Colt Detective Special Timing - Page 2

salvadore · January 2, 2013, 11:58 AM

Who's Grant Cunningham?

Jaywalker · January 2, 2013, 12:52 PM

Grant Cunningham is a noted gunsmith: http://grantcunningham.com/revolver-services.html He is particularly known for his work in timing Colt DA revolvers. Unfortunately, he isn't taking anymore work right now.

Check his "Library" for some very interesting articles. His piece on lubrication changed my methods about a year ago.

Edited: Here is the article that I believe Winchester_73 is referring to: http://www.grantcunningham.com/blog_..._delicate.html

DPris · January 2, 2013, 02:03 PM

I sent an OP, a Trooper .357, and a DS to Grant, all for timing work.
My Python timing was corrected locally.

The timing issue extends across frame sizes & is inherent to the design.
The pressures of the ammunition used and the frequency of use will determine how soon the hand wears, but eventually it WILL wear, timing WILL be affected, and it goes downhill from there.
The hand performs two purposes in the V-Spring actions, on Smiths & Rugers it performs only one. That's why the old Colt hand is the major design weakness.

You see the timing issue arise more commonly in the larger Colt frames simply because people by & large shoot the bigger frames more. That doesn't mean the D Frame is any less prone to hand wear.

There's a reason why those guns are obsolete. Time & labor intensive to build, and they'll tend to require outside maintenance more often than a comparable Smith or Ruger with extensive use.

If you choose to accept a gun that has timing issues, it's your choice.
I choose not to shoot such a Colt.
A Colt that starts out properly set up will simply run longer before it needs a hand replacement than one that starts out with a short hand.
Denis

Jaywalker · January 2, 2013, 04:38 PM

I can't be trusted at my local gun store.

I found a like-new Colt Detective Special from about 1976 and brought it home with me. It has obviously not been carried as the blue looks good, no grip rubs or anything like that.

I'll run Dfariswheel's test some more times, but it checked out pretty well, I thought, for my first time running it. The Bolt Drop Timing worked through several full cylinder turns, with one cylinder one time dropping into the slot itself rather than the ramp - the rest of the time into the ramp. The trigger stacks slightly towards the end of the pull, allowing me to know it's close to firing; as long as the rest stays in good timing I'll leave it like that. If it ever goes out of time, I'll probably have it adjusted to "no stack."

The only real concern I have is whether or not I've just bought another "too pretty to shoot" piece. Pics tomorrow.

DPris · January 2, 2013, 04:43 PM

Good luck with it.
Hope by the time it ever needs adjustment there'll still be somebody around who can do it for you.

Denis

Dfariswheel · January 2, 2013, 08:35 PM

For those who don't know him, D was born & raised in a wealthy family in Hong Kong, but left when the royal colony reverted to the Chinese in 1997.
He now resides in Singapore, where he operates two very successful airsoft manufacturing concerns, and is the holder of 17 patents in the industrial popcorn vending industry.

A lifelong student of the old Colt DA revolvers, D has an encyclopedic knowledge of the subject, and now spends much of his time in retirement sharing that knowledge with us on gun forums such as this.
His lovely wife, Camile, and his faithfull basset hound, Baskerville, are his constant companions.

Denis

On New Year's Day you're supposed to put the cork back in the bottle and sober up.

His name is Merlin and he's a black and silver Pomeranian.

DPris · January 2, 2013, 10:09 PM

Merlin?
What happened to Baskerville?
Denis

Jaywalker · January 3, 2013, 12:14 PM

Winchester_73,

My favorite snub loads have always been the standard pressure Nyclad, now owned by Federal, but I'd be willing to also try the Corbon DPX, also in standard pressure. The Nyclad is cataloged but hard to find, and the DPX is no longer cataloged. It's hard to find good standard pressure 38 Special loads.

January 2, 2013, 11:58 AM	#26
salvadore Senior Member Join Date: January 1, 2007 Posts: 1,366	Who's Grant Cunningham?

