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Old January 24, 2013, 09:33 PM   #1
chris in va
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A message for gun owners.

I'll make this short and to the point.

When you are not in direct control or observation of your firearms, to the best of your means and financial abilities PLEASE keep your firearms locked and secured.

I've given this a lot of thought. A high percentage of these 'mass shootings' happen because guns are stolen and obtained from lawful gun owners that didn't keep them secured from unauthorized users. The recent NM shooting is one example.

We need to step up and realize these aren't just monetary 'theft losses', but powerful tools that can be used to commit horrible crimes.

Banning firearms isn't the answer, we know that. If we treated our gun's security the same as our gold, silver and expensive cars, many of these tragic news stories would be staved off.

Thank you, hopefully it won't step on too many toes.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:14 PM   #2
coachteet
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While I understand the sentiment, I have a bit of a problem with this. I keep most of my firearms locked in a gun safe. However, I keep some "in service" in my home. I consider all of them "locked up", in the sense that I keep my home locked at all times. If someone breaks into my home, steals my guns and commits crimes with them, I have zero liability. I think that's reasonable.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:19 PM   #3
weaponeer1911
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My firearms are secured in my house ....

... If someone breaks in and steals them it is on them, not me. Proximate cause.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:42 PM   #4
testuser
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I've been thinking about this one, too.

If a weapon isn't on my person or I'm not at home, then it's locked up in a gun safe bolt to the floor. A couple of reasons for that, guns are valuable, of course, but more importantly, if someone breaks into my house and finds a loaded gun, now they're armed. I don't want to be shot with my own weapon.

If you can't afford a safe, then at least unload it and separate the weapon from the ammo. A lot of these shooters have been too young to even purchase ammunition...like that 16 year old in CA a couple of weeks ago.

I've even heard of some removing the barrel, slide, magazine, etc., and taking that with them, too.

As far as quick accessibility, there are a lot of fast unlocking devices out there that are reasonably secure. Not something that should be legislated, but I'm encouraging it.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:42 PM   #5
weaponeer1911
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It's just not practical ...

Quote:
Lock them up when not in use.
I have up to a half a dozen loaded firearms scattered around my house all the time. It is not practical to gather them all up and lock them in the safe everytime I leave the house. A person breaking in and stealing them is the criminal.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:46 PM   #6
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My guns are on my person or in my safe always. My safe is well hidden in my house as well. Muahahaha!
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Old January 24, 2013, 11:40 PM   #7
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weaponeer1911
I have up to a half a dozen loaded firearms scattered around my house all the time....
We also have several (not quite half a dozen) -- but they're secured in various lock boxes we have around the house.

The lock boxes have touch pad combinations that can be operated without looking; all are set to the same combination; all are hidden, bolted down, but readily accessible; and all contain a loaded gun, extra ammunition and a Surefire flashlight.

So our loaded guns are both readily available to my wife and me as well as being secure at all time from unauthorized access.
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Old January 24, 2013, 11:43 PM   #8
Tom Servo
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Quote:
A person breaking in and stealing them is the criminal.
And after doing so, he's an armed criminal. This is why I take exception to so many folks leaving guns in their cars.
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Old January 25, 2013, 12:02 AM   #9
sirdiealot
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i am so glad i live where i live....half the time my keys are left in my vehicle....heck the neighbor or someone may need to borrow it when im not around so leave the keys in truck.....house is very seldom locked once again neighbors may need something or once water line broke in kitchen and water was pouring out onto the porch neighbor went in and turned of water to said facet....glad i dont have to worry bout such things...if someone came into my house that my neighbors didnt know or were skulking around house actions would be take by neighbors..they are retired farmers who i know would pull out the old 3030 and stop any bad guy doing bad things
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Old January 25, 2013, 12:48 AM   #10
JimmyR
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Slight side note

Not trying to thread-jack, I promise this is related to the OP's post-

What do you guys think about some of the non-locking gun hiding places (diversion clocks, books, etc.)? I have not seen one that locks, but have considered getting one to keep a weapon concealed in my living room either as a BUG or a gun for my fiance (who does not carry, but is very capable of using a handgun). Just looking for opinions..
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Old January 25, 2013, 01:13 AM   #11
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyR
What do you guys think about some of the non-locking gun hiding places (diversion clocks, books, etc.)?...
Not much.

