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Old December 19, 2012, 04:03 PM   #1
Perturbed Panda
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CCW- Check, Spare Mags- Check, Knifes- Check, Blowout Kit- WAIT...WHAT???

I'm just curious to get other's view on carrying a blowout/ IFAK on their persons when carrying concealed. I always get a strange look from people when I tell them that I carry one when I'm CCing.

I believe that this is an important part of an EDC kit, that often gets over looked. Not only could it save your life or one of you loved ones, but it could help you out in court. If the threat is neutralized, you should start to render aid to those that are injured; including the assailant.

Last edited by Perturbed Panda; December 19, 2012 at 04:11 PM.
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Old December 19, 2012, 04:31 PM   #2
Archie
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First Aid kit?

I keep a First Aid kit in the car all the time. I have a couple bandages (actually sanitary napkins) for 'bleeding wounds'. I was thinking primarily of being first on scene at a traffic accident, but that would also work for basic response to gun shot wounds as well.

If I shot someone in self-defense, I would render First Aid, depending on degree of wound and activity of the attacker, security of the site and anticipated response time of EMT and police. I would not just stand back and let anyone bleed out intentionally.
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Old December 19, 2012, 05:11 PM   #3
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first aid

I keep a large comprehensive first aid kit in my car, but I don't usually carry anything on my person. I might consider doing so if it wasn't for the fact that even a small first aid kit is bulky enough to be a nuisance.

As far as gunshot wounds go, clothing can be used to improvise dressings(another important reason to carry a knife). It's not great, but can at least keep someone from bleeding out until EMS arrives.
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Old December 19, 2012, 10:26 PM   #4
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Maybe I'm dense, but that's the first time I ever heard a first aid kit called a "blowout kit"...
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Old December 20, 2012, 12:41 AM   #5
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Galls.com PoliceHQ.com UScav.com ....

I've worked in LE, security & served in the US armed forces.
I'd think it's smart to have a small "blow out" kit or a few medic/first responder items if you are packing heat.
Quik-Clot is popular. I've seen a few pocket size 1 person kits here: www.galls.com www.uscav.com www.natchezss.com www.policehq.com .
Kits may help you render aid to a victim or protect yourself after a serious injury.
NOTE: I honestly wouldn't provide first aid to downed or wounded subject after a use of force incident. I'd contact 911/EMTs/fire-rescue & let them treat the injuries. I'm not a medical doctor & I'm not a sworn LE officer. I'm also 100% sure that after a shooting event, many "lie"-witnesses will claim you were hurting or torturing a harmless victim. As a security officer, I've seen events spin out of control by bystanders & "witnesses" who were pushing a agenda.
Consider too that a wounded subject could also be a threat or attack you.

Former US Surgeon General Richard Corena(check spelling), US Army combat veteran, medical doctor and sworn LE/SWAT officer had a documented incident where he was required to kill an attacker. The subject was in a motor vehicle accident & attacked Dr Corena as he ran to the scene to provide aid.

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Old December 20, 2012, 02:57 AM   #6
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I guess my want to render aid, comes from when I was sworn LE. I wouldn't worry about people lying about what I was doing. I would do what I needed to do to be able to sleep at night. If you verbalize exactly what you're doing, then there shouldn't be an issue. Obviously once law enforcement and EMS show up, they will see that you were controlling bleeding. Of course I would perform a cursory search of the individual before rendering aid. I don't need to get shot or stabbed by the person. Haha reminds me of my customary question before frisking people, "You don't have anything that's going to cut, prick, stab, bite or blow up on me? No guns, grenade, needles or bazookas, right?" :P
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Old December 20, 2012, 01:35 PM   #7
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True but....

I agree with being able to explain your acts or concerns but in general, I as a non-sworn armed citizen or licensed security officer would not give first aid to a wounded subject unless there were other officers on scene to help me or a bystander with a medical background offered to help.
I'd add that in 75-80% of these critical incidents no one would jump up and provide help. Most bystanders or crowds would wait for fire-rescue/EMS.
About a year & a half ago, I saw a young male(TV) get cut with a small knife after a dispute with another young male in a 7-11 store parking lot.
I was working a security post at a low end hotel across the street. The victim had a small gash in his chest & a lot of blood. I contacted 911/fire-rescue & law enforcement. The subject was arrested(with a police K9 unit) & charged for the crime but was later released & the entire case closed.
To provide aid or medical care in a emergency is good but don't put your safety at risk.

