The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > The Smithy

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 26, 2012, 03:19 PM   #1
jkpq45
Member
 
Join Date: September 28, 2012
Posts: 44
Rechamber a Muzzleloading Barrel Blank?

Hi All,

I have a wild idea. Consider the following part from Numrich:

http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Products/584530.htm

Assuming the action is strong enough, what sort of pressure would this barrel stand up to? Ignore the weird twist rate and bore/groove diameter for a moment--would this thing stand up to 30 KCUP? More?

Thanks,
jkpq45
jkpq45 is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 03:29 PM   #2
jimbob86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 6,764
I wouldn't spend $85 and shipping to find out.
__________________
TheGolden Rule of Tool Use: "If you don't know what you are doing, DON'T."

http://nefirearm.com/
jimbob86 is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 03:35 PM   #3
oneoldsap
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 16, 2009
Location: I live in the foot of the Green Mountains of Vermont
Posts: 1,585
Bad Idea

That barrel would be suitable for black powder charges up to about 100 Gr. by volume ! It would be totally unsuitable for any type of smokeless powder application ! You don't want to win a Darwin award do you ?
oneoldsap is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 03:59 PM   #4
Hawg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 8, 2007
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 11,703
Threaded into a receiver I would think it would be ok up to that. A 45-70 is 28 CUP. I know you said ignore the twist rate but that is a round ball only twist.
Hawg is offline  
Old December 27, 2012, 12:07 AM   #5
James K
Staff
 
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 19,345
I can't be sure, but I suspect those barrels are made from good steel, but not hardened very much if at all. I doubt they would "blow up" at even 50k, but the rifling might not last long if high speed and/or jacketed bullets were pushed through it.

Jim
__________________
Jim K
James K is offline  
Old December 27, 2012, 08:15 PM   #6
Gunplummer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 11, 2010
Location: South East Pa.
Posts: 1,436
I go with JamesK. I would think it is 4140 and probably at the same hardness of a high power barrel. With all the lawsuits now days I doubt any one would order scrap barrels to build muzzle loaders.
Gunplummer is offline  
Old December 29, 2012, 12:08 PM   #7
Clark
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 4, 1999
Location: WA, the ever blue state
Posts: 2,915
At the risk of being redundant, 1 1/8" OD and .45" ID chambered for 45/70 would be hard to blow up.
I could do a thin wall formula for stress, and maybe a Lame's formula for thick wall, but to do it right you would need one of Roark's open end tube formulas.

So at the cave man level, I have tried to blow up many guns.
That one would be a ~~.250" thick chamber wall.
I don't care if the gun is 150 years old or new, unless it is a Ruger 454 made of specialty steel, this is my guideline:
.100" thick, I can't blow it up.
.050" thick, blowing up is easy.
__________________
The word 'forum" does not mean "not criticizing books."
"Ad hominem fallacy" is not the same as point by point criticism of books. If you bought the book, and believe it all, it may FEEL like an ad hominem attack, but you might strive to accept other points of view may exist.
Are we a nation of competing ideas, or a nation of forced conformity of thought?
Clark is offline  
Old December 31, 2012, 10:36 AM   #8
kraigwy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2008
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 9,416
1:56?????

That sucker is dern near a smooth bore. I have no idea what it would be good for.

There are a lot of cheap barrels out there that would be more practical. Excluding using this one as a pry bar or cheater, I have no idea.

1:56: Maybe a .410 shot gun barrel, but a then you could probably find a single shot 410 for less money.

Oh second thought, one could chamber it for 50 Cal, put an end cap on it and make a black powder ONLY water cannon for some EOD unit. But there are cheaper ways to go about that also.
__________________
Kraig Stuart
CPT USAR Ret
USAMU Sniper School Oct '78
Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071
kraigwy is offline  
Old December 31, 2012, 11:20 AM   #9
HiBC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 13, 2006
Posts: 3,593
I believe many muzzle loader barrels are made of softer steel like 1157.

They are designed for Black powder only and I believe that is what the barrelmaker would tell you.

The groove depth is .010.That is for a cloth patch.Typical groove depth for unpatched bullet rifling might be .003 or .004.

As Hawg and others have mentioned,1 in 56 will work great for a patched round ball but it will not stabilize an elongated bullet.

Whatever you are planning,you will still invest all the work and other parts,like stock wood.

Look in Brownells,at Green Mountain,and E R Shaw if you want a moderate priced octagon barrel.You also might check with Buffalo Arms.
HiBC is offline  
Old January 1, 2013, 01:49 AM   #10
Gunplummer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 11, 2010
Location: South East Pa.
Posts: 1,436
1117 maybe? Lot of .22 barrels were made of that.
Gunplummer is offline  
Old January 1, 2013, 09:27 AM   #11
B.L.E.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2008
Location: Somewhere on the Southern shore of Lake Travis, TX
Posts: 1,893
If you add the groove depth to the .445 bore diameter, you get a groove diameter of .465".
Way too big for good results with .458 bulllets even if the rifling twist stabilized the bullet.
1 in 56" is for round balls and maybe some hollow base MiniƩ bullets.

If a MiniƩ bullet has a deep enough hollow base, it will actually be stable if shot from a smoothbore. Air rifle pellets are a good example of such bullets. If you have a BB gun, try loading some .177 pellets from the muzzle and shooting them, they always hit head first because of their forward center of mass.
B.L.E. is offline  
Old January 1, 2013, 09:48 AM   #12
Rifleman1776
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 25, 2010
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 3,309
"suspect"; "think"; "might"
Lot of real solid information there.
Not knowing what kind of steel the barrel is made from, don't experiment.
It is a black powder muzzle loading barrel. And a good one.
If you want a modern, smokeless barrel, buy one made for that purpose.
Remember, these things go "bang". Don't become stupid, blind and crippled.
Rifleman1776 is offline  
Old January 2, 2013, 07:01 PM   #13
mapsjanhere
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 6, 2009
Location: Albuquerque
Posts: 2,347
A Shaw barrel blank is only $135, it's good for smokeless and has the right twist. I'd start from there.
__________________
F 135 - the right choice
mapsjanhere is offline  
Old January 2, 2013, 07:11 PM   #14
jimbob86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 6,764
Quote:
1:56?????

That sucker is dern near a smooth bore. I have no idea what it would be good for.
Patched round ball works well in 1:66.

Just sayin'....
__________________
TheGolden Rule of Tool Use: "If you don't know what you are doing, DON'T."

http://nefirearm.com/
jimbob86 is offline  
Old January 3, 2013, 09:21 AM   #15
Rifleman1776
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 25, 2010
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 3,309
Quote:
1:56?????

That sucker is dern near a smooth bore.
kraigky, that is a pretty common muzzle loader twist, primarily to be used with a patched round ball. Common twists in ml rifles range from 1:48 to 1:72. Not so common twists go from faster to slower.
Rifleman1776 is offline  
Old January 3, 2013, 05:20 PM   #16
oneoldsap
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 16, 2009
Location: I live in the foot of the Green Mountains of Vermont
Posts: 1,585
Actually 1:66 is the roundball twist of choice , never heard of a 1:56 .
oneoldsap is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.10071 seconds with 9 queries