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Old December 3, 2012, 12:41 PM   #1
Idaho Spud
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Nipples & caps

One of the frustrations I've experienced in my new hobby (C&B revolvers) is finding caps that fit properly. Been using CCI 11's cuz that's what's available. I know Rem 10's are what I need , but no dice, here. So I pinch. Yes, I know of the potential hazards, but what's a body to do? I don't shoot enough BP to justify mail-order of caps with the attendant expense.

It seems that if either the cap manufacturers or the nipple makers would standardize their offerings that one or the other would be forced to comply in order to market their product. How nice it would be to buy a "10" or "11" of any brand and know it work. Primers are now fairly standard, why not caps?

Since the CCI 11's are all I can use, here, I've decided to not pinch, but crimp. I have an old wire crimp/strip tool and I plan to enlarge and lap the #10 wire strip hole til it just reduces the bottom of the #11 cap's skirt to fit my nipples. Tedious, I know, but no more so than pinching and mebbee safer? Has anyone done this and what do you think?
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Old December 3, 2012, 01:35 PM   #2
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I feel your pain. I've got tons of CCI 10s and 11s - one is too small and the other too big, except for a couple of guns. I either squish or push hard with an unsharpened pencil, neither of which is optimal.

Seems to me that if you've got the time and patience to crimp those #11s down a bit, it's probably worthwhile.
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Old December 3, 2012, 01:42 PM   #3
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If the caps, CCI 11, are loose, you need CCI 10. Not Rem 10s. You will find that the Rem 10s have a larger ID than the CCI 11 does.
If all you can get are 11s, I think your idea should work fine. Personally, I'd just pinch em a bit.
Good luck and enjoy. Cap and Ball revolvers are great fun.
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Old December 3, 2012, 01:54 PM   #4
Idaho Spud
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Thanks Hardcase. Well I made my "crimp" tool, works fine. Caps come out round instead of oval and fit the nipples not too loosely but still can be removed with my fingernail. This is UNFIRED. I've not shot any yet. We'll see. At least I've moderated, if not removed, a potential chain-fire factor. I'm retired, so have (maybe) too much time on my hands. Anyway, crimping is easy and fairly fast. I lay the cap on a flat surface, place the "crimper" around the skirt, a little squeeze and voila! they fit. I'll just do as many as I think I need the night before I want to shoot.

Not much c&b revolver going on in my locale. Hoping someone here'll start stocking Rem #10's in the mean-time.
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Old December 3, 2012, 02:03 PM   #5
ksujedi
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Know it's easy to just recommend another expensive aftermarket part, but FWIW, I futzed around with ill fitting caps (Remington 10 and 11's, CCI 11's) on the stock nipples of my Pietta 1858 Remmy and 1851 Colt for years. Never worked great, but we'll enough for occasional range use where it didn't matter if it took a few minutes to recap or clear cap fragments from the action. Recently decided to start shooting cap and ball in CAS shooting though, and reliability is key. Picked up two sets of Slix Shot nipples and shot a problem free clean match last weekend, my first time with the nipples and first time shooting cap and ball in CAS. My understanding is that TOW/Treso/Ampco nipples all have similar excellent cap fitting. So again, know the easy recommendation is to spend more money, but those nipples are easily the best purchase I've made for enjoyment of Cap and Ball shooting.
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Old December 3, 2012, 02:50 PM   #6
Idaho Spud
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Thanks, ksujedi. My shooting is strictly casual, no competition involved. Actually I bought a set of stainless nipples to replace the stockers, and I noticed that the flash holes on the SS nipples were actually larger, so I'm using the Pietta nipples at the moment. I'm a rookie at this so still learning the ropes. I'm fairly patient, so crimping these CCI's isn't a problem til I get rid of 'em. Didn't plan to make this my permanent solution by any means.

