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Old December 29, 2012, 11:05 AM   #26
drail
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OK how many people have you seen killed with a nuclear weapon? If you haven't seen anyone killed by one then I guess that's just another one of those internet theories.

Last edited by drail; December 29, 2012 at 11:13 AM.
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Old December 29, 2012, 12:33 PM   #27
KyJim
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JMortimer said:
Quote:
-1 to what KyJim said. 8.5" of penetration in 10% ballistic gelatin. That is out of a J Frame at 866 fps. It do expand but it don't penetrate. To each his own, but with that anemic and impotent penetration, I'd go somewhere else. Here is Brassfetcher video for same:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=1RcbrUjcPAQ
The Corbon 110 grain DPX is clearly better choice.
Keep in mind that the ballistic gel tests at Brass Fetchers are practically worthless. You'll note the video you linked to stated it was was 20% ballistic gel and standard is 10%. There's also no mention of calibration (which would be meaningless anyway since they are using a non-standard mix).

American Rifleman tested them. Five shot average in 10% calibrated ballistic gel was 11 inches penetration and expansion to .577 inches. http://www.americanrifleman.org/Arti...id=1390&cid=32.


Here's another where the tester used 10% calibrated ballistic gel. Through four layers of denim, penetration was 13 3/4 inch and expansion was .593 inches. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khazbS9pWjE

Take a look at this test in Sim-Test Ballistic medium (equivalent to 10% calibrated ballistic gel) from tnoutdoors9 at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k890Rio2oBY. Penetration through four layers of denim is 12 3/8 inches and expansion to .544 inches average.

All the bullets above retained practically their entire weight.

You can find similar results in test after test. Don't get hung up on Brass Fetchers. I used to really devour every thing they wrote until someone pointed out details like the 20% gel mix.

BTW, not saying there is anything wrong with DPX or certain other loads. However, I have found Gold Dots to be consistently good performers across a variety of handgun calibers and they have shown good performance repeatedly in tests.
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Old December 29, 2012, 01:32 PM   #28
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Quote:
OK how many people have you seen killed with a nuclear weapon?
I have seen pictures.........
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Old December 30, 2012, 02:27 AM   #29
mj246
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Quote:
Keep in mind that the ballistic gel tests at Brass Fetchers are practically worthless. You'll note the video you linked to stated it was was 20% ballistic gel and standard is 10%
-KyJim
Just to note, don't discount everything at Brass Fetcher too hastily. most of their actual full tests and write ups are indeed done with calibrated 10% gel. Why on earth they would use 20% ballistics gel for all those videos is beyond me. Perhaps they wanted to make sure nothing went past the block, or maybe they were only interested in energy transfer (based on the charts they have in the videos) as opposed to wound simulation, but i really don't know.

Either way, if you look at the actual test write-ups, such as the newer ones with bone simulant, or the summary tables of their older tests, they are all done using calibrated 10% ballistics gelatin (although you are correct that the exact calibration isn't always listed).

P.S. I am in no way affiliated with Brass Fetcher. I Just appreciate their work.
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Old December 30, 2012, 02:56 AM   #30
jmortimer
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"I have found Gold Dots to be consistently good performers across a variety of handgun calibers and they have shown good performance repeatedly in tests."

Good points. Most of Brassfetcher's testing is 10% and the video is 20%. One thing is for sure, the Gold Dots can hold up to a lot of speed. The .38 Special does not seem to take full advantage of the Gold Dot.
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Old December 30, 2012, 04:45 PM   #31
Hook686
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Quote:
One thing is for sure, the Gold Dots can hold up to a lot of speed. The .38 Special does not seem to take full advantage of the Gold Dot.
The Gold Dots used in the .38 Short Barrel loads does seem to have been designed for the speed obtained in a snub nose revolver. High speed does not seem to be an issue here.


Quote:
This ammo is designed specifically for short barrel compact guns. It is designed to give you the velocity needed out of a short barrel weapon to get optimum expansion at short ranges.

http://www.slickguns.com/product/38-...gr-p-ammo-2995
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Old December 31, 2012, 12:31 AM   #32
rwsmith
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Differing philosophies

Do you subscribe to the high velocity/light bullet philosophy or the low velocity/heavy bullet thinking? I can't decide so I stay in the middle with 125 gr JHP +P which seems to be the best trade-off in bullet energy. One thing that makes me lean to the heavy bullet theory though is that there is no question that the .45 ACP is a reliable man stopper and I figure a slower but heavier bullet like the .38 +P 158 gr. JHP is a not-quite-as powerful analog to the .45s performance. The .357 also has a good reputation as an effective stopper but in the house I'll stick to the .38+P because I would like to keep my hearing.
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Old December 31, 2012, 12:38 AM   #33
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I like the Cor-Bon DPX Barnes 110gr. +P the best in a snub.

Good penetration and minimal recoil for a +P.
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Old December 31, 2012, 12:48 AM   #34
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^^^^^^^^
I don't think there is any better load out there if you want an expanding bullet.
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