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Old January 24, 2013, 05:04 PM   #1
joek1
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.357, VS .45, .40 with regard to recoil,

Hi,

I have been looking at purchsing either a .380, 9X17 Makarov or a 9mm for CCW.

I am looking at these calibres because I have a disease that makes shooting my .357 Ruger SP101 painful after about 25 rounds.

I am not a huge fan of the .380, MAK or even the 9mm, but not having the ability to shoot the .45 or the .40 I wonder if I could handle these rounds, preferably the .45 then the .40.

So I guess at the end of this my question is in your experience is the felt recoil of either the .45 and/or the .40 cal. less than my .357 snub nose revolver?

I should also state that I am NOT adverse to carrying a heavy gun, however I am still looking for a compact version.

I'm also thinking about getting into reloading...I have never done any reloading before ... but are any of these rounds easier or more difficult to reload?


Thank You!
Joe
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:13 PM   #2
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This is a tough question because everyone handles recoil different. The .40 is a snappy round. For me, the felt recoil of the .40 is higher than that of the .45. Have you tried using .38 SPL in your Ruger? Those are far nicer on your hands, and for defensive use, a good, high quality defensive round is still more than adequate.

My advice, if you can, try shooting some different guns. Rent if you can, or see if you can borrow. Keep in mind that the smaller the gun, the more felt recoil. A good full sized 1911 .45, for me, has very little felt recoil, but put that same round into an XDS (small single stack .45) and it hits quite a bit harder.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:16 PM   #3
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Agree with the above. If you really love your revolver shoot 38 spcl at the range and keep the 357 for home defense.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:21 PM   #4
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Recoil is not only subjective, but depends very heavily on the weight and design of the particular gun. I have shot multiple .40s and .45s that shot softer than several 9mms. In particular, my Beretta PX4, the Sig 229, and the M&P 40 make .40 look tamer than 9 is in some platforms. Conversely, .40 can be a handful in designs tailored for 9.

My own subjective experience has found .357 Magnum recoils harder than .45 and .40, which feel about the same to me with .40 feeling a bit "flippier", and 9mm being a bit softer but "poppy" - I actually have more trouble shooting 9 accurately than .40.

I agree with the above. A good .38 Special +p load or even a well-desgined standard-pressure non +p like those from Buffalo Bore has excellent terminal ballistics and is gentle on the hand.

Regardless of caliber, go heavy-for-caliber. Heavier bullets are gentler recoilers, generally. 158-grain .38 Special is a bit easier to handle than 110-grain, 147-grain 9mm is a pussycat, not that 124-grain +p is bad, and 180-grain or 165-grain .40 is substantailly easier to control than 155-grain or lighter.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:28 PM   #5
chris in va
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Understand, your 357 revolver has the hardest recoil of just about any handgun made for concealed carry. I had the 3" SP and quickly sold it once I discovered how ridiculous the muzzle flip was. Yours is even worse. The lightweight poly/alloy revolvers are darn near unshootable IMO.

Aside from using 38 Specials in it, you'll find any midsize semiauto to have about half the recoil of your SP. I'm not a big fan of 40 just because the recoil impulse is so abrupt, and prefer 9mm or 45 in a midsize gun.

We had a discussion at our match about caliber effectiveness. With good defensive ammo, any handgun caliber above 380 will be pretty much a wash. Just rent a few and see what you like.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:28 PM   #6
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.40 is a fun round to shoot. It's snappy and it really wakes you up. I don't have a 40, but I'm looking at new H&K's and a 40 may be what I choose.
I agree with the other poster, if you haven't tried some 38 special in your .357give it a shot....pretty noticeable difference.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:35 PM   #7
chris in va
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Oh one more thing, if you shoot 38's a lot in your SP, a carbon ring forms at the end of the cylinder, making it difficult to load 357's. You'll need to brush out the cylinder first before using them.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:35 PM   #8
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Might be worth while to look for rubber grips or rubber grip cover.
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Old January 24, 2013, 06:23 PM   #9
joek1
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.357 not my favorite gun...

The SP-101 is not my favorite gun but my wife likes it...

"Understand, your 357 revolver has the hardest recoil of just about any handgun made for concealed carry. I had the 3" SP and quickly sold it once I discovered how ridiculous the muzzle flip was. Yours is even worse. The lightweight poly/alloy revolvers are darn near unshootable IMO."

Actually the SP-101 is all stainless but it does require a good grip.

Aside from using 38 Specials in it, you'll find any midsize semiauto to have about half the recoil of your SP. I'm not a big fan of 40 just because the recoil impulse is so abrupt, and prefer 9mm or 45 in a midsize gun.

It's not my favorite gun...really don't like it at all, but my wife likes it so the .38 spl option is there but not the best solution for me...In the .45 arena I am thinking about the Armscor Rock Island 1911A1 Compact Semi Auto Handgun .45 ACP 3.5" Barrel. At a little over 32oz. it is weighty which I am fine with...I'm thinking that between the weight and the recoil mechanism the felt recoil would be considerably less then the .357.


I once owned a H&K USP in .40 cal. It was when the gun was new the compact version wasn't even out yet. I NEVER SHOULD HAVE SOLD THAT GUN...it was fantastic, but it was so long ago I really don't remember the recoil that well but it SHOT GREAT!!!

