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Old January 22, 2013, 05:15 PM   #1
deerslayer303
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The panic has hit the cheap 54r surplus too!

I was in a gun shop earlier with SWMBO, I walked in a when I saw the price (259.00) on a single tin of 440 rounds of surplus 54r ammo I busted out laughing. And I saw a few people pick them up and go to the counter with it. SMH. And 299 for a war production round reciever Izzy 91/30. I didn't even flip the tag over on the 24/47 sitting next to it as I REALLY DIDN"T WANT TO FURTHER MY INSULT!
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Old January 22, 2013, 06:53 PM   #2
chiefr
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I saw 2 bricks of Remington Thunderbolt 22LR sell for $145.00 on Gunbroker.
It was an A+1 seller.
The "NR"s are going nuts buying up ammo and magazines.
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Old January 23, 2013, 12:29 PM   #3
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I figured that would happen with the 7.62X54R, there is how many millions of Mosin Nagant rifles out there?

I did most of my hoarding before all this panic, I don't have a bunch of 7.62X54R but enough.
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Old January 23, 2013, 02:15 PM   #4
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yeah stuff like that is getting to be common place. sportsmans guide has 17 cents per round x54 but naturally it's all out of stock.
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Old January 23, 2013, 03:13 PM   #5
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Ahhh the price gouging...

Deerslayer PM me if you're looking and I'll tell you where...

Bulgarian and Romanian light ball, $87.87...up a bit, but still reasonable if you shoot it (I don't, I handload..)

People gotta stop buying from these clowns. Enough, already...

No one is even TALKING about doing anything with ammunition...it's the fools among us doing the panic buying that are bringing all this on.
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Old January 23, 2013, 07:59 PM   #6
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no love for the rest of us?
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Old January 23, 2013, 10:21 PM   #7
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Some states are pushing to have internet ammo sales stopped, that's why I've been 'panic buying'.
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Old January 23, 2013, 11:05 PM   #8
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Can't get ammo shipped to mass from online sources. Picked up a spam can (440 rounds) of 7.62X54 last week at the LGS for $110. Plan on getting a few more there.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:49 AM   #9
jake99
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You're paying 30% more in MA to keep you safe from FedEx I guess.. They're trying to push that thru here too..
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Old January 24, 2013, 09:32 AM   #10
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Same thing here in California. We have a bill being proposed that will require a DOJ $50.00 extortion fee for an "ammo buying permit". Each time you buy ammo will require a background check, just like a gun purchase. It will ban Internet ammo sales. If you buy more than a pre-determined amount of ammunition at once, your local law enforcement is notified.

NY, NJ, CT, MA and CA are out of control, our laws are going to get worse in those states, regardless of what happens on a national level.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:01 AM   #11
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Same thing here in California. We have a bill being proposed that will require a DOJ $50.00 extortion fee for an "ammo buying permit". Each time you buy ammo will require a background check, just like a gun purchase. It will ban Internet ammo sales. If you buy more than a pre-determined amount of ammunition at once, your local law enforcement is notified.
Depending on what the "pre-determined amount" is, the police are going to get very tired of the notifications very quickly. It's not as if they can actually investigate anything based on the reports, since the mere fact that you bought ammo doesn't give them a basis for a search warrant. At most, the police could call the buyer or stop by to ask if he has any nefarious plans for the ammo, but the buyer doesn't have to take their call or answer the door.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:08 AM   #12
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Depending on what the "pre-determined amount" is, the police are going to get very tired of the notifications very quickly. It's not as if they can actually investigate anything based on the reports, since the mere fact that you bought ammo doesn't give them a basis for a search warrant.
That all depends upon the Judge asked to give the warrant, does it not?

IIRC, Judges can still be "shopped" - it's been done before.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:16 AM   #13
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There's "judge shopping", and then there's "trying to find a judge who will sign off on a warrant that's guaranteed to get thrown out of court later, along with anything we find out as a result of the warrant".

