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Old December 2, 2012, 05:25 PM   #1
Onward Allusion
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Rationale of not carrying in Post Office

I can understand why individuals should not be allowed carry inside courthouses, and some other government buildings, but what exactly is the rationale for not being able to carry inside a POST OFFICE??? The only thing that comes to mind relates to receiving certified mail that contains bad tidings... Is this why?
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Old December 2, 2012, 05:36 PM   #2
Nathan
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There is none. Same with government buildings.
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Old December 2, 2012, 07:34 PM   #3
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It's a Federal building, the rule is the same for all of them.
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Old December 2, 2012, 09:15 PM   #4
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I think we're waiting for a US Supreme Court ruling on "carry" before challenging this crap.
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Old December 2, 2012, 10:10 PM   #5
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What is the big deal? How many people need to go to the Post Office three times a day? If you job has you running from federal building to federal building all day long, then you need to deal with the carry issue, just as hundreds others do who have that type of job (lawyer) who cc.
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Old December 2, 2012, 10:32 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilimanjaro
It's a Federal building, the rule is the same for all of them.
No, it isn't the same. The Federal law applying to most Federal buildings has an exception for "lawful purposes." Although it hasn't been tested in court and I would not knowingly volunteer to become the test case, it has been proposed that carry for self-defense with a state-issued license/permit to carry would be covered under that exemption. Also, the law applying to most Federal buildings uses the word "facility," which is defined as "building."

Carry in a post office is prohibited under a separate regulation adopted by the USPS. It does NOT contain any exemption for "other lawful purposes," and it applies to the entire property, not just the interior of the building.
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Old December 2, 2012, 11:40 PM   #7
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CFR (Code of Fed Reg) title 39 "conduct on postal property" states in pertinent part "NO PERSON while on postal property may carry firearms ...."
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Old December 2, 2012, 11:41 PM   #8
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The rationale is you don't want people "going postal"
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Old December 2, 2012, 11:43 PM   #9
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Frankly, at one time bandits targeted the post office like banks.
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Old December 3, 2012, 12:06 AM   #10
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The frustrating part isn’t the prohibition against carry inside the Post Office, but the fact that you cannot even have a gun in your car on their property. So, it isn’t matter of leaving a gun in the car, but having to leave it at home.
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Old December 3, 2012, 12:32 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarryLee
The frustrating part isn’t the prohibition against carry inside the Post Office, but the fact that you cannot even have a gun in your car on their property. So, it isn’t matter of leaving a gun in the car, but having to leave it at home.
For many people, this is the problem. I'm fortunate in that I can choose between two post offices. One is a storefront in a strip mall, so the parking lot isn't postal property. The other has no parking lot, so I just park at the curb and walk in.

But ... since Obama's election (the first time) the VA hospital has sprouted signs at all entrances to the PROPERTY saying no weapons are allowed on the PROPERTY. Of course, the authority they cite is the standard Federal law that specifically says "in" Federal facilities, and defines "facility" as a building, but when I tried to politely discuss this with a sergeant on the campus cop squad he copped an attitude and I decided discretion was the better part of valor -- so I beat a hasty retreat.

It's a significant difficulty for me because I live 15 miles west of the hospital, and the range where I shoot is 20 miles east. It used to be convenient to toss a range bag in the Jeep, go to an appointment, then continue on to the range. Now I have to reverse direction and schlep all the way back home before I head off to the range.
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Old December 3, 2012, 01:00 AM   #12
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All federal laws that restrict freedoms tend to be contradicting and not thoroughly thought out.
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Old December 3, 2012, 06:07 AM   #13
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Excluding post offices, aren't most government buildings usually staffed with guards? It