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Old January 8, 2013, 10:47 AM   #26
Constantine
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Wow...that was a train wreck in slow motion.
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Old January 8, 2013, 12:34 PM   #27
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At work now and not able to watch the video, but with two blowhards such as Morgan and Jones I can only imagine where this would go.

I've watched both of them a couple times in the past and I can't decide which one I dislike more. Although Jones is a 2A proponent at times I wish he were not SOO vocal.

While I would like to see Morgan deported it is not strictly due to his anti 2A stance. The guy bugs the crap out of me. Shoot there are a lot of natural born citizens I would love to see deported....

Just wishing that debaucle didn't happen.

Oh, and its good to see Rob joining in more recently.
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Old January 8, 2013, 12:45 PM   #28
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Tried watching this. The conspiracy theories don't help him. Why can't he just argue one argument at a time? Not everything in this world is some interconnected web.
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Old January 8, 2013, 12:48 PM   #29
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People like Jones do not help gun owners at all IMO. He lost his cool and that destroyed anything positive he had to say. More damage than help.
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Old January 8, 2013, 12:51 PM   #30
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Both are nuts with cracked shells! Alex Jones can be amusing if viewed in the right frame of mind. I like fiction. I don't think he helps our cause at all, in fact hurts it. As for Morgan, I heard he threatened to leave the US. What? He hasn't left yet. Don't let the door hit you on the way out, Piers.
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Old January 8, 2013, 01:16 PM   #31
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Wow...that was a train wreck in slow motion.
There was nothing slow about it. If I didn't know better, I'd have assumed Jones was hopped up on something.

Morgan worked it perfectly. He played the quiet, civilized host who was pounced by the irate, intemperate "gun guy."

Say what you will in Jones' defense, he allowed himself (and, by extension, us) to be lampooned in a huge way. The average uncommitted viewer is going to view that segment in a vacuum, and it's a huge public-relations disaster for us.

ETA: Morgan made a statement today that Jones' appearance was "the best advertisement for gun control you could wish for."
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Old January 8, 2013, 01:22 PM   #32
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Bottom line is, that this whole thing is a very dangerous game and both sides should tone it down a notch, before blood gets spilled.
Nate,
I agree with your post, I only quoted a little piece of it, because I believe it will come to that. I don't think ANY red blooded patriotic american will stand idly by and let an across the board gun ban happen. I do think Mr. Jones went WAY off the deep end. But he treated Piers like he deserved to be treated. I can't stand the guy, a Brit coming over here downing our way of life. But I believe deeply in why the 2nd Amendment is there and the way Alex explained it I believe he is right its NOT about hunting, never was. But your assessment of more gun owners being fired up, I could not agree more. Maybe thats what it will take other than some facebook posts and sending your dues to the NRA to let the Gun Ban pushers know that we are as serious as they are. Just my .02 worth of babble for the day!
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Old January 8, 2013, 01:28 PM   #33
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The problem is, Alex Jones is not just a fringe element crazy person that CNN found off the street. His decently large audience gives him credibility, and he was selected because he started a White House petition that gained over 100k+ signatures to deport the host.

As a politically liberal gun owner, I've spent much of my last few months having very respectful and pleasant conversations with friends and colleagues about firearm ownership in this country. Even people who advocate heavy gun restrictions concede that law-abiding citizens should not be subject to a universal gun ban. The point is that we are responsible adults who have not committed any crimes and can be trusted with them.

Alex Jones' display where he accused Morgan of being part of the New World Order, screamed 9/11 conspiracies, and went as far as adopting the elementary school behavior of mocking someone's accent.. there really was only one question that any reasonable viewer had to ask themselves and that was, "Is this the type of person that I can trust to responsibly own fifty or more firearms?"

The answer was clearly no, and it does all of us who own firearms a disservice because such a high profile individual proved he was as much the caricature that some people paint us out to be. Anyone who says he did a great job or "won" the discussion needs to re-watch the clips and try to see it from the perspective of your average American family or parent who wants to see something done about the violence in this country. It certainly doesn't help out cause.
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Old January 8, 2013, 01:44 PM   #34
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That changed tonight. He had the audacity to presume to represent us, and he made us look like fools. This wasn't an interview or a debate. It was a chance for him to score points off Morgan.