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Old December 20, 2012, 01:48 PM   #8
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Do you possess the skill to adequately use a blow out kit, a first aid kit? I carry a blow out kit in my "kit" at work, at home in the car along with but separate from my first aid kit.

To those unsure, a blow out kit is really intended for if "YOU" get shot so you can treat yourself or your partner uses yours to treat you.

I do not walk around with a blow out kit. With the skill set you can improvise a lot of bandages temporarily until the Calvary arrives.
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Old December 20, 2012, 06:08 PM   #9
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I was a bit confused by the title. I thought a blow out kit was comprised of tire plugs, and rubber cement.
That being said, I think it prudent to always have pertinent first aid supplies handy. I have been in a couple motorcycle wrecks over the years. Most LEO's are not issued first aid kits. I found that out the hard way, twice. I rely only on myself for protection, and survival. However, I think training is more important than products. You can have the best trauma kit in the world, but it doesn't do you any good if you don't know how to use it efficiently. Likewise a properly trained person can do amazing things with just the knowledge and practical application of their skills.
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Old December 20, 2012, 06:24 PM   #10
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I would certainly hope that no one carries anything they're not trained with, and 100% comfortable in using. With my kit I can assess/ treat one person. I can control bleeding, establish an airway, treat a pneumothorax wound and I carry a few meds as well.
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Old December 20, 2012, 06:34 PM   #11
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Carrying some sort of trauma kit is a good idea. I would definitely recommend getting training and carry some basic medical items.

Here is a very good video done by the late Paul Gomez on his very minimal yet effective daily carry trauma kit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47yDBpyDCyM

I live in a state that does not allow me to carry on my person and I still carry a similar trauma kit.
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Old December 21, 2012, 05:18 AM   #12
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I keep one in my car not on my person.

I would provide first aid/cpr to someone I shot if I was fairly sure the scene was secure. Good Samaritan protects you from being sued. You would have to ask a lawyer but I would think it would give you some cover if a survivor lived and tried to sue you as well. Either way its the right thing to do. In combat we provided medical aid to the enemy if at all possible.
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Old December 21, 2012, 07:59 AM   #13
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I have a "crash kit" in my motorcycle tailbag. It has a plastic bag and tape to cover a sucking chest wound, surgical tubing to tie off limbs with punctured arteries, and a coagulant powder to stop major bleeding. The basic scenario is to make sure their airway is clear and stop any major bleeding in hope they won't expire while I ride off for more competent help.

There are some other items in the crash kit - three chemical light sticks and a Mylar "space blanket" - for marking the crash site, since the areas we used to ride were winding mountain roads with no cellular service. Finding the site again, particularly in the dark or in the rain, could be a big problem. The whole package replaced one of the water bottles I carried in the tailbag. You wouldn't need anything like that for a gunshot kit.


Some people find the selection odd. My scenario was basically to be able to stop someone from bleeding out while I left them to go find help, which might take a while, and to be able to find them again later. I wound up being first on the scene at serious crashes *twice* on the same day back in 2006, which is what prompted me to put the kit together.
There are still vast areas where there ain't no freakin' cellular service, and you have to go beat on someone's door and ask them to make a call on their land line... if they have one.
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Old December 23, 2012, 09:13 PM   #14
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In general, I feel that a person who decides to ccw has a responsibility to have a good holster, know their State firearms laws, be proficient in the use of their firearm and it safe handling. I will carry trauma related supplies if I plan on being 100 miles away from civilization or something similar. Thats just me but I wont talk anyone out of running around with 10 different kits on them if thats what they feel like doing.
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Old December 23, 2012, 09:55 PM   #15
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If you are thinking of rendering help for a person with a GSW, study up on BSI Scene Safe first. Then incurable hepatitis, stds, community mrsa and other nasties from poor life choices. For a chest wound, think tension pneumothorax possibility, etc, etc.
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Old December 23, 2012, 10:16 PM   #16
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Im a paramedic so Im not the average bear but I carry a full ALS jump kit in my car for my part time special events job (without being on duty or having an ALS ambulance on scene I can only treat to a bls level). Im not usually out alone so if there is a situation my wife or kid can go get the kit. Until then I can improvise.
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Old December 24, 2012, 07:20 AM   #17
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Quote:
Then incurable hepatitis, stds, community mrsa and other nasties from poor life choices.
Back in the day, I would and have helped in cases of GSW and other injuries.
Nowadays, the persom amking the poor choice to attack me has likely made many other poor choices and has one or more incurables diseases. They may even be hyped up enough to attack again, or at least enough to struggle and sling more blood onto me.
I just don't know how I'd handle myself now.
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Old December 24, 2012, 07:38 AM   #18
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These are all really good points, but if I could help an individual I would. Even if it happens to be an imbecile I had to use force on. My conscience would dictate it.
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Old December 24, 2012, 08:13 AM   #19
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...my bet is that you very likely wont feel that way after a horrible event where you had to shoot someone.
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old December 24, 2012, 08:33 AM   #20
Perturbed Panda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skadoosh
...my bet is that you very likely wont feel that way after a horrible event where you had to shoot someone.
Well considering I've trained that way for years working for a SO, I believe I would. I won't say that it will 100% going to happen, but we fight and operate how we train.
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Old December 24, 2012, 08:47 AM   #21
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Knock yourself out. Personally I seriously doubt I will be rendering assistance to anyone who just attacked me and was forced to shoot.
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old December 24, 2012, 09:42 AM   #22
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My scenario would be more along the line of helping a victim or bystander.
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Old December 24, 2012, 10:31 AM   #23
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Not gun related, but I'll mention it anyway (because it effects me).

One of the most common killers in America is Heart Attacks, yet I've seen no one mention carrying a small bottle of Nitro pills, those little suckers saved a heck of a lot of lives.
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Old December 24, 2012, 11:18 AM   #24
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…..you should start to render aid ….. including the assailant.
Nope, not the assailant. I’m an EMT, and one of the main rules for us is to not go anywhere near, or into a place where our lives may be in danger. We let Law Enforcement secure the area / building, then we proceed.

The assailant just tried to kill you, or someone, otherwise you or someone else never would have shot him. His intent was to cause harm to others. For all you know, his intent is to still cause harm to you or others. The area is not secure, therefore an EMT would not be allowed to proceed with emergency medical assistance. When the bad guy has been checked by Law Enforcement, and handcuffed, then I would render assistance. Until then, I am standing back in a safe area waiting.

I would render aid to innocent bystanders that may have gotten hurt, if I felt it was safe to do so, but not to the gunman until Law Enforcement gave me the okay. Rules may vary from state to state, but according to the Illinois Department of Public Health, I should not attempt aid in an unsafe area.

Also, if the assailant has a firearm on or near him, Law Enforcement are the ones that are to disarm him, not EMT’s. You can totally ruin a crime scene by removing / moving firearms used in said crime. I know an EMT that did just that. A home intruder was shot by a home owner. EMT’s beat the Police to the scene. Upon entering the home, the bad guy was laying in the living room bleeding out. The EMT picked up a .357 revolver laying next to the bad guy and placed it on a shelf in the room. After hauling him to the hospital, Detectives proceeded with the investigation. They did not find the bad guys weapon, even though the home owner claimed he had one. Caused a real mess in the investigation until the EMT contacted the Police and explained what he did.

Nope, as far as I’m concerned, the bad guy will have to wait for my assistance.
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Old December 24, 2012, 11:50 AM   #25
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One of the most common killers in America is Heart Attacks, yet I've seen no one mention carrying a small bottle of Nitro pills, those little suckers saved a heck of a lot of lives.
Are those not controlled? Wouldn't you need a prescription? Or would you be nailed for prescribing medication without a license etc? They say that at the onset of heart attack symptoms a simple aspirin increases survivability significantly.
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