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Old December 31, 2012, 07:11 PM   #1
nhcruffler
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Why Does Lyman Not Like Me ?

OK, I got a new Lyman 49th Reloading Manual for Christmas. I have been reloading for a few years and have read my Lee manual front & back. So , I start perusing my new Lyman manual and find out that I am not supposed to use brass picked up from the range. Only new brass , for my safety, so I will know the history of the brass. Bummer! I then start looking for some of the calibers that I reload for like 7.5 x 54 MAS --not there ; 7.5 x 55 Swiss--not there, How about something for that old Nagant revolver I got from J&G--not there, How about an 8 x 57 Mauser load with a 198 gr or 200 grain bullet--not there.
I am not trashing the manual because it does have some very nice features like they highlight the load that was most accurate ,for them. That gives a guy a good place to start. Also they have a lot of cast bullet loads which is very nice if you want to start casting your own, or use purchased cast bullets.
I like the way the book is laid out and organized. I just have to wonder why they have been printing this book for over a hundred years but have no information on the calibers I mentioned. 7.5 MAS and 7.5 Swiss were, and still are ,widely used by two modern armies. And you just can't publish 8 X 57 Mauser loads with out including the 198 gr or 200 gr bullets. That's just not right!
So does Lyman just not like C&R guys or what?
Nuf said. Have a Happy New Year Everyone! NH
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Old December 31, 2012, 07:30 PM   #2
leadchucker
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You think that's bad, every manual for every gun I own says not to shoot reloads in it.
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Old December 31, 2012, 08:20 PM   #3
floydster
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All in all, I think the Lyman 49th manual is not what it shoud be, I always keep referring back to my old manuals for loads.

Just sayin.

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Old December 31, 2012, 08:45 PM   #4
mehavey
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I dunno .... starting in 1969 and 4+2 editions later, my 7 Lyman manuals have only gotten better/more inclusive
-- especially when they issued additional all inclusive separate cast load books. Lyman is still my second GoTo source.

My first has become and remains QuickLoad. If the readers want A-to-Zed/alpha-to-omega, only QuickLoad can start you there.
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Old December 31, 2012, 09:20 PM   #5
solocam72
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I hear a lot of folks speak highly of the lyman 49th manual and seen it suggested more than any, I have thumbed thru it at stores enough to know that it won't be in my library. Take it for what it is and use the information the best you can
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Old December 31, 2012, 09:30 PM   #6
reynolds357
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The cast loads in the manual annoy me. I dont shoot cast bullets. Back in the day Lymans cast loads were in their cast manual and I wish they had left them there.
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Old January 1, 2013, 02:41 PM   #7
erikk
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C Y A lawyer talk been reloading since early 50's & use Lyman and many others
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Old January 1, 2013, 02:53 PM   #8
Xfire68
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Range pickup's are fine you need to monitor the brass for cracks, bulges and loose primer pockets no matter where you acquired the brass.

Keeping new brass in it's own lot is always a good idea just as I think sorting by head stamps is. Not all brass is the same nor do they all have the same lifespan. Even if you sort them by brand and head stamp you won't know the age of the cases so keep a close eye on them.

I think the manuals all point you in the safest possible direction even though many that have reloaded range pickup's for decades don't hesitate loading them after sorting and inspecting them.
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Old January 1, 2013, 03:11 PM   #9
Mike-Mat
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I still refer to my 1980 Lyman manual for things that are not in the new one.

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Old January 2, 2013, 06:46 PM   #10
grubbylabs
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I use cast and jacketed bullets, so I like the Lyman manual. I also use range brass, and unless you are loading for a hunting rifle or a competition rifle I don't think there is much to worry about as far as sorting. I just keep an eye on the brass I am loading and make sure it is in spec, especially if it is a plinker like my AR.
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Old January 2, 2013, 08:03 PM   #11
reynolds357
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I have actually had pressure issues switching between brass manufacturers. Capacities are different and sometimes drastically different.
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Old January 3, 2013, 03:15 AM   #12
FrankenMauser
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Quote:
The cast loads in the manual annoy me. I dont shoot cast bullets. Back in the day Lymans cast loads were in their cast manual and I wish they had left them there.
If you don't like it, don't buy any more.