January 2, 2013, 12:52 PM	#27
Jaywalker Senior Member Join Date: November 16, 2001 Location: Texas Posts: 210	Grant Cunningham is a noted gunsmith: http://grantcunningham.com/revolver-services.html He is particularly known for his work in timing Colt DA revolvers. Unfortunately, he isn't taking anymore work right now. Check his "Library" for some very interesting articles. His piece on lubrication changed my methods about a year ago. Edited: Here is the article that I believe Winchester_73 is referring to: http://www.grantcunningham.com/blog_..._delicate.html

January 2, 2013, 02:03 PM	#28
DPris Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3,778	I sent an OP, a Trooper .357, and a DS to Grant, all for timing work. My Python timing was corrected locally. The timing issue extends across frame sizes & is inherent to the design. The pressures of the ammunition used and the frequency of use will determine how soon the hand wears, but eventually it WILL wear, timing WILL be affected, and it goes downhill from there. The hand performs two purposes in the V-Spring actions, on Smiths & Rugers it performs only one. That's why the old Colt hand is the major design weakness. You see the timing issue arise more commonly in the larger Colt frames simply because people by & large shoot the bigger frames more. That doesn't mean the D Frame is any less prone to hand wear. There's a reason why those guns are obsolete. Time & labor intensive to build, and they'll tend to require outside maintenance more often than a comparable Smith or Ruger with extensive use. If you choose to accept a gun that has timing issues, it's your choice. I choose not to shoot such a Colt. A Colt that starts out properly set up will simply run longer before it needs a hand replacement than one that starts out with a short hand. Denis

January 2, 2013, 04:38 PM	#29
Jaywalker Senior Member Join Date: November 16, 2001 Location: Texas Posts: 210	I can't be trusted at my local gun store. I found a like-new Colt Detective Special from about 1976 and brought it home with me. It has obviously not been carried as the blue looks good, no grip rubs or anything like that. I'll run Dfariswheel's test some more times, but it checked out pretty well, I thought, for my first time running it. The Bolt Drop Timing worked through several full cylinder turns, with one cylinder one time dropping into the slot itself rather than the ramp - the rest of the time into the ramp. The trigger stacks slightly towards the end of the pull, allowing me to know it's close to firing; as long as the rest stays in good timing I'll leave it like that. If it ever goes out of time, I'll probably have it adjusted to "no stack." The only real concern I have is whether or not I've just bought another "too pretty to shoot" piece. Pics tomorrow.

January 2, 2013, 04:43 PM	#30
DPris Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3,778	Good luck with it. Hope by the time it ever needs adjustment there'll still be somebody around who can do it for you. Denis

January 2, 2013, 08:35 PM	#31
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 6,574	For those who don't know him, D was born & raised in a wealthy family in Hong Kong, but left when the royal colony reverted to the Chinese in 1997. He now resides in Singapore, where he operates two very successful airsoft manufacturing concerns, and is the holder of 17 patents in the industrial popcorn vending industry. A lifelong student of the old Colt DA revolvers, D has an encyclopedic knowledge of the subject, and now spends much of his time in retirement sharing that knowledge with us on gun forums such as this. His lovely wife, Camile, and his faithfull basset hound, Baskerville, are his constant companions. Denis On New Year's Day you're supposed to put the cork back in the bottle and sober up. His name is Merlin and he's a black and silver Pomeranian.

January 2, 2013, 10:09 PM	#32
DPris Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3,778	Merlin? What happened to Baskerville? Denis

January 3, 2013, 12:14 PM	#33
Jaywalker Senior Member Join Date: November 16, 2001 Location: Texas Posts: 210	Winchester_73, My favorite snub loads have always been the standard pressure Nyclad, now owned by Federal, but I'd be willing to also try the Corbon DPX, also in standard pressure. The Nyclad is cataloged but hard to find, and the DPX is no longer cataloged. It's hard to find good standard pressure 38 Special loads.