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Old December 7, 2012, 06:33 PM   #1
blackvans1234
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That guy online? "I'm better with my .45 than my .40s"

Random guy online says, "With training and practice n the right weapon she'd be just as accurate with a .40 (when compared to a 9mm). I'm better with my .45 then both of my .40's."

Could this be true?
If someone picks up a .45 , and then a .40, would they be inherently more accurate with the .40? (assuming same experience with both firearms)
Same goes for a .40 when compared to a 9mm
I would guess that due to the recoil of said firearms, two things would happen (one, the other, or both): spread is greater, total elapsed time to shoot full mag on target is greater.
Or is this just an inaccurate assumption?

My guess is that Mr. Macho online practices with his .45 much more than both of his .40's, which is why he's ''better'' with it.

I think that this person (female) would not practice weekly with either firearm regardless, so this ''practice makes proficient'' argument is null.
Opinions?
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Old December 7, 2012, 06:52 PM   #2
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I have not read the referenced thread, so I'm not sure I am taking the context correctly, but...

In my opinion, with the proper practice and instruction, the average shooter can become proficient with most any well designed, quality handgun.

That said, some people are drawn to a certain design and "click" with it. In my case, the fist handgun I ever fired was my dad's WWII 1911, when I was about 8 years old. I did not fire it more than probably three-four rounds total. He sold it shortly thereafter, and my folks split up not so much later (maybe she booted him for selling the 1911 ). I didn't pick up another handgun until I joined the USN in 1977...and guess what that was?

Again, I only fired the few familiarization rounds, and again didn't pick up another gun for another five years or so.

When I went to buy my own first handgun, guess which way I went?

Since then I have bought/tried/carried/sold a bunch of different designs. What do I shoot best? Take a guess.

What do I shoot second best? Surprisingly (to me) an S&W K/L/N-frame. I had only shot a revolver a couple of times, long ago, and neither experience was very positive. However, in the last ten years I have owned several and like them quite a bit. Just goes to show, life can take some strange turns.

Hope this helps.
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Old December 7, 2012, 07:09 PM   #3
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In a firearm of equal weight (like that's gonna be the norm, right?) I find the .45 ACP recoil to be more pleasant/controllable than the .40S&W ....
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Old December 7, 2012, 07:24 PM   #4
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In my opinion, as an instructor who has worked at a busy professional firearms training school for over a decade:

1) Beginning semi-auto shooters tend to learn best and fastest on mid-size, mid-weight DAO 9mm guns.

2) Beginning revolver shooters tend to learn best and fastest with a mid-size steel revolver in .38 Spl.

3) People who start on .40 S&W almost always develop a deep-seated flinch problem that takes a lot of effort (and ammo) to overcome.

4) People who start on a .45 ACP tend to have less trouble with flinch than those who start on a .40, and more trouble with speed than those who start on a 9mm.

5) People who start with tiny little lightweight guns often develop multiple poor shooting habits, and often have a very difficult time internalizing muzzle control.

There are exceptions to every single one of these rules of thumb. (The race isn't always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong -- but that's the way to bet, especially when $500 or more, plus your life, is riding on it.)

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Old December 7, 2012, 08:18 PM   #5
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My old coach was better with the 45 than he was the 22 and that is why he won most of his matches, shooting centerfire and hardball with the 45. My buddy and I could match him with the 22 and 38 but fell way behind with the 45 so yeah it can be true. I'm better with my 44 mag then I am my .357 my 38 spcl, or 40 cal., go figure and I am just plain bad with the 9MM but I am going to blame the gun for that one because I can't be that bad.
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Old December 7, 2012, 08:25 PM   #6
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With my experience the 45 recoils less than the 40 in similar guns. I shoot the 45 better than the 40. I am somewhat macho
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Old December 7, 2012, 09:56 PM   #7
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I just have never felt the .40 SW to be very snappy or hard recoiling at all. To be fair though, I had quite a bit of experience by the time I bought a .40 caliber pistol.
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Old December 7, 2012, 10:25 PM   #8
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I am more accurate with both 9mm and .45acp compared to .40s&w. The only platforms I have used all three them is the Glock, XD and 1911. I am honestly just not a fan of the .40 cartridge. It seems "snappy" as others have described.
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Old December 7, 2012, 10:36 PM   #9
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People put far too much emphasis on the loading, and not enough on the gun. First-time shooters want "a .40" because that's what their friend told them they needed, based on something they heard from a guy who once knew a cop. There are usually mentions of stopping power and/or knockdown power.

