The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Revolver Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 24, 2012, 12:42 AM   #1
three-fifty-seven
Member
 
Join Date: August 9, 2012
Posts: 64
Why not a 5 shot .44 magnum hunting revolver?s

Howdy folks,

I got thinking today and I am wondering how come no one currently makes a 5 shot .44 magnum hunting revolver (6" barrel)?

Personally, a .44 magnum chambered in a GP100 or a S&W L-frame would be a pretty convenient in the field.

So, anyone have any thoughts on my idea?

Last edited by three-fifty-seven; December 24, 2012 at 08:47 PM.
three-fifty-seven is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 12:52 AM   #2
Jim Watson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2001
Location: Alabama
Posts: 11,004
They are not big enough.
An L frame S&W - the 696 - is barely big enough for .44 Special and not real heavy loads at that.
Dave Clement will convert a GP 100 to .44 Special and says it is ok for a 250 at 1200, Keith loads. $1250 on your gun.

There have been some L frame conversions to .41 Special (not magnum) that will do over 1000 fps with a 210 gr bullet.
Jim Watson is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 07:56 AM   #3
Noreaster
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2011
Location: New England
Posts: 1,322
In my State your only allowed to load five rounds for hunting so a 5 shot would be nice! I was thinking a 5 shot 45 Colt but a 44 mag would be good.
Noreaster is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 08:04 AM   #4
bird_dog
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 26, 2004
Posts: 204
Taurus Tracker 5-shot.

I just bought one, but I agree that the frame might be a bit light for true magnum loads.

Looking forward to putting mine through the paces with some moderate loads. It's very light, quite compact and good to handle. I did replace the 'ribber' grips with a Hogue Monogrip, just because I don't like the looks of the ribber. Other than that, it's a very nice looking handgun, too. Mine is the blued version

(And before the Taurus bashing begins, I bought it because one of my two main hunting revolvers is the Taurus M44, which has been with me for many seasons of miserable weather, and has accounted for most of my handgun-killed deer. I mainly bought the Tracker to accompany on archery bear hunts in Maine, a job which my 629-4 used to do -- before I sold it. I know many here aren't fans, but I'm a big fan of Taurus and have owned nothing but reliable guns, including the M44, a snubbie 651B in .357, and the new Tracker.)

Last edited by bird_dog; December 24, 2012 at 08:10 AM.
bird_dog is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 08:17 AM   #5
spaniel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 26, 2008
Posts: 188
Ironically "bird_dog" beat me to it by a few minutes

http://www.taurususa.com/product-det...adcrumbseries=

I looked long and hard for almost a year before getting my hands on one of the fairly rare, discontinued Taurus Titanium Trackers in 41Mag (357s are much more common). The Trackers are not meant to be high volume, heavy load shooters. The cylinders are therefore too short for the heavy bullets. But my Titanium has handled several years of real magnum loads (not max loads) with no issues. I do carry max loads with 250gr bullets in grizzly country, which was why I bought the gun.

It is meant as a light, compact, powerful trail gun that you will always have on you, and in that role it performs very well. If you want a target gun buy something else; I shoot my heavy steel revolvers respectably but the couple lightweight ones I have are less accurate. Not the gun's fault, it is simply harder to shoot lightweight magnums with precision. I would not hesitate to shoot at deer within bow range though.

If you want a 44Mag that is easy to carry and will easily handly 240gr deer hunting loads, this is an option. But don't forget a good pair of electronic muffs; with the porting I guarantee you will regret it if you pull the trigger without them.
spaniel is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 08:25 AM   #6
kcub
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 24, 2010
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 2,016
I believe the Freedom Arms 83 in .44 magnum is a fivegun. I'd like to have one. It is heavy and handles recoil better than any other .44 mag and who needs .454 power anyways?
kcub is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 11:00 AM   #7
drail
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2008
Posts: 3,150
If you are required by law to only have 5 rounds in the gun then just load 5 rounds in any sixgun. The only reason the custom smiths build 5 shot .44 magnums is so people can shoot really ridiculous handloads with them.
drail is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 02:16 PM   #8
Mystro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 26, 2004
Location: Central Pa.
Posts: 1,146
There is 44mags you carry and 44mags you shoot. There is a huge trade off in recoil and accuracy. I briefly had a S&W 329. It is the lightest 44mag and by far recoiled harder than any of my 454 Casulls. In my handgun hunting experience, a S&W 629 6" is as good as it gets as far as carrying it all day and not giving up any accuracy. I hunted for years with the 454Casull. 454Casulls are too heavy of a platform to carry all day and over kill for deer. A 6"-6.5" 44mag is perfect.

I wouldnt sell this particular gun for twice what I paid for it.
__________________
"I'm a good guy with a gun" What do I care if I give up some freedom or rights?....The Goverment will take care of me. This kind of thinking is now in the majority and it should concern you.

"Ask not what you can do for your country, but what free entitlements you can bleed from your country"
Mystro is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 05:29 PM   #9
P-990
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2, 2002
Location: Only1/2WayThere
Posts: 1,053
Noreaster, which state are you in? In NH it only has to be limited to 5 if it's a detachable magazine. A 6-shot revolver is good-to-go (as-is a .30-30 with 6 in the tube).

Anyway, to the OP, as was said, it's a size issue. The L-frame and GP-100 were designed around the .357 and don't have a lot of room for "caliber improvement." So the full N-frames and big Redhawks and Super Blackhawks we get.
__________________
NRA Master, Highpower Rifle, Across-the-Course
NRA Expert, Highpower Rifle, Mid-Range Prone
P-990 is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 08:48 PM   #10
three-fifty-seven
Member
 
Join Date: August 9, 2012
Posts: 64
Quote:
They are not big enough.
An L frame S&W - the 696 - is barely big enough for .44 Special and not real heavy loads at that.
Dave Clement will convert a GP 100 to .44 Special and says it is ok for a 250 at 1200, Keith loads. $1250 on your gun.

There have been some L frame conversions to .41 Special (not magnum) that will do over 1000 fps with a 210 gr bullet.
So size is the limiting factor? Hmm...

Maybe one day Ruger will make a .44 Special Ruger GP100.
three-fifty-seven is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 10:01 PM   #11
drail
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2008
Posts: 3,150
The GP frame is not big enough. Even if they built it it wouldn't be any stronger than the L frame 696. Lay a GP next to a 696 and see how close they are dimensionally. The reason large frame .44 revolvers use a large frame is to end up with enough frame to wrap around that larger barrel shank and to allow a larger (stronger) cylinder to fit into the frame window. The barrel's forcing cone is the weak point on the 696. If you want to shoot real .44 Mag loads you need a large frame. The whole "let's make it as small and light as we can" concept has practical limits no matter how popular they are. We have begun to exceed these limits at this point in time. The first time I heard about an alloy .44 Mag snub I had to laugh. I can still remember when the first S&W N frame .44 mags hit the market. After about six months you could find them used in gunshops all over the country having been fired maybe 12 to 18 rounds (they would throw in the original box of ammo the previous owner couldn't finish off). Light guns are for carrying a lot and shooting a little. Big heavy steel guns are for shooting. You can't have it both ways.

Last edited by drail; December 24, 2012 at 10:17 PM.
drail is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 07:51 AM   #12
spaniel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 26, 2008
Posts: 188
A 5-shot 44 cylinder is going to be smaller than a 6. I wish I could put a 44 Tracker next to my 41 to see if they used the same frame and cylinder size. Frankly I thought they chambered in 41 because it was as big as they could go in a platform designed as a 7-shot 357. I'm not sure where they would remove more material to fit a 44 in it without increasing the size a bit.

IMO this is where the 41 missed its calling -- to me it serves more of a purpose as a bigger option to a 357 than as a smaller, heavier option in a 44-sized platform.

Regarding size, there really are advantages to the lighter, smaller 5-shot magnums and their heavier steel cousins. I own two lightweights (the 41 TI Tracker and a SW329, which is NOT the monster it is made out to be) and they are phenomenal trail guns and backup guns for shooting in bow range. I got tired of people telling me I needed to carry a brick that would pull my pants down into the backcountry as a last ditch backup weapon. But they are not target guns, high volume shooting guns or 100yd hunting guns, or appropriate for mounting optics; I have a 5" 629 on my wish list for those purposes.
spaniel is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 12:26 PM   #13
Tom Matiska
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 12, 2000
Location: Wilkes-Barre, Pa
Posts: 1,004
After finding a crack extending from the lockup cut on my 6 shot Dragoon I wondered why the lockup was cut into the thinnest part of the cylinder. All other things equal, I always thought of 5 shots as stronger because the lock up was between the bottom two chambers. Isn't that why Magnum Research makes their BFR's in 5 shots?
Tom Matiska is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 12:45 PM   #14
ClydeFrog
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2010
Posts: 5,798
5 shot .44magnum revolvers for hunting/outdoor use....

As posted, I'd think you could find a single action 5 cylinder .44magnum Freedom Arms or maybe a BFR(Kahr Arms). I don't see the major difference between a 5 & 6 shot .44magnum. Many gunners & hunters like the robust Ruger Super RedHawk .44 & .454 line.
I'm not a handgun hunter but I'd look at a BFR, Freedom Arms .454 or Ruger Super RedHawk for most game.
In PA, the state game commission mandates only 3 rounds in the chamber(for hunting).

ClydeFrog
ClydeFrog is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 01:06 PM   #15
drail
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2008
Posts: 3,150
Tom, that is exactly why the custom builders use a 5 shot cyl. - to place the bolt cuts between the chambers. When a cyl. lets go it almost always starts at the bolt cut over the chamber. A 5 shot cyl. gives you more steel all the way around the chamber. But you still have to have enough frame material to wrap around a heavy .44 barrel or thin the barrel down and lose forcing cone area. The Freedom Arms revolvers are some of the best quality revolvers money can buy. The fitting of every part on them is as close to perfect as humanly possible, like a tank made with Swiss craftsmanship. Keep it clean and oiled and it will last for generations of owners. I wish S&W or Ruger would develop a 5 round .41 mag. L frame sized gun. The .41 mag cartridge is very close to .44 mag. ballistics AND leaves more steel around the chambers and the barrel throat. And 5 .41 chambers will fit into most medium size revolver frame easily. Unfortunately the cartridge never caught on like the .44 mag. did and the ammo companies don't seem to want to support the market for it. A 215 gr. bullet @ 1000 fps. is a perfect round for a CCW revolver. IMO.

Last edited by drail; December 25, 2012 at 01:22 PM.
drail is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 01:22 PM   #16
solocam72
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 15, 2012
Location: Idaho
Posts: 221
What drail said! Freedom arms is a dream revolver to me! I need to just buy one and quit thinking about it!
solocam72 is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 01:23 PM   #17
BigJimP
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 23, 2005
Posts: 11,295
The model 83, large frame, Freedom Arms revolvers...are all 5 shot guns...so it'll meet your needs perfectly ....and they make guns in .44 mag and 6" barrels ...or whatever you want basically.

I have a large frame, 4 3/4" octagonal barrel they made for me in .357 mag and its a great gun - premier grade.

Here's mine...

http://thefiringline.com/forums/atta...0&d=1339790943
BigJimP is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 01:41 PM   #18
Tom Matiska
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 12, 2000
Location: Wilkes-Barre, Pa
Posts: 1,004
Clyde, PA State Game Regs limit long guns to three, pistols to 6 at Game Commission Shooting Ranges. Only three shot hunting restriction I read is for shotguns to be plugged to 3 shots for small game and waterfowl.
Tom Matiska is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 11:17 PM   #19
johnwilliamson062
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 16, 2008
Posts: 6,784
B/c if you want a light dedicated hunting gun you get a Contender...
How many of you have SUCCESSFULLY used a second shot hunting with a pistol that was not finishing a downed deer a mortally disabled deer?
__________________
$0 of an NRA membership goes to legislative action or court battles. Not a dime. Only money contributed to the NRA-ILA or NRA-PVF. You could just donate to the Second Amendment Foundation
First Shotgun Thread First Rifle Thread First Pistol Thread
johnwilliamson062 is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 11:24 PM   #20
drail
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2008
Posts: 3,150
I absolutely agree. The Thompson Contender was a GREAT idea for hunters and barrels were available for a huge number of calibers.
drail is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 03:58 AM   #21
ClydeFrog
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2010
Posts: 5,798
PA Game Commission rules/hunting laws...

As a youth in western PA, I recall my hunting safety class instructor & a few of my relatives saying you could only carry 3 rounds while hunting in PA. I don't remember them saying anything about rifles/shotguns/handguns.
I also know all to well about the PGC shooting range rules.
My good friend & co-worker and I were busted by a crooked wildlife officer over the range SOPs. We both pled; NOT GUILTY & were later vindicated by a district justice. We proved our case & pointed out the sworn game officer's errors.

Clyde
PS: The same PGC wildlife officer later became; "Officer of the Year".
ClydeFrog is offline  
Old December 27, 2012, 10:52 AM   #22
bird_dog
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 26, 2004
Posts: 204
Quote:
There is 44mags you carry and 44mags you shoot. There is a huge trade off in recoil and accuracy.
As a huge .44 fan (and handgun hunter), I couldn't disagree more. My deer-loads are what some would consider moderate (10.9gr Unique pushing a 240gr JSP or XTP), and I can shoot those in my 5-shot tracker no problem.

With handloading, I can get even milder trail loads (when I'm thinking "coyotes", not "bears"). In bear country my normal hunting loads do just fine.

I enjoy shooting my big hunting handguns, and my 4" 629, and my Tracker. I think you can (and should) shoot them all. If you need to load down a bit due to recoil sensitivity, you should. No sense carrying a gun you can't practice with, in my opinion.
bird_dog is offline  
Old January 1, 2013, 12:13 AM   #23
El Bango
Member
 
Join Date: December 23, 2012
Location: SW Colorado
Posts: 42
I think Dick Cassul used to make one but I have a few bubbles in my brain and I don't recall just when it was or the calibers...other than the .454.
El Bango is offline  
Old January 1, 2013, 12:35 AM   #24
bluetopper
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 16, 2005
Location: Paris, TX
Posts: 1,102
I've often wished this 5-shot, 10 inch Freedom Arms 44 Magnum was a 6 or 7.5 inch but I ran across it used and it was a heckuva deal so I have learned not to complain. And every time I get to thinking I want to send it in for a shorter barrel I get to thinking of how it groups at 100yds and I smile to myself and the urge passes.

__________________
I use Liberal tears as gun lubricant.
bluetopper is offline  
Old January 1, 2013, 09:13 PM   #25
tomrkba
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 29, 2011
Posts: 608
Load five in a Ruger Super Blackhawk and you're done. You can still load six safely; you're just downloading to meet the five shot requirement
tomrkba is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.12832 seconds with 7 queries