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Old December 28, 2012, 11:25 AM   #1
stargazer65
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Understanding Grandfathered "assault" weapon reqts

If the bill passed: My wife's carry gun meets the characteristics of an assault weapon in this bill. Where would she start the paperwork process for this NFA stuff?

From the Feinstein bill:
Quote:
Requires that grandfathered weapons be registered under the National Firearms Act, to include:
Background check of owner and any transferee;
Type and serial number of the firearm;
Positive identification, including photograph and fingerprint;
Certification from local law enforcement of identity and that possession would not violate State or local law; and
Dedicated funding for ATF to implement registration.
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Old December 28, 2012, 11:32 AM   #2
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I imagine the same way one would process any other NFA item.

This should give you a start: http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/nfa-handbook/
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Old December 28, 2012, 12:26 PM   #3
kenny87ky
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you really shouldn't worry about this till you have an idea if it will even become a law,focus on fighting it rather than accepting something that has not happened, from what I can read most handguns do not fit the definition of an assault weapon though she is after those magazines, magazines are not nfa though. Unless of course she conceals an AK 47 or has one of those evil so called assault pistols like a tec 9 or mac 10.
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Old December 28, 2012, 12:35 PM   #4
hermannr
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Don't concede anything...I would suggest a campaign to repeal the restrictive gun laws you already have and transfer the presently spent funds that are used for restrictive gun control to mental heath treatment.

The state would get more for it's buck that way.
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Old December 28, 2012, 12:54 PM   #5
carguychris
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IMHO there is not much "grandfathering" going on if existing owners of newly NFA'd items have to undergo the background check, fingerprinting, positive ID, and LE certification rigmarole.

I expect that numerous coastal and certain Midwest urban areas (the usual suspects, you know where they are...) will quickly pass restrictive state or local laws disallowing possession, which will give large numbers of current owners legal standing to argue that the law is effectively an unfairly punitive uncompensated taking, thereby potentially throwing the whole thing into a legal never-never land.

As I've posted in previous threads, I'm more concerned that it will evolve into a sort of "NFA Lite" that largely leaves existing owners alone but enacts punitive taxes on the sale of the items.
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Old December 28, 2012, 01:23 PM   #6
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NFA type regulation of handguns would present serious, and likely insurmountable, Constitutional challenges. In United States v. Miller, SCOTUS ruled that the NFA was not in violation of the 2A because the weapons it regulated (a short-barrel shotgun in the case of Miller) were not "in common usage nor particularly suitable for usage" by the militia and thus not afforded protection by 2A. In Heller v. District of Columbia, however, SCOTUS specifically ruled that a handgun (a 1911 in the case of Heller) was "in common usage" and "particularly suitable" and thus fell under the protection of 2A.

So, from these two cases we seem to have a precedent that the NFA is only constitutional because it applies only to weapons which are not of a class protected by 2A. This would seem to imply that it would be unconstitutional for NFA regulations to be applied to weapons of a protected class and, per Heller handguns are most certainly of a protected class.

Now, so-called "assault weapons" may or may not be of a protected class as SCOTUS has said nothing about them. Justice Scalia did mention in the Heller decision that "dangerous or unusual" weapons could be heavily regulated or banned, but he left what exactly constitutes a "dangerous or unusual" weapon ambiguous. That being said, even if "assault weapons" are ruled to constitute a "dangerous or unusual" weapon, the only way that I can see handguns being able to qualify as "assault weapons" would be in the cases of very specific types of handguns which have very distinguishing features setting them apart for other handguns. For example, I could see AR and AK pistols specifically being banned or made NFA weapons much easier than I could semi-automatic handguns in general.
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Old December 28, 2012, 02:27 PM   #7
Alabama Shooter
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They will have to figure out a better way to do it. I might give assault weapons to my children for Christmas. They have no ID.
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Old December 28, 2012, 03:37 PM   #8
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stargazer65
If the bill passed: My wife's carry gun meets the characteristics of an assault weapon in this bill. Where would she start the paperwork process for this NFA stuff?