.40 is a high-pressure loading in a short casing, and it's darned snappy. It is not a beginner's cartridge any more than .357 Magnum is, and it's no fun at all in the small, light guns that are so much in favor these days.

I'll take .45 in a steel gun over a Glock 27 any day of the week, and as Kathy pointed out, new shooters place themselves at a real disadvantage by choosing the latter.

...of course, if I had my way, everyone would start with a .22, then work their way up to .38 in a medium-frame steel revolver before ever touching an automatic in a service cartridge.
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Old December 7, 2012, 10:45 PM   #10
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I'd agree with the rest, I prefer and shoot better with a .45 ACP compared to the .40 S&W. That being said I shoot my .45 quite a bit and don't own a .40 I've also only shot a couple different .40s so there may be one out there that I could shoot better. I think the reason I like the .45 better is the recoil is much easier to deal with and I can get more accurate follow up shots off faster.

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Old December 7, 2012, 10:55 PM   #11
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+1 for Pax's input.
Istarted on a 9mm, bought a 22, then a .380.
I shot a 1911 for the first time this week and loved it. Less recoil than my .380.
I do better with heavier guns for follow up shots.
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Old December 7, 2012, 11:01 PM   #12
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The first handgun I ever shot was a Colt Detective Special .38 - 45 years ago. I carried one in Vietnam. In the last 20 years or so I've shot and bought a number of handguns ranging from a Ruger Mk II to a S&W 629 8 3/8ths. Nevertheless, I have never fired handguns in any competition and have not shot them extensively. I've had a Kahr P40 and still have a P45. Recoil from the .40 was "sharper", quicker, and probably had more adverse effect on accuracy then recoil from the .45. However, with my arthritic hands, neither is comfortable - too light for the recoil. I've sold the .40 and intend to sell the .45. An aluminum, or better yet, a steel framed 1911 .45 is much more comfortable to shoot. I think learning to shoot a .22 handgun is the best way to start. If my .300 Win Mag was the first rifle I ever shot, I would probably be a golfer rather than a hunter (no offense intended).
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Old December 8, 2012, 10:49 AM   #13
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Just as an anecdote, I saw a person start with a Glock in 357 Sig and it was way too much - as said above, switched to a 9 and was much more comfortable.
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Old December 8, 2012, 11:17 AM   #14
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I am more accurate with my .45's due to the fact they fit my hand better(single stack). The .45 has became my "goto" and CCW pistol in the past few years. Double stck pistols do not fit me well, so I am not as comfortable with them. So it isn't about "Machoness", but comfort to me.
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Old December 8, 2012, 11:35 AM   #15
treg
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Quote:
"With training and practice n the right weapon she'd be just as accurate with a .40 (when compared to a 9mm). I'm better with my .45 then both of my .40's."
First sentence: Agree 100%.

Second sentence: Internet commando announcing to the world that HE owns three guns.
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Old December 8, 2012, 11:42 AM   #16
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Quote:
My guess is that Mr. Macho online practices with his .45 much more than both of his .40's, which is why he's ''better'' with it.
Or Mr. Macho is an Internet gunsel just blowing smoke. This is the Internet, after all.

If you're wondering whether to get a .40 vs. something else, the answer is "maybe, if it's big enough." There's a lot of other factors involved.
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Old December 8, 2012, 12:39 PM   #17
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Bringing a 9mm to competitions and you get accused of cheating. Why, because you can fire the 9mm faster and more accurately then say a 357 sig or 40 S&W. There are many shooters who are faster and more accurate with bigger calibers then I am with my 9mm, but for the most part any shooter will probably shoot better with a reduced load in the same type of firearm they are use to shooting.
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Old December 8, 2012, 12:42 PM   #18
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I am better with my 45s as well but I do shoot them a lot more.