Seriously, why? Such a hiding place will leave the gun no more accessible than a lock box and much less secure.
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Old January 25, 2013, 01:19 AM   #12
egor20
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JimmyR

Quote:
What do you guys think about some of the non-locking gun hiding places (diversion clocks, books, etc.)?
I think that a lot of thieves read the same catalogs as we do and know exactly what they are.
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Old January 25, 2013, 01:25 AM   #13
therealdeal
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I worry about my wife. She likes to leave gun unsecured(not in safe like I choose to do). I don't like the idea of one of our children getting a hold of any firearms by accident. I have read to many horror stories. She is a very good mother, but tragedies happen & I feel she is less prudent about certain stuff than me. My gun(s) are always locked up when children are present, but I grew up in an anti state long ago. She is used to firearm under the pillow mentality. I don't mean to judge; I just worry as a Dad.
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Old January 25, 2013, 07:39 AM   #14
Pond, James Pond
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I whole heartedly agree with the premise of securing firearms when they are not being used, and I also agree with the premise that we all have a duty of care to our society not to make their appropriation by outsiders any easier.

Personally, rather than having a gun in every room, if you really feel the need for that kind of protection indoors, keep one gun on you and the rest locked away. That way if anything goes awry, wherever you are, there is your gun.

Best way to stay safe in your own home is to have decent doors and windows, IMO, not a pistol under every place mat and cushion.

I also agree with Tom's view of guns left in cars...
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Old January 25, 2013, 11:20 AM   #15
southjk
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Quote:
I worry about my wife. She likes to leave gun unsecured(not in safe like I choose to do). I don't like the idea of one of our children getting a hold of any firearms by accident.
As a gun owner and parent, that comment scares the hell out of me. Kids are naturally curious and there is always a chance that one of them or one of their friends could find one and accidentally hurt or kill someone. Please encourage your wife to lock them up.

If you live alone I can see having them out more but feel they should still be locked up when not there just to protect your investment. If you have anyone else living in the house, I strongly feel they should be locked up. My safe is on the way and they will all be locked up except for the one on me or by my bed in a lock box. I am teaching my daughter (10yo) responsible gun use and safety but I will never allow her access to the guns nor will she know the combination to the safe. Peer pressure is a powerful thing and if we are not home one day I don't want one of her friends convincing her to open it to just take a look at the guns. How many shootings have occurred because a child took their parents gun? Quite a few I've heard of. Why did these minor children have access to weapons at all? Yes I'm sure you and many other people trust your kids as I do mine but I'm sure their parents did too. Please lock you guns up if you have kids. Minus the one on your hip of course.
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Old January 25, 2013, 11:31 AM   #16
MLeake
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Here is the thing: I highly recommend gun owners acquire secure storage devices, preferably heavy and tough safes; this is especially true for gun owners who have kids.

BUT I do not want to see ANY legislation making that a requirement.

I do not have a problem if an insurance company wants to provide lower premiums for gun owners who use safes; that is a matter of free market risk analysis.

While I would prefer it if all gun owners would secure weapons that are not on their persons, and I cringe any time the news covers a crime where a stolen gun was used, I do not want to see any laws that criminalize the gun owner for having been victimized.

Yes, I realize that guns are deadly implements.

I also realize that each new bit of legislation we accept ultimately sets another precedent for more and more gun control.

