-life business practices. At this point he's a pariah in the industry. Nobody will touch him or his products. If he's selling anything at all, it's to newbies who don't research the company before buying.

Yung.gunr · January 27, 2013, 11:59 PM

I wonder if there is anyway to mend his reputation.... I've heard more bad stuff about him than any other single person in the industry.

Why aren't there other companies out there making these conversions? CMMG makes one for the AR right, why not branch out. Is there something on the actual machining/manufacturing end that makes it not worth it for them? Does he hold a patent on the conversion thing?

Aguila Blanca · January 28, 2013, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yung.gunr

Why aren't there other companies out there making these conversions?

I've lost count of how many companies offer .22LR conversions for the 1911, and it seems more jump on the band wagon every month.

Ridge_Runner_5 · January 28, 2013, 12:47 AM

Quote:

I've heard more bad stuff about him than any other single person in the industry.

Dick Swan isn't far behind, IMO.

Yung.gunr · January 28, 2013, 01:16 AM

Hmmm... Guess I'm out of the loop.

Double Naught Spy · January 28, 2013, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Thx for the responses...Couple of things..NOBODY carries his stuff anymore and, unfortunately for a 22 conversion for the Taurus--he's the only one making them.

Just realize that what you buy is like buying something that will be effectively "AS IS" and to not expect to be able to get it serviced or repaired by Ciener (not that anyone else has parts) without extreme hassles. So if your conversion has problems, you are stuck with it.

So Taurus no longer makes their own conversion kits?
http://www.armslist.com/posts/896941...or-pt92-99-100

Even if used, I think I would be more inclined to buy a used Taurus conversion that I could send back to the factory than a Ciener.

Hal · January 28, 2013, 09:13 AM

Quote:

So Taurus no longer makes their own conversion kits?

I wonder if they ever did?

That one in the link is a dead ringer for my Ciener 1911 conversion.
I wonder if Ciener made them for Taurus?

Skans · January 28, 2013, 10:23 AM

I was thinking of buying a .22 kit for my AC556. After reading all the problems with Ciener, I passed. What do I need a headache for just to get a new toy for my toy.

flybuddy · January 28, 2013, 01:10 PM

Taurus doesn't make those conversion kits for the PT92, I don't know that they ever did. That ad was the first and only one I've ever seen and it's not in their catalog currently or any of the older ones I've seen.

flybuddy · February 18, 2013, 10:06 PM

Just an FYI--I took a risk and DID order from Ciener for my PT92. I received the 22lr conversion kit today, 3 weeks later. I had sent a personal check which is supposed to take longer.
I took it to the range right out of the box and it worked VERY well. I tried 4 different types of ammo and it consistently fired all of them, round nose, hollows, 36 and 40 grain high Vs. I did have 3 FTFs on feed issues. In hindsight, one of the mags was sticking (noticed that when I cleaned and lubed after). Even with that 3 out of 150 fired isn't bad.
I recently had an Advantage Arms kit for my Glock. AA worked fairly well on high end CCI but wasn't worth a damn on just about anything else. In this day and age of taking whatever you can find in 22lr, the Ciener kit wins hands down.
Just FYI Action Gun and Archery in Melbourne has some of these kits in stock also.

Aguila Blanca · February 18, 2013, 10:55 PM

For the record, I have a Ciener conversion for the 1911. I said above that he has (or had) a good product, and I know that from personal experience. I've had mine for several years and it has never missed a beat. But even when I ordered mine I had heard stories about Ciener's lack of "customer skills," so I ordered mine from Brownells (that's how long ago I bought it) and paid more for it that way than I would have direct from Ciener. But ... I felt comfortable that Brownells would take care of me if there were problems.

There were no problems.

But, since both Brownells and Midway have stopped carrying his products, I would not order one today.

Here's mine:

g.willikers · February 19, 2013, 10:57 AM

Or just get a Ruger 22-45.
Not exactly the same, but close enough.
Tactical Solutions and Marvel kits have good reputations, though.

flybuddy · February 19, 2013, 11:34 AM

They're cheap, no reason you can't do both...I've got a Ruger SR22 also.

spacecoast · February 19, 2013, 11:43 AM

... or a GSG 1911-22. I have one and it's very handy. I especially like the threaded barrel.

January 27, 2013, 04:35 PM	#1
flybuddy Member Join Date: January 25, 2013 Posts: 22	Jonathan Ciener Has anyone bought from him in the past several months? I'm aware of all of the past issues but was wondering if he got his act together afterwards. Looking for a Taurus PT92 22 conversion. thx

January 27, 2013, 07:43 PM	#2
Don P Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2005 Location: East Central Florida Posts: 4,406	Hopefully he is still in jail Edited for graphic language - GEM __________________ *NRA Life Member, NRA Range Safety Officer, IDPA Safety Officer* *As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be.* Last edited by Glenn E. Meyer; January 27, 2013 at 08:11 PM.

February 19, 2013, 10:57 AM	#19
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 2,513	Or just get a Ruger 22-45. Not exactly the same, but close enough. Tactical Solutions and Marvel kits have good reputations, though. __________________ Lock the doors, they're coming in the windows.

February 19, 2013, 11:43 AM	#21
spacecoast Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2009 Location: Sunshine and Keystone States Posts: 3,391	... or a GSG 1911-22. I have one and it's very handy. I especially like the threaded barrel. __________________ My guns include S&W and Colt revolvers, Colt and Ruger pistols, Remington 870 shotgun, Henry and Marlin .22LR rifles, Hi-Point 9mm carbine and Lancaster Arms AK. I reload handgun rounds with a Lee hand press, over 18K rounds since Nov. 2009 with nary a squib nor kaboom.

January 27, 2013, 08:24 PM	#4
Ridge_Runner_5 Senior Member Join Date: February 8, 2008 Location: Castle Rock, CO Posts: 1,741	Ciener is a scam artist. Buy whatever you need from a company that you can trust.

January 27, 2013, 08:58 PM	#5
flybuddy Member Join Date: January 25, 2013 Posts: 22	Thx for the responses...Couple of things..NOBODY carries his stuff anymore and, unfortunately for a 22 conversion for the Taurus--he's the only one making them.

January 27, 2013, 09:00 PM	#6
Rembrandt Senior Member Join Date: August 10, 2002 Posts: 1,794	I've got a couple of Ciener units and very pleased with them. You might want to buy one "indirect"......such as from Brownells.

January 27, 2013, 10:03 PM	#8
Aguila Blanca Senior Member Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 4,815	Brownells dropped Ciener several years ago. Midway stopped offering his kits a few months or a year later. The guy had a good product, but he (figuratively) shot himself in the foot by engaging in low-life business practices. At this point he's a pariah in the industry. Nobody will touch him or his products. If he's selling anything at all, it's to newbies who don't research the company before buying.

January 27, 2013, 11:59 PM	#9
Yung.gunr Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2010 Location: Phoenix area Posts: 1,181	I wonder if there is anyway to mend his reputation.... I've heard more bad stuff about him than any other single person in the industry. Why aren't there other companies out there making these conversions? CMMG makes one for the AR right, why not branch out. Is there something on the actual machining/manufacturing end that makes it not worth it for them? Does he hold a patent on the conversion thing?

January 28, 2013, 01:16 AM	#12
Yung.gunr Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2010 Location: Phoenix area Posts: 1,181	Hmmm... Guess I'm out of the loop.

January 28, 2013, 10:23 AM	#15
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 6,243	I was thinking of buying a .22 kit for my AC556. After reading all the problems with Ciener, I passed. What do I need a headache for just to get a new toy for my toy.

January 28, 2013, 01:10 PM	#16
flybuddy Member Join Date: January 25, 2013 Posts: 22	Taurus doesn't make those conversion kits for the PT92, I don't know that they ever did. That ad was the first and only one I've ever seen and it's not in their catalog currently or any of the older ones I've seen.

February 18, 2013, 10:06 PM	#17
flybuddy Member Join Date: January 25, 2013 Posts: 22	Just an FYI--I took a risk and DID order from Ciener for my PT92. I received the 22lr conversion kit today, 3 weeks later. I had sent a personal check which is supposed to take longer. I took it to the range right out of the box and it worked VERY well. I tried 4 different types of ammo and it consistently fired all of them, round nose, hollows, 36 and 40 grain high Vs. I did have 3 FTFs on feed issues. In hindsight, one of the mags was sticking (noticed that when I cleaned and lubed after). Even with that 3 out of 150 fired isn't bad. I recently had an Advantage Arms kit for my Glock. AA worked fairly well on high end CCI but wasn't worth a damn on just about anything else. In this day and age of taking whatever you can find in 22lr, the Ciener kit wins hands down. Just FYI Action Gun and Archery in Melbourne has some of these kits in stock also.

February 18, 2013, 10:55 PM	#18
Aguila Blanca Senior Member Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 4,815	For the record, I have a Ciener conversion for the 1911. I said above that he has (or had) a good product, and I know that from personal experience. I've had mine for several years and it has never missed a beat. But even when I ordered mine I had heard stories about Ciener's lack of "customer skills," so I ordered mine from Brownells (that's how long ago I bought it) and paid more for it that way than I would have direct from Ciener. But ... I felt comfortable that Brownells would take care of me if there were problems. There were no problems. But, since both Brownells and Midway have stopped carrying his products, I would not order one today. Here's mine:

February 19, 2013, 11:34 AM	#20
flybuddy Member Join Date: January 25, 2013 Posts: 22	They're cheap, no reason you can't do both...I've got a Ruger SR22 also.