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Old January 24, 2013, 06:48 PM   #10
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I have a PX4 40 cal with a Hogue HandAll that takes out the snappy and the recoil feels less snappy than my SR9 when not using the Hogue HandAll. That Hogue guy really deserves his Tahiti beach time for this invention. I didn't use hot water for the Hogue, nor powder to slide the grip over the handle. I took a syllabus plastic cover sheet and cut strips so the grip slides down and then I pull out the strips.
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Old January 24, 2013, 07:01 PM   #11
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I have one all-steel, 1911 with a 3.5 inch barrel in .45 acp. The recoil is not bad, though the muzzle flips appreciably more than the longer barreled versions. It would still have less recoil and muzzle flip than than the SP 101 with .357 magnum loads. Recoil on a .45 1911 is more of a push than a snap.
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Old January 24, 2013, 07:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
is the felt recoil of either the .45 and/or the .40 cal. less than my .357 snub nose revolver?
Both, yes, definitely.
If you can tolerate a 357 Snubbie a Glock 27 or other small(er) 40s&w should be no problem.
I hear the XDs.45 is a soft shooter for its size.
The Glock 36 is another good one... its about the same size as the G19/23.

A scant few of the small 380's are soft shooting. The LCP is tolerable, but it jumps around in your hand and its no easier on your hide than a PM9.

Initially...I'd nudge you towards looking at and shooting the Kahr PM9/CM9 or the CW9 before moving on.
Fantastic pistols that shoot extremely well with minimal recoil for being so small and light...plus they all have a sweet trigger.

Last edited by Dashunde; January 24, 2013 at 09:07 PM.
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Old January 24, 2013, 07:07 PM   #13
chris in va
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Quote:
Actually the SP-101 is all stainless but it does require a good grip.
Yes, I'm aware of that...I had one. I was referring to even smaller revolvers like the Ruger LCR in 357 when I mentioned polymer.
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Old January 24, 2013, 08:15 PM   #14
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Some 380's can be pretty sharp due to their recoil operated mechanisms, and can require allot of effort to rack the slide, hence the beauty of the tip barrel Beretta's. Shooting a 92 (9mm) and a 96 (40s&w) side by side is quiet eye opening. The 40 has a pretty strong recoil impulse, IMO much more than a 9 or 45. I will say though this can be changed depending on the particular load. Try some Nylon Monogrips with some +P's and that SP101 will be a ***** cat.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:15 PM   #15
Billy Shears
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For my part, I'll just say that I can comfortably shoot several hundred rounds of .45 ACP in an afternoon through an M&P with a smile on my face, but a few cylinders of .357, even through a full size GP-100, is enough to make me call it a day. Whether measuring in recoil or muzzle blast, for me the .45 is FAR more pleasant to shoot, even in +P loadings. YMMV.
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Old January 25, 2013, 09:49 PM   #16
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I don't have a whole lot of experience with all of those calibers, but I would say there is not much difference in a .40 or .45 in the same gun in terms of power. There is in the geometry of the kick though.
Have you looked into a .357 SIG round? You may look into a gun with easily interchangeable calibers like a Sig Sauer.
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Old January 25, 2013, 10:11 PM   #17
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Yeah, I bought a .357 SIG. Loaded ammo was EXPENSIVE. Sold the gun & bought a 1911. Anybody want to buy a set of Lee .357 SIG dies?
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Old January 25, 2013, 10:16 PM   #18
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Ill put it this way. I have a colt commander LW and its muzzle flip to new shooters is harsh in 45 230 grainers (non +p) but had a buddy that said his .357 Dan wesson 6 incher has way less recoil than my Colt (he has 115 grain winchester wwb hp's) grain weights, pistol weight and balance makes a ton of difference. And i have shot a Glock 23 and its recoil was none to me (Grain unknown) and can fire as fast as i can pull the trigger and be on target.
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Old January 25, 2013, 10:32 PM   #19
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to the original poster

I would consider a heavy frame handgun in .38 special. Ammo is (was before this date) plentiful & cheap to reload.
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Old January 26, 2013, 03:32 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toolman View Post
I would consider a heavy frame handgun in .38 special. Ammo is (was before this date) plentiful & cheap to reload.
I think that idea is tops. Before the panic, Bud's had a Smith & Wesson Model 64 4" Heavy Barrel .38 Special +p, and I thought several times it'd be pretty much ideal as an HD gun,
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Old January 26, 2013, 09:32 AM   #21
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A trend that has been catching on more and more with .357 is medium velocity JHPs, such as a 125 gr around 1250-1300 fps or 140 gr at 1150 fps. You may look into those first. Another BIG bonus of non-nuclear .357 loads is less of the brutal flash and report the caliber is known for.
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Old January 26, 2013, 05:19 PM   #22
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So many variables. My 1911 Officer Model (all steel) is very comfortable to shoot 45acp. My plastic SP2022 in 40 cal recoils more. My fly weight PF-9 9mm is brutal after a range session.
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Old January 26, 2013, 05:21 PM   #23
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Quote:
.357, VS .45, .40 with regard to recoil
It's been my experience that the .45 is the most user friendly of the 3 listed.
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Old February 12, 2013, 08:36 PM   #24
joek1
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Found a .45 What do you think

Hi,

I have a local gun shop that has a Para-Ordnance P12-45 for $489.99 with one mag.

Is this a good deal or should I keep looking?

Thanks
Joe
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Old February 12, 2013, 09:27 PM   #25
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Not even a question.

.45ACP for the win
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