So, in response to the OP, by all means advocate for gun owners to safeguard their property. Please stop implying gun owners are morally liable for violent acts which stem from a crime against gun owners.
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Old January 25, 2013, 11:54 AM   #17
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I agree that guns not in use should be secured, but my definition of "in use" includes firearms which are immediately available for defensive use even though they are not being handled or fired at that moment. I doubt that any legislation that would be passed in the current climate would agree with my definition.

When children, incompetent adults, or visitors are in a home, fast-access storage boxes are a must in my mind.
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Old January 26, 2013, 03:56 AM   #18
therealdeal
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Quote:
Please encourage your wife to lock them up.
It is just "her" S&W 357 snubby
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Old January 26, 2013, 06:31 AM   #19
trg42wraglefragle
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Instead of having guns scattered around the house wouldn't it make sense to carry a gun on you and the maybe a gun in the bedroom for at night.

The its not my fault if they pinch it and use it in a crime is the most stupidest thing I have ever heard!

If you are try to convince the antis that rules don't need to be tightened that is not the way to do it.
Firearm owners in the US should be doing everything they possibly can to help themselves, not just say its our right and carry on taking little responsibility for themselves.
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Old January 26, 2013, 09:05 AM   #20
Pond, James Pond
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Quote:
If you are try to convince the antis that rules don't need to be tightened that is not the way to do it.
Firearm owners in the US should be doing everything they possibly can to help themselves, not just say its our right and carry on taking little responsibility for themselves.
This.

If gun owners don't want legislation, then they need to police themselves. They need to set themselves the very highest of standards.

I am always encouraged by the seriousness with which members on TFL treat issues such as safe handling.

Conversely, I am disappointed when some members seem to not want any legislation, but then also don't want to make any changes to their lifestyles that would help promote a safer society, without the need for the laws that have so many up in arms, so to speak.
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Old January 26, 2013, 09:30 AM   #21
rebs
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Mine are always locked in one of two gun safes. The only one not in the safe is the one I carry and place in my night stand at night. I feel safe with this practice. No one is going to steel a gun from my home without first having to get past my guard dog and myself or my wife when I am not home.
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Old January 26, 2013, 09:36 AM   #22
ScottRiqui
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Quote:
If gun owners don't want legislation, then they need to police themselves. They need to set themselves the very highest of standards.

I am always encouraged by the seriousness with which members on TFL treat issues such as safe handling.
Exactly. When I first started in the Navy's nuclear power program, I was shocked that we weren't subject to any of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission's rules and regulations. As I learned more, I realized that we were holding ourselves to much higher standards than the NRC's, and that, combined with our excellent safety record, meant that the NRC left us alone.
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Old January 26, 2013, 09:56 AM   #23
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I personally don't have a need to leave guns hidden or just laying around my home. Most are locked in the safe including my EDC at night. In the event of a burgulary at night, I have my HD gun in my handgun safe mounted to my bedframe.

When at home I ALWAYS pocket carry a small .380. I know it's not the best caliber, but it is always handy and in my possession. My 12ga is chambered in the safe in case I need it and have time to get it.
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Old January 26, 2013, 10:01 AM   #24
Skadoosh
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weaponeer1911 wrote:
Quote:
My firearms are secured in my house ....

... If someone breaks in and steals them it is on them, not me. Proximate cause.
I concur with this sentiment. A criminal is a criminal. A dangerous criminal is still a criminal.
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Old January 26, 2013, 10:12 AM   #25
ScottRiqui
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Quote:
My firearms are secured in my house ....

... If someone breaks in and steals them it is on them, not me. Proximate cause.
I'm conflicted on this point. While it's true that having the guns inside your house is technically "securing" them, the idea of "security" for a typical house (or car) is more of a moral restraint than a physical one.

To me, the idea of leaving unattended guns out in the open in an empty, "locked" house still smacks of irresponsibility.

Yes, you can leave banded stacks of $100 bills out in the open in your house, and if you're burgled, you *are* the victim. But I'm still going to call you a dumbass if it happens.
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