I have a PX4 in 40 that is great but I shoot better groups with the 45s

Just a matter of familiarity
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Old December 8, 2012, 01:11 PM   #19
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The fit of the pistol has a great deal to do with how well a new shooter performs.

Too many shooters select the latest greatest or what their buddies like. They do not take into account the grip and what I call point ability.

if the grip is to large or to small the shooter cannot control the pistol.

If the pistol does not naturally fall with the site aligned, the shooter will have a great deal of difficulty shooting the weapon accurately.

For example I cannot shoot the little NAA mini revolver. It flys out of my hand when I shot it. Try as hard as I can I have never fired one were it did not hit the ground after the first shot.

The ruger MK II or III are not comfortable for me to shoot. I will score 50% less on a National Match course with my Ruger Mk II target than I will with a S&W Model 41.

I am most accurate with a 1911 with a flat back strap shooting hardball. When I shoot to the light wad loads my accuracy decreases.

The new shooter should concentrate on a good fitting pistol with a recoil that is comfortable. they can then concentrate on the fundamentals of Site alignment, body position, grip, Breathing and trigger control. (they are not in order of importance).

Having mastered those fundamentals, they can experiment with other weapons and calibers.
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Old December 8, 2012, 01:36 PM   #20
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I tried tried TRIED to love my Glock 22. I just couldn't do it. I found the .40 too snappy for my tastes, personally.

When I traded it, I mentioned to the sales rep that I found my Glock 30 (subbie in .45) much more pleasant to shoot, and he looked at me like I had three heads.


Oh well, to each their own!
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Old December 8, 2012, 02:20 PM   #21
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Great post Kathy!

I probably had 10,000 thru my single six before I went into the Army and used a 1911. After that it was 357 magnum's but I had been shooting for a decade and still shot crappy with the 357 for some time.

I agree with Tom a .40 and a 357 are not beginners guns.
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Old December 8, 2012, 09:54 PM   #22
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Quote:
First-time shooters want "a .40" because that's what their friend told them they needed, based on something they heard from a guy who once knew a cop. There are usually mentions of stopping power and/or knockdown power.
Way too broad of a statement. I picked my FNP40 because it felt the most natural in my hand out of probably 20 handguns. I spent plenty of time reading on several forums before I settled on 40 caliber, and picked up snap caps way early and used the hell out of them after I bought my gun. Once I was able to focus on the front sight my groups went from stupid to very good in just a couple of range trips. I understood the front sight concept but my eye/brain coordination needed some repetition. I did find myself anticipating recoil but trained myself out of it very quickly. I shoot my buddy's .45 way better than he shoots it, and my other buddy with a 357 can hardly hit a paper plate @ 7yds while I'm poking holes in a 2" center and have shot those calibers only those times. Its not prodigious talent, but it really isn't that big a deal for a beginner to shoot a .40.
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Old December 8, 2012, 10:03 PM   #23
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It's the man behind the gun. You can't generalize one is better than another. The platform of the gun, weight, sights, etc.....
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Old December 9, 2012, 11:12 AM   #24
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I have a 92FS, very smooth, light recoil, I really like it. Bought a Taurus 100 in .40, shot straight, felt recoil about twice what the 9mm was. A 1911 in .45 cal. is in between the other two. I haven't fired a 1911 in .40 cal so I don't know how it would compare to the .45. I really see no need for the .40 cal. but I don't feel the need for the high cap mags that are so popular right now. I traded the Taurus for an LC9, really like it.
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Old December 9, 2012, 12:27 PM   #25
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I love what all three moderators had to say. Completely factual in my eyes.


Yes, .45 is a push into your hand. While .40 (what I learned on for the academy) is a flip up on the front of the gun. A "snap". So that so called "macho man" online, is indeed correct.

Was I efficient with the .40? Yes...Was it easy? No. Would it have been costly to me to invest all that time in .40 when I could have done it in half the time with 9mm? Yes.

I shoot 9mm and .45 way better than I shot .40, which is why I made the switch.
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