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Old January 21, 2013, 02:23 PM   #1
gun-nut
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liquid alox vs hard

I've been looking around and doing alot of reading on casting my own bullets. I will be using 357 mag loaded to 1000- 1250 fps. My question is will the liquid alox just burn off too quick causing leading, due to lube being burned off, or do i wanna go with a 'harder' lube for this velocity. I've been loading with Blue Dot at these velocities. I'm on info overload right now... With a fast powder, use liquid and a slow powder, just use a harder lube? My barrel is slugged to .358, and i'm sure i'm missing something somewhere. Thanks in advance, Ken
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Old January 21, 2013, 05:18 PM   #2
m&p45acp10+1
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I use tumble lube bullets almost exclusively. I shoot .41 mag at 1300 FPS with no problems of leading. I shot some .357 yesterday at about 1200 FPS out os a 6 inch revolver. No lead. I was using AA#9 which happens to be my prefered powder for magnum loads both jacketed, and cast lead.
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Old January 21, 2013, 06:36 PM   #3
gun-nut
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Thanks M&P. Now i'm wondering if i can use a gas check bullet mould & NOT use the gas check for the above load. Now if i go over the 1300fps, then i use the gas check? right?
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Old January 21, 2013, 06:42 PM   #4
m&p45acp10+1
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Not always for the gas check from what I understand. I have pushed harder than 1300 FPS with some, and did not have any problems. In fact I pused some .41 Mag past 1400 FPS (24 rounds to be exact) My gun cleaned up with a few wet patches, and bore brush. I use M-Pro7 I clean at the range while the gun is still warm it is much easier that way.

I did not stick with that load due to the fact that my loads that clocked at about 1280 FPS shot the most accurately. The veloctiy did not give me any increase in accuracy so I stuck with the lower velocity load. 210 grains at 1280 will still put a world of hurt on what is hit by it.

I do not use gas checkable molds. All of my molds are Lee 2 holers, with the exception of my .45-70 that is single cavity, hollow base mold.

From what I hear you should be able to shoot without gas checks. Though with every hand gun load I have worked up the top end of velocity did not get me the best accuracy. For the most part middle of the road netted the best accuracy.

This was a 12 shot group at 15 yards standing isocolese stance shot about 2 to 3 seconds apart. Note theese were .38 Special. My phone died before I could take a pic of the .357 Mag loads. Groups were similar to the ones pictured.

If you want magnum loads I suggest AA#9 over Alliant 2400. It is cleaner at lower pressures, and from what the chrono said more consitant from shot to shot at lower velocities.


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Last edited by m&p45acp10+1; January 21, 2013 at 06:49 PM.
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Old January 21, 2013, 07:02 PM   #5
jmortimer
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This works real good for tumble lube - 45-45-10 alox blend from LsStuff.com. Created by Recluse from Cast Bollits site.

http://lsstuff.com/store/index.php?m...b1582675ea207f
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Old January 21, 2013, 07:18 PM   #6
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Awesome guys. M&P, i don't want to be on your business end with head shots like that. For the magnum velocities, i have been using alliant 300mp so far. When this runs out i'll get some 2400,296, h-110, or AA#9. jmortimer; your link for the 45/45/10 seems to be the tried and true lube preference from the reading on here. Now to inform 'mama' that lead is good. I mean more $ in her possession.
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Old January 21, 2013, 08:44 PM   #7
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You can make the LLA go a whole lot further if you put the bottle into a cup of hot water. (Hot as hot tap water hot. About 120 to 130 or so degrees for about 5 minutes.) It spreads a lot more evenly, and thin so it dries faster. I pile them on a paper plate. I toss them like a salad moving them around a bit for a couple of days. When I let mine dry for at least 3 days they do not get tacky or sticky at all.

It is the only lube I use with smokeless powder. For BP I use a mix of bees wax, hog lard, and light touch of lanolin for cartrige rounds. For the revolvers I use the old tried and true lard, and bees wax.
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Old January 22, 2013, 05:42 AM   #8
Mike / Tx
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When I first started shooting my own cast I tried several types of lube. Starting off with a Raging Bull 8.375" barreled 454 Casull is intimidating enough, much less thinking about is this lube going to work or not. I chose the top recommended lubes for one reason, I didn't want to spend a weekend scrubbing out lead.

So far I have almost two years under my belt shooting several different designs in several different handguns. To date the only issue I have had was some slight smearing in a couple of barrels which I can only attribute to not getting all the copper out ahead of time.

I use the 45/45/10 now almost exclusively on all my bullets. I have shot mild 650fps loads up to some full bore magnums up into the 1700fps range through the Bull with no issues. I do FULLY admit the 1700fps load was simply to see how the lube would hold up, I wasn't overly impressed with shooting many of the 300gr bullets there.

The best things about the 45/45/10 IMO is the fact that it goes on very evenly, and dries in about 5 minutes to a non tacky finish. I tumble lube a bit different than most as I figure from reading. I use a vacuum seal bag, and I put in about a thumbnail sized glob of the lube, then add in a hundred or so bullets. THen I use a hair drier to warm it all up nicely then I gently roll them all around between my hands. Everything gets a nice coating before sizing and then after, I simply return them back to the bag and repeat the heating and rolling. There is usually plenty of lube left over to coat the sized portions of the bullets.

I have used LAR's lubes and you won't find any better much cheaper than what he produces. Not to mention some of the other products they sell. Great folks and products to boot. His Carnuba Red is very good as is the BAC as well. I have to use them in a pan lube since I don't have a lubrisizer. It is much slower than the TL and why I guess I stick with tumbling.

One other thing, I might use more than is necessary when I lube. Most say if you can see it on the bullets you used to much. I don't mind that fact, especially in the Bull, it might smoke a bit more with some powders, but I would rather it smoke than lead.
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Old January 26, 2013, 02:04 PM   #9
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Shooting GC bullets without a GC sometimes works but you'll give up accuracy in most cases. Another vote for LLA, I like it so much on my rifle bullets I haven't even tried Recluse's recipe yet.
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Old January 28, 2013, 03:55 AM   #10
Ifishsum
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I tumble lube my handgun bullets with liquid Alox almost exclusively; I even thin it somewhat with mineral spirits so its easier to get a thinner, even coat that's barely noticeable. Big improvement over any commercial "hard cast" bullets with hard lube that I used to buy - I've not had a leading problem in anything since I started casting and lubing my own - although for anything over 1100-1200fps I tend to load jacketed so I don't really know how fast I can really push them without leading issues. I bet liquid alox would work just fine in pistol length barrels, even thinned. I'd probably use it a bit thicker for rifle barrels.
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