As for the 49th... Yea, it's a bit of a disappointment. Compared to the 48th, they actually dropped quite a few cartridges, and added only a couple.
Some of the data that they did keep for the 49th is still questionable. (I would cite an example, but my copies seem to have grown legs and run away. If you were my Lyman manuals, where would you hide? )
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Old January 3, 2013, 08:23 AM   #13
Magnum Wheel Man
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I try to be as anal as possible in my reloading, & FIL trained me well... up until I started shooting CAS, I kept track of how many times a case had been loaded, & sorted my brass by manufacturer, & even by weight on a few of them, do my best to size to length within a couple .001's

... still do for most of my rifles yet, but shooting CAS, I often don't get back my original brass, so I stopped keeping track of how many reloads, & stopped sorting by brand on those calibers... most are light to mid loads anyway...

but with the rifles, if I get to a certain amount of reloads ( varys by cartridge ) I start seeing split mouths or pressure signs at the web, with history, I know when to start paying particularly close attention to the cases when preping them for reloading...

I don't have a new Lyman book, but all the more reason to have multiple manuals, as many cartridges as I reload, no manual seems to have them all...
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Old January 3, 2013, 09:38 AM   #14
Mike Irwin
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Don't blame the manual, blame the gift giver, who obviously didn't put enough thought into making sure what it offered is what you needed.

No loading manual is going to be, or can be, all things to all people and cover every possible cartridge and load combination.

The fact that the 7.5x54 is still used by a major army isn't really germane. It's not really used that much HERE, in the United States.

Yes, there are a few freaks, er... die hards... who load for it, but I'd suspect that there really aren't that many of you.

It can take well over a year for a company to do the in-depth testing required to develop the loading data needed for a cartridge. It is not a simple process by any means, so in a lot of ways, especially with these older military surplus cartridges, it becomes a cost benefit exercise.
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Old January 3, 2013, 09:50 AM   #15
Magnum Wheel Man
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I do load 7.5 Swiss as well... but not often, & don't remember off the top of my head which manual had the load data though...
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Old January 3, 2013, 10:12 AM   #16
Mike Irwin
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I believe that Hornady's manual still has data for 7.5 Swiss.
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Old January 3, 2013, 11:02 AM   #17
nhcruffler
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The Lee manual has loads for the 7.5 MAS and the 7.5 Swiss. I don't believe that they actually did any testing on the 7.5 MAS. I believe that they simply copied the 30-40 Krag load data and left it at that. Most anyone that loads for the 7.5 MAS will tell you that you can safely get better performance than the listed data in the Lee manual. I also agree that if you are competition shooting or going on a major hunting trip or you only use max loads that you should probably know the history of your brass. In the mean time I will continue to scrounge any usable brass I can find. ( unusable gets recycled $$). It is nice to have different books so you can see different views and techniques on how to do things and compare different load data. It is also nice to have the many reloading forums available on the internet for those odd ball calibers that the freaks load for
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Old January 3, 2013, 05:19 PM   #18
FrankenMauser
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Quote:
I believe that Hornady's manual still has data for 7.5 Swiss.
The 7th and 8th editions have 7.5 Swiss and 7.5 MAS data.

Since they aren't in the 'deleted' list, I'm guessing they're still in the 9th edition.
Code:
9th Edition deleted cartridges (rifle)-
219 Zipper (moved to website)
219 Donaldson Wasp (moved to website)
7-30 Waters
7.92x33 Kurz

Deleted cartridges (handgun)-
7.63 Mauser
300 Whisper (as a handgun cartridge)

Quote:
The Lee manual has loads for the 7.5 MAS and the 7.5 Swiss. I don't believe that they actually did any testing on the 7.5 MAS. I believe that they simply copied the 30-40 Krag load data and left it at that. Most anyone that loads for the 7.5 MAS will tell you that you can safely get better performance than the listed data in the Lee manual.
Aside from the fact that they compiled 95% of their data from other (outdated) sources, that's one of my biggest complaints about the Lee manual. They have too many cartridges with data 'calculated based on a similar cartridge'. As 7.5 MAS and 8x50mm Lebel shooters will tell you... often, it doesn't work. It's so conservative that some of the data will actually leave bullets lodged in the bore.
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