No judge is going to issue a search warrant based solely on a report of the legal purchase of ammunition, no matter the quantity. There's no probable cause for a search - in fact, there hasn't even been a crime committed.
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Old January 24, 2013, 10:30 AM   #14
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I bought my Black Horse BHAK54 when they first came out so I got it pretty cheap , ammo was 79 dollars a tin ... before that I was paying 50 bucks for 440 rounds .
It was a fun summer with that gun ... its all over now , I still have a good amount of ammo for that gun .
I guess its just another moment in time for that caliber . 5.45x39 was good also round ... thats done .
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Old January 24, 2013, 03:24 PM   #15
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Depending on what the "pre-determined amount" is, the police are going to get very tired of the notifications very quickly. It's not as if they can actually investigate anything based on the reports, since the mere fact that you bought ammo doesn't give them a basis for a search warrant. At most, the police could call the buyer or stop by to ask if he has any nefarious plans for the ammo, but the buyer doesn't have to take their call or answer the door.
you say this and yet they do it routinely in Australia. not long ago a member here posted that he filled out all their mandatory paperwork and forms and licenses and so forth and bought a 3006 pump action rifle and 250 rounds of ammo, a few days later 2 men arrived at his house with a search warrant and proceeded to search his place for anything 'suspicious'. naturally all he had was a single pump action rifle and a few boxes of ammo so they let him off with a friendly warning to watch how much ammo he buys as it sets off red flags and they are required to investigate.

if those laws pass, law enforcement will be required to investigate and I'm sure search warrants will be made mandatory for such a deal so you have no choice but to submit to being searched. regardless of how sick of it the cops may get, they will still be required to investigate and they will do it whether they like it or not.
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Old January 24, 2013, 05:51 PM   #16
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you say this and yet they do it routinely in Australia.

<snip>

if those laws pass, law enforcement will be required to investigate and I'm sure search warrants will be made mandatory for such a deal so you have no choice but to submit to being searched. regardless of how sick of it the cops may get, they will still be required to investigate and they will do it whether they like it or not.
Australia's entire legal system differs from ours, including the requirements for a search warrant, so I'm not even going to address the rest of your second-hand anecdote.

But here in the U.S., getting a judge to sign off on a search warrant when no one is even claiming that a crime has taken place isn't going to happen without a major revision of our laws. Can laws be changed? Sure, but until it happens, I'm not going to play the "what if" game.
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Old January 25, 2013, 10:50 AM   #17
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Depending on what the "pre-determined amount" is, the police are going to get very tired of the notifications very quickly.
That depends upon the police force in question, as well ..... Bloomberg's straw puchase stings come to mind...... I doubt the NYPD would have any problem investigating "large" ammo purchases on a daily basis ..... they are willing to go out of state to try to get someone to commit a crime so they can arrest them ....I think they'd have no problem going anywhere in NYC to "question" someone buying "hundreds!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111111!!" of rounds of ammo.
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Old January 25, 2013, 10:58 AM   #18
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Ammo.....?

Funny how supply and demand works.....

Desperate people do desperate things IMHO

Stay cool "This too shall pass"

I hope anyway
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Old January 25, 2013, 11:11 AM   #19
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I think they'd have no problem going anywhere in NYC to "question" someone buying "hundreds!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111111!!" of rounds of ammo.
Well, picking up the phone or paying a visit to "question" someone is one thing, and like I said earlier, the purchaser isn't obligated to answer the phone or the door.

But if an ammo purchase is otherwise legal, the simple fact that someone bought more than 'X' rounds isn't enough by itself to get a search warrant. A search warrant requires probable cause that a crime has been committed, and that evidence related to the crime is likely to be found in the area to be searched. The first question out of the judge's mouth is going to be "what's the crime"? Even if the judge did sign off on the warrant, any resulting conviction would eventually be tossed out on appeal - there's simply no precedent in our legal system for using a lawful purchase as the sole justification for a search warrant.
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Old January 25, 2013, 11:29 AM   #20
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Even if the judge did sign off on the warrant, any resulting conviction would eventually be tossed out on appeal -
That would be of little comfort to the individual who's life was wrecked in the meantime ..... and was lucky enough to not have been found to have violated some other law along the way, considering that the huge volume of laws out there.

Quote:
- there's simply no precedent in our legal system for using a lawful purchase as the sole justification for a search warrant.
There's a first time for everything.
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Old January 28, 2013, 12:51 AM   #21
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Does anybody else remember about one or two years ago when several ammo distributors told their friends that higher gas etc prices would force ammo prices up by about 30% in April/May? They wanted to create an upward spiral of anxiety. More mass anxiety = more $.
This never happened that spring.

Some of the "the sky is falling" talk right now (but not all) must be coming from those same distributors-and any other retail sellers-who want to earn nice profits. Now it is a dream come true, provided they are not paying an equally larger fraction for their wholesale ammo.
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Old January 28, 2013, 09:47 AM   #22
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jim, scott, and ignition have good points

The nra seems to be doing nothing but fanning the flames to induce panic buying and price increases.

A lot of the arguments for the NSA phone tapping of American citizens were "if you arn't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about" if you buy a ton of ammo and are growing pot in the back room, you might need to quit growing pot.

we have a "no fly list" a "convicted fellon list" why not a "mentally incompetent to own firearms list"

instead of looking for real solutions and engaging and controling the discussion the nra is simply crying "buy,buy,buy" and "it's the media! it's the media!", and "it's the video games! it's the movies!"

when in reality it's the mentaly disturbed

I am done with paying attention to this subject, I am doing nothing against any law, I am not affraid of some zombie appocolypse.

if I feared an economic collapse I would get solar panels for my airconditioner and freezer. I heat with a wood stove. I don't need anything else.

My comments are not meant to make anyone angry or discount anyone's personal views and comments, they are just my own views.

hopefully this will not get me kicked off the forum as I have a number of other firearm related questions in the future.
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Old January 28, 2013, 10:13 AM   #23
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Panic hasn't hit CAST BULLETS, and I doubt it will.

Lots of good cheap shooting can be had by casting bullets, you can still get gas checks (if you need them), lead is reasonable. The type powders used in cast bullet shooting (Trail Boss & 5744) are available just about anywhere that sells powder.
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Old January 28, 2013, 09:59 PM   #24
tahunua001
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Panic hasn't hit CAST BULLETS, and I doubt it will.
not true at all, I don't know about Wyoming but Lead prices here skyrocket every time a state outlaws, lead shot, lead batteries, lead this, lead that. last year when Colorado's elected retards started saying that hard cast bullets were to blame for all of their wildfire troubles Lead went up significantly.

and that isn't at the gun counter, that's scrap lead prices.
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ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
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Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
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Old January 29, 2013, 07:21 AM   #25
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sixteenacrewood
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The nra seems to be doing nothing but fanning the flames to induce panic buying and price increases.

instead of looking for real solutions and engaging and controling the discussion the nra is simply crying "buy,buy,buy" and "it's the media! it's the media!", and "it's the video games! it's the movies!"

when in reality it's the mentaly disturbed


The NRA is the one organization in this country with the clout in membership and money to effectively fight for gun owners in Congress. Even if you have issues with the NRA, every gun owner should be a member, especially now.

Notice, by the way, how the president's response to the Newtown includes putting more cops in schools. When NRA prez Wayne LaPierre proposed that very thing, he was condemned and derided. And never mind that it was another Democratic prez -- Bill Clinton -- who first put more police in schools back in the 1990s.

All gun owners also should be visiting the Ruger site and the NRAILA website once a week to use their easy email-generating message systems to let the prez and our lawmakers know that we oppose more gun control. Don't leave the fight to someone else. Get involved. Ruger has generated more than 500,000 messages to Congress and the president. It should be 90 million messages.
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