He was rude, and when Morgan managed to ask him one question...one, he dodged it. The man needs to go back to his inane radio show and juvenile conspiracy theories and not take the mantle of being our mouthpiece any more.
AJ is an idiot. However he represents the beliefs of a lot of other gun owners even if he does not represent you. I have had a number of people rant and rave at me in gun shops and gun shows over the years in Alex Jonesese. Usually I am sitting there just like Morgan hoping the ranting man will go away. These people are typically not dangerous but most people don't realize that due to the garbled and aggressive message.
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Old January 8, 2013, 01:50 PM   #35
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What bothers me most, is that far and wide across the internet, Alex Jones is often referred to as controlled opposition. Listen folks, I'm just a guy with the internet like most all of us, but whatever the true nature of Alex Jones is, (I freely admit I don't know) its a fact that he is often referred to as controlled opposition.

Now, the reason the claim that Alex is controlled opposition bothers me, is because right now, in the middle worst fight this country has had about gun rights in many a year. A loon went on TV and put on a performance that not only hurt the image of firearms owners, it probably revved up a lot of potentially dangerous loons. Which is exactly something those who want to confiscate firearms would like.

Lets only consider things that are immutable fact.

1) Alex Jones was allowed on Piers Morgan's show, by the same media that is hostile to firearms and firearms owners
2) Alex Jones looked like a loon(either by nature, or design) and revved up a lot of real loons
3) Piers Morgan yelled, interrupted, insulted and acted like a petulant ass in general, when confronted with a sane, polite, logical man, Larry Pratt. Who had a lot of facts to present by the way.
4) Conversely, when Jones was on, Morgan acted sane, polite and rational.
5) The imbibing effect, whether it was planned, or not, is the same, it helped the antis.

It all adding up, in my opinion, to be at worst flat out conspiracy and at best to have been scripted for entertainment and ratings value. Again, whether I'm correct, or way off, matters not. What matters is the imbibing effect is the same.
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Old January 8, 2013, 01:57 PM   #36
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I am wiling to bet Morgan was counting on Jones to go off the deep end.. So Morgan gets a hot seat for a few minutes, we get the hot seat for a long, long time after such unthinking dialog.
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Old January 8, 2013, 02:02 PM   #37
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I honestly think you guys are making too much of it. Everyone who is rational that knows who Alex Jones is, knows he is a nut. If you didn't know you can find out in 0.00045 seconds with a Google search.

The bigger problem is the number of people who agree with him while small are vocal.
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Old January 8, 2013, 02:05 PM   #38
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However he represents the beliefs of a lot of other gun owners even if he does not represent you.
Up until the 9/11 conspiracy ranting, I didn't disagree with his opinions. However, presentation matters. Diplomacy matters. In that, he utterly failed.

Quote:
It all adding up, in my opinion, to be at worst flat out conspiracy and at best to have been scripted for entertainment and ratings value.
Yep, and Jones allowed himself to be played. BGutzman is right--Morgan knew exactly what he was doing.
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Old January 8, 2013, 02:49 PM   #39
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Yeah I thought it ODD that P.M. just sat there very polite like, when we all know that is NOT him. Well planned by the liberal network for sure. I had never heard of A.J. till I saw this video come across Yahoo news. And like most I watched it till he started ranting about N.W.O, 9/11 and such and I killed it. My favorite fired up 2nd Amendment Supporter Is OLE UNCLE TED!!!
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Old January 8, 2013, 02:59 PM   #40
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I honestly think you guys are making too much of it. Everyone who is rational that knows who Alex Jones is, knows he is a nut. If you didn't know you can find out in 0.00045 seconds with a Google search.

The bigger problem is the number of people who agree with him while small are vocal.
I would agree, however the point is that most people in this country do not own guns. In light of the recent events, people are going to naturally review the state of firearm ownership whether we like it or not. Constitutional considerations aside, the best assurance we can give to the rest of the country that we in fact are not the problem, is to present ourselves as what we are: rational, stable, responsible adults.

As I mentioned earlier, Mr. Jones wasn't cherry-picked out of the woodwork for being a juvenile, rude, conspiracy theorist. He along with over 100,000 others called out Mr. Morgan by name in a petition. It's hard to write off his unstable antics as an irrelevant fringe element when so many people in two or three weeks have signed on in support of it. I may not be a fan of Mr. Morgan, and I'm sure he was pleasantly surprised by being handed such a character on a silver platter, but it does little to change the fact that as gun owners, we have a public image problem and it's nobody's fault but our own.