From the Feinstein bill:...
[1] That's really not from the bill. That's just a summary of what the actual bill will cover. The exact words of the bill will matter a great deal, and it's impossible to really answer the question of how it will work without looking at the exact words.

[2] The actual bill hasn't been introduced, let alone passed. The bill will probably have a tough time in Congress and might never get enacted.

[3] In any case, a bill that is finally adopted is almost never exactly the same as the bill as introduced. As a bill moves through the process it is very likely to get changed considerably.
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Old December 28, 2012, 07:32 PM   #9
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Don't worry about what might happen. Fight tooth and nail right now to stop the proposed new AWB.
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Old December 28, 2012, 11:10 PM   #10
Tom Servo
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Quote:
Justice Scalia did mention in the Heller decision that "dangerous or unusual" weapons could be heavily regulated or banned, but he left what exactly constitutes a "dangerous or unusual" weapon ambiguous.
Ah, but he also said the 2A protects weapons "in common use." I'd say that a rifle widely used in hunting, target shooting, competition, and home defense would qualify. Bonus points for being commonly used in law enforcement as well.
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Old December 28, 2012, 11:18 PM   #11
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If the courts were to apply the "in common use" test, from Heller, nothing from the AR platform would qualify as "dangerous and unusual."

The firearm must be both dangerous (and all firearms qualify for that description) and unusual (there is nothing unusual about a firearm that is in common use).

As to opening up the NFA to register these "assault weapons," I believe the Congress would have to rewrite the NFA. It is very specific as to what qualifies.
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Old December 29, 2012, 12:36 AM   #12
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I guess here in NY , they just gonna take all our guns. NFA doesn't exist here.
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Old December 29, 2012, 12:44 AM   #13
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Sweet Jeebus folks. Worry about how to cross the flood when the bridge is gone. Until then STFU and start filling sandbags like the rest of us.

Write letters.
Send emails.
Teach/educated others.

Until a law gets passed nobody knows what the final language will be. Our job right now is twofold.

1-Stop any laws from passing that are both arbitary and unconstitutional.
2-Help be part of the solution (if possible). How do we stop the criminal/the insanse/ from being able to commit heinous acts?

So stop looking for cheap PMAGs and start writing senators and representatives.

Sigh, my two cents.

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Last edited by cslinger; December 29, 2012 at 12:50 AM.
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Old December 29, 2012, 08:31 AM   #14
Tom Servo
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Quote:
NFA doesn't exist here.
The NFA is a federal law, so it applies in all 50 states.
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Old December 29, 2012, 10:08 AM   #15
stargazer65
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I hadn't thought about the fact that the bill summary and the NFA definitions are at odds with each other. Her handgun is an XD9. About the same gun as a GLock 17 which one article cited here as "the best selling gun in the world". So they would be hard pressed to call it unusual.
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Old December 29, 2012, 10:12 AM   #16
stargazer65
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If they passed the bill at least we would have the assurance that we are being kept safe from evil gun toting soccer moms like my wife.
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Old December 31, 2012, 02:16 AM   #17
62coltnavy
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As I read the summary, it outlaws ALL semiauto handguns with detachable mags EXCEPT those that have a fixed magazine not capable of holding more than 10 rounds.
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Old December 31, 2012, 02:32 PM   #18
stargazer65
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Quote:
EXCEPT those that have a fixed magazine not capable of holding more than 10 rounds.
That's another thing I don't understand from that bill, what handguns have a large fixed magazine?
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Old December 31, 2012, 02:49 PM   #19
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I seem to recall during the gun ban someone came out with 150 round .22rf auto pistol with a fixed magazine. It was huge and "ray gun" looking. I can't recall the name of it right now though.
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Old December 31, 2012, 02:51 PM   #20
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Until a bill is passed and signed into law, nobody can
accurately answer questions about how to comply with
it's provisions.
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