Where did you get the Slix Shot items? I'll entertain any options!

edit: NE Redneck, didn't see your post. Haven't tried CCI10's as I heard they were probably too small and didn't want to end up with "tons" of caps like Hardcase mentioned. Mebbee I'll try a hundred, what the hey.

Last edited by Idaho Spud; December 3, 2012 at 02:56 PM.
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Old December 3, 2012, 06:34 PM   #7
chaz12
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It is possible to mail order the Remington 10s, the downside being that you have to pay an extra 25 dollars Hazmat shipping fee. But if you order a couple thousand caps from Cabellas, thats only about an extra 1.25 per tin. Or if you have a buddy to go in with you, you can split an order. That's what I ended up doing to get the Remingtons when I started shooting BP this past spring.

By great good luck, Cabellas is opening a new store here in Columbus Ohio next spring so I should be able to get my supplies there from now on.

Chaz
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Old December 3, 2012, 06:36 PM   #8
jackpine
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just buy differnt nipples
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Old December 3, 2012, 06:51 PM   #9
Idaho Spud
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Buy new nipples? I did that. I need caps that fit the nipples I already bought. How many do I buy before I find some that will hold caps?
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Old December 3, 2012, 10:39 PM   #10
BirchOrr
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Cap/nipple size

Gentleman,

I've seen this problem/topic come up numerous times in the short time I've been here. The solution is quite simple.

The Italian reproductions (more often than not) come with nipples that are metric (NOT the thread, but rather the cap end). No matter what you do you won't find a cap that fits them correctly. The only option is to change out the nipples on your cylinder, I Like a small flash hole as it acts like a "funnel" and keeps the main charge of powder headed out the intended end of the barrel. It also reduces "blow-back" causing the spent cap from dislodging and keeping you from advancing to the next cylinder.

Cap sizes do vary a bit from one manufacturer to another. After changing the nipples, find the one that your gun likes. DO NOT force a cap on or "pinch" them because they doesn't fit correctly! Many times I just wanted to shoot a new pistol but things weren't right and opted for common sense, safety... waited... and did it right. If I buy a tin of caps and they don't work for my guns, I THROW THEM AWAY. I don't even want them! I don't want any error. There are too many other things that can go wrong as it is!

If you need to, take a nipple out of your cylinder, take it with you and before you buy a tin of caps, open the tin and make sure they fit! Don't do it the other way and try buying nipples that fit your caps...

When the nipple and cap size is correct, chain-fires are eliminated as this is the main cause of a chain-fire. 99 times out of 100 this happens at the cap/nipple end of the cylinder, NOT because you didn't use the correct grease, wad, or other.

Many times we complicate the simple! I want my pistols to fire perfectly every single time and not wonder if the stars will all line up and I will walk away with both hands and eyes.

My only hope is this helps and saves you aggravation, expense and possible injury.

Shoot 'em up!
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Old December 3, 2012, 11:40 PM   #11
mykeal
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Interesting.

What's the difference between a 'metric' nipple and a (what do you call it, SAE?) nipple?

BTW, some do have metric threads.
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Old December 4, 2012, 01:07 AM   #12
ksujedi
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Idaho -
I got the Slix Shot nipples from Long Hunter Shooting Supply (longhunt.com).

What aftermarket stainless nipples did you get? I tried some from Rydon (rmcoxyoke.com) and while they were nice looking stainless, dimensionally, they were exactly the same as the stock nipples, so didn't provide any benefit for cap fitting, so sent them back.

The Slix shots in stainless matched my "stainless" 1851 Marshalls, would eventually like to replace the stock nipples on my blued 1851, 1858, and 1860, and think ill try Track of the Wolfs basic hardened steel or Ampco nipples, which I've read are made specifically to fit 11 caps, I believe CCI in particular, but would look more visually correct on a regular blued/brass gun.
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Old December 4, 2012, 02:49 PM   #13
BirchOrr
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mykeal

Quote:
BTW, some do have metric threads.
I personally haven't run into that but I'm sure you are correct sir!

I'm lucky in that there is a good friend of mine right down the road who has a black powder shop. The guy has everything on the planet related to black powder shooting. He's a complete expert on this topic and has a huge trailer he takes to supply competition shooters around the state. (Bill Hammond of Spring Brook Trading Post). Bill is the real deal.

I feel sorry for some of you guys that have to travel miles or order something form the net and can only wonder and hope it's going to work!
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Old December 4, 2012, 04:55 PM   #14
mykeal
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I ask again...

..
Quote:
What's the difference between a 'metric' nipple and a (what do you call it, SAE?) nipple?
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Old December 4, 2012, 07:10 PM   #15
Hawg
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Quote:
BTW, some do have metric threads.
I thought since they were made in Italy they all had metric threads.
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Old December 4, 2012, 07:50 PM   #16
Smokin'Joe
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Here's what I do to make loose caps fit tight:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/show...94#post5034094
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Old December 4, 2012, 09:16 PM   #17
mykeal
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Quote:
I thought since they were made in Italy they all had metric threads.
Nope. The Uberti 2nd Dragoon and Walker, the ASM Walker and the Pedersoli and Pietta/Navy Arms 12 ga SxS shotguns all have nipples with 1/4x28 threads. The Uberti 1861 Navy and Cattleman percussion revolver and the Euroarms 1860 Army have 12x28 threads.

At least mine do.
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Old December 4, 2012, 09:18 PM   #18
ksujedi
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Ooooooo...... I've got to try that!
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Old December 5, 2012, 12:20 PM   #19
Idaho Spud
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ksujedi - I bought the same SS nipples as you from the same place and as you say they're virtually the same as the OEM's. If one has to pay thirty bucks aftermarket to get something that fits something, then I'd gladly pay it upfront with the gun purchase and avoid all this. Yes I know about price points, blah, blah blah. Actually now that I think of it look at how much the industry would lose if we all didn't buy 3 or 4 extra sets of nipples and "tons" of caps that we can't use. Mebbee there's a method to all this madness.
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Old December 5, 2012, 05:01 PM   #20
DD4lifeusmc
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caps

I've been lucky not had a problem with any brand tens fitting my revolver nipples, correctly.
As to the 11's little big but great for the rifle.
However, I do use a straightinline capper.
I slightly pinch the cap while in the capper before putting it on the nipple, when I run out of 10's
My fingers are so big and clumsy I have to use a capper
Have fun shooting!
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Old December 5, 2012, 07:15 PM   #21
pohill
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From an old Colt Industries pamphlet:
"Percussion caps are now made in sizes from nine to thirteen. Ten and eleven are the best numbers for the small and medium-sized arms, and twelve for the larger sizes, although, as different-sized nipples are sometimes met in specimens of the same model, no hard and fast rule can be given. It is better to have caps slightly too large than too small, as large caps can be pinched together at the bottom enough so they will stay on the nipples, but small ones must be driven down on the nipple by the blow of the hammer, and this process frequently cushions the blow to the extent of producing a misfire."
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Old December 6, 2012, 11:52 AM   #22
Idaho Spud
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Well, not to beat a dead horse, but an update....wife brought home some CCI10's last nite. These are way too tight for the Pietta nipples and slightly loose on the SS nipples! Back to square one. Oh well, my "crimping tool" works even better on the 10's than the 11's so guess I'll just don my big girl panties and deal with it!

Last edited by Idaho Spud; December 6, 2012 at 11:59 AM. Reason: changed a word
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Old December 6, 2012, 10:57 PM   #23
Captainkirk
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CCI's and Remington's are not the same profile. I have had troubles with CCI to the extent I don't like to use them on my revolvers any more. The Remington #10's function flawlessly and I never have to "pinch" a cap...ever.
Both Bass Pro Shops and Cabela's carry the Remington caps. Either find one within driving distance, or do as was suggested and pay the hazmat fee and order a bulk lot. You won't regret it.
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