We do little to discourage the extremists among our own ranks, and then complain when people shine a light on them.

PS (to nate45): We gleefully mocked Carolyn McCarthy for her 2007 comment about barrel shrouds without accepting the fact that she may not represent many other gun-ban advocates who do know what they're talking about but simply have a differing opinion on the matter. Writing off Mr. Jones' outburst as a conspiracy is unfair, because this is a game that everyone plays.

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Old January 8, 2013, 03:02 PM   #41
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Up until the 9/11 conspiracy ranting, I didn't disagree with his opinions. However, presentation matters. Diplomacy matters. In that, he utterly failed.
Given his normal material I don't know how he could present his arguments in any other way. Put another way most conspiracy theorists are not open minded and willing to listen to logical arguments that discredit their point of view and beliefs. They deal with this by attempting to batter their verbal opponents in exactly the same way he did in the interview. By shutting down any honest argument the fantasy is preserved for another day.

The problem here is that he stepped into the real world and does not know how to wear big boy pants and have a normal conversation.
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Old January 8, 2013, 03:21 PM   #42
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Bloke lost it completely. Embarrassing for anyone claiming to be any sort of intelligent adult. When the guy starts putting on a daft English accent during what should have been a serious debate . . . what can you do but quietly question the fullness of his cognitive development.

In fairness, Piers Morgan is deeply rude himself when it suits him. He is also almost universally despised by his own people - seriously, it is hard to overstate this part, people in the UK hate him. Slimy, smarmy, fundamentally dishonest, lacking in moral fibre yet very intelligent and an excellent talker.

Point here is, Alex whatshisface was invited on to caricature gun people who disagree with Piers Morgan as lunatics, which he did beautifully.
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Old January 8, 2013, 03:31 PM   #43
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For Pete's sake...

The only reason Morgan had that useless nut-job Jones on, was to get the exact show he got in order to portray 'the gun nuts' exactly as Jones acted...

AJ has been on the forefront of conspiracy-land for years, and is less credible than my Dog when it comes to rational discourse...My Dog at least barks at real threats...

Morgan can't have anyone lucid on to debate him, as he knows he'd have his hat handed to him...
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Old January 8, 2013, 03:44 PM   #44
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Anyone know what Suzanna Hupp has been up to lately? Seems to me as though she could really be a spokesman for the second amendment, especially considering her personal experience with a mass shooter. She's been calm, cool, and collected in every video I've seen of her. Maybe she doesn't want to be a spokeswoman, and that's fine by me as its her choice, but boy, we sure could use someone like her.
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Old January 8, 2013, 04:47 PM   #45
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omg.


It hurt to watch... Piers Morgan was just letting him train wreck himself.

This really hurts how the non gun owning population views us.
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Old January 8, 2013, 05:45 PM   #46
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Piers Morgan found the nuttiest gun rights proponent whackjob, then peddled him to the American people as a "typical" gun rights activist and indicated the rhetoric he spewed is what you'd expect from a gun owner.

He let Alex Jones blather on about his conspiracy theories, then had Alan Dershowitz examine him in a later segment as if he was some kind of deranged missing link.

Civilized society has progressed past the need to own guns.

Real enlightened people/liberals live in ivory towers bristling with private security forces.
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Old January 8, 2013, 07:44 PM   #47
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I hope no one is surprised Piers Morgan picked this person for the show
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Old January 8, 2013, 08:07 PM   #48
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As i recall piers morgan threw a fit of his own in an interview with Larry pratt you can find it on youtube. Maybe the guy did not personify gun owners as we would like but how many times has piers himself done the same thing? Why has he not been called out for his actions? does he not like his own medicine?
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Old January 8, 2013, 10:10 PM   #49
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I don't think you can reassure yourself that "nobody sees this stuff but us." I was sitting in a parking lot tonight waiting for my children. So I was browsing on my iPhone. The ABC News app had a link and story about it. Pulse had several. And the Google News app listed story after story about it. Lots of bad publicity.

Gregg
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Old January 8, 2013, 11:01 PM   #50
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if this is the same piers who was fired in england for posting doctored photos of british troops torturing insurgents i dont know why anybody watches him.
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