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Old January 24, 2013, 12:53 PM   #1
1912
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Questions from the unexperienced. Stoeger 8000 ammo, etc.

I have never owned a handgun before. However, like an unquantifiable mass of other American's, I decided January was the time to change that. After (perhaps too much) deliberate research, i settled on the CZ 75B (9mm) as the right choice for me, only to be unable to find one. I therefore settled upon my back up, which was available locally to me. I now own a Stoeger Cougar 8000 which is safely locked away. For what it is worth, my understanding is this is a newer model, with the accessory rail.

Unfortunately, my schedule dictates that I will not be able to attend a class for a couple months. However, I did not want to miss an opportunity to find a suitable firearm. I will be taking classes required to safely handle and use this pistol, and will very likely get my CCW as well.

It occured to me I should probably look in to acquiring ammunition as well. For those who are experienced with this pistol, can you please provide suggestions on: 1) Inexpensive and generally available target ammunition that I would buy in quantity, 2) Home defense ammunition suitable for this gun which would be purchased in low quantity. If I am being frank, cost and ease/reliability of shooting are far more important than "performance" in both cases.

Finally, given that I have some time prior to taking advantage of a handgun safety class, is there anything else I should do in the interim? For example, I have viewed several videos demonstrating a field strip of the Cougar 8000. Is there any advantage to me doing this a few times prior to a course? I am not familiar with pistol cleaning, should I again simply wait before doing this for the first time? Although hard for me to quantify, it does seem the Stoeger has a fair amount of oil on it from the factory. I am not sure just how lubricated a pistol liek this should be, how diffucult the slide should be, etc.

Thanks for your understanding and for any assistance you can provide.
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Old January 24, 2013, 03:07 PM   #2
Bart Noir
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Quote:
It occured to me I should probably look in to acquiring ammunition as well
You, Sir or Madam, are a master of the understatement

Welcome to TFL and welcome to the world of responsible handgun owners and users.

Since you are living in the good ol' US of A, you can usually find cheap Full Metal Jacket (FMJ) 9mm rounds at WalMart, in 100-round boxes. These are Winchester white-box packages and you need to go back to the counter in the sporting goods section to ask for them.

You can also usually find FMJ 115 or 124-grain rounds at Cabela's or other big sporting goods stores. These may be in 50-round boxes and there are many brands.

You can usually buy ammo in a gun shop. Or at a gun show.

I say "usually" because panic buying and ammo hoarding has cleared out many stores, at least temporarily. For instance, a couple of weeks past I was in a Cabela's near Olympia, WA, and they had zero 9mm FMJ rounds and not a single .22 Long Rifle cartridge. That last part was a shock to me. "Is the world ending?"

Until federal legislation blocks it (assuming your locality currently allows it), you can order ammo online. Try CDNN or Sportsmans Guide or Midway or Natchez. You pay some charges for the shipping, which may balance out not paying your state sales tax (if you have one).

I suggest owning at least 3 magazines for your Cougar. But have fun buying any more in today's outrageous panic buying world. CDNN normally has lots of many mag's but today, who knows? In fact, all those places I mentioned for ammo will sell mag's in normal times.

It is a fine gun and the older used pre-Stoeger magazines will work, meaning those that were made in Italy and marked Beretta. Once a Cougar, always a Cougar. Since my university mascot was Butch the Cougar, with a real live cougar back then, I'm surprised I haven't collected many more Cougar versions.

Did you mean that you are required to pass a class prior to actually shooting your new pistol? Where do you live?

I'll let others answer you about self-defense ammo. The short answer is: hollowpoints made by American companies, to include some smaller ones like Doubletap, are the way to go. And I would and do shoot 9mm +P ammo in my Cougar. But not +P+ since there is no way to tell how powerful that ammo is, since there is no industry standard for +P+.

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Old January 24, 2013, 04:07 PM   #3
1912
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Thanks for the reply Bart.

My comment on the ammunition was meant to imply I' d likely be buying ammo long before I need it.

My state does not require a class, I simply find it the most prudent course of action and I will not have much of a chance to be shooting prior to class in any case.

Lastly, Bart can I assume you have a Cougar and have had no issues with Winchester FMJ in 115 grain?
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Old January 24, 2013, 04:36 PM   #4
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I owned a Stoeger Cougar 8000 for a while. It is a great gun and very accurate. Mine would feed any ammo reliably and never failed to fire. I only sold it to buy another Glock.

See, once you drink the Glock Kool-aid you are forever addicted.
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Old January 24, 2013, 04:47 PM   #5
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I have not had bad luck with any of the FMJ, 115 gr ammo that I have used. I've used the Winchester white box, and Magtech, but mostly Sellior & Bellot. I usually buy online, but my usual sources (Natchez, Cheaper Than Dirt, Midway, etc...) are all sold out. It's a bad time to be looking for 9mm.

Use the owners manual and give the gun a good cleaning before use. Apply a light coat of lubricant to the rails and other parts that move.

I do own the 9mm and .45 versions of the Stoeger Cougar. Never had any problems with mine. THey are great guns for the money.
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Old January 24, 2013, 04:53 PM   #6
Mr_Jumper
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I don't own Cougar 8000 but have PX4 which is similar in design. From what I hear about Cougar and definitely experience from PX4, it should have no problem with much of bulk FMJ ammo.

Winchester White box is good choice as well as Federal bulk packs which can be found in most Walmarts. Stay away from steel case ammos and stick with brass case.

As for field stripping and cleaning the gun, practice if you can find the time. It's definitely a good idea to give thorough cleaning prior to shooting it for the first time.

Youtube is your friend when it comes to examples of field stripping just about any gun out there, manual should have good pointers on what parts to lube. Using my gun as an example, which like I said is similar in design to your Cougar, I would lube each slide rails and locking rail on barrel as well as corresponding locking nut that meets the rail (which is all recommended by manual for PX4).

For general handgun cleaning tips, there are plenty of good examples of that in Youtube as well.

Safe shooting, and enjoy your new gun.
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Old January 25, 2013, 09:32 AM   #7
1912
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Thank you all for the replies. A few follow-ups if you are still inclined:

Quote:
Originally Posted by wbw
Use the owners manual and give the gun a good cleaning before use. Apply a light coat of lubricant to the rails and other parts that move.
I've scanned the manual, and will of course read it in detail. I have also watched a couple Cougar 8000 youtube videos of field stripping and will eatch a few more. Is rem oil suitable for cleaning and lubricating or is there something more specific I should use?


Quote:
Originally Posted by wbw
I do own the 9mm and .45 versions of the Stoeger Cougar. Never had any problems with mine. THey are great guns for the money.
Since you are qualified to answer, how does the recoil of thee two calibers compare?

Last edited by 1912; January 25, 2013 at 09:47 AM.
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Old January 25, 2013, 01:01 PM   #8
TheNocturnus
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As far as cleaning goes, clean it after every range trip. I just use a good brass brush and elbow grease to clean my pistols and they clean up real nice. I have yet to use any solvent because I don't let any gunk build up.

As far as oil, I use hoppes #9 and it works great.
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Old January 25, 2013, 02:00 PM   #9
fast20
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the stoeger is one of my best shooting guns... ive used federal and brazer brass for 115 g for target.... no problems at all... but my first mag in all my guns are home defense loads... except my carry guns... all mags have home defense loads
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Old January 25, 2013, 04:45 PM   #10
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I use Hoppe's #9 for cleaning. It's more of a solvent. Rem Oil would be OK for lube. Sometimes I use a synthetic grease because of it's ability to work well in extreme temperatures. Sometimes I apply some 10W-40 motor oil with a Q-Tip.

As far as the recoil of the 8000 vs the 8045, the .45 has a more stout recoil. I think it always will no matter the pistol when compared to 9mm. As a matter of fact, if I take to the range my .45 Cougar and any other 9mm pistol, I always shoot the .45 first. Then when switching to 9mm, the 9mm always feels like shooting a .22. It's a noticeable difference. I don't mind the .45 recoil, it's just more powerful than a 9mm. If you're wavering between the two, I'd go with 9mm because it's cheaper and it's no sloutch for personal defense either.

Edited to add: I forgot that you already have the pistol. I lost track.

Last edited by wbw; January 25, 2013 at 06:10 PM.
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Old January 25, 2013, 05:03 PM   #11
TheNocturnus
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There are different types of Hoppe's #9 FYI.
This is the oil I was referring to.

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Old January 25, 2013, 05:09 PM   #12
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You are correct sir. For some reason I was thinking that #9 was just a solvent. So there is a #9 oil and a #9 solvent. So anyway, I use the #9 solvent to clean and then something else to lubricate.
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Old January 25, 2013, 06:06 PM   #13
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I own the Stoeger Cougar 8000L model (which is simply a "compact" version of the OP's pistol....same barrel length, etc., but a shorter grip with 13 round mags, rather than 15 in the standard model). Great pistol - my favorite to be sure. Eats any ammo I feed it with ZERO problems. I've put about 1100 rounds through mine, with NO failures. The Stoeger is an excellent pistol, basically just as well made as the original Beretta- produced model (which was identical)....but available at a much better price.

One thing, someone mentioned magazines as if the Stoeger mags are in some way different from original Beretta mags. Not so. In fact, Beretta supplies Stoeger with the mags for the 8000 series pistols (Stoeger does not make their own)....so the Stoeger mags ARE the original Beretta mags, made in Italy. So, any original Beretta 8000 mags will work in the Stoeger pistol.

As for ammo choices, I hand load most of my ammo. But, of the purchased ammo I have used, I am very partial to Fiocchi and Sellier & Bellot. I use their 115 grain round nose FMJ.....fine practice ammo. For SD ammo, most any 124 grain hollow point ammo will do, but, I have had good results with Hornady XTP.
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Old January 26, 2013, 12:04 AM   #14
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Again, thanks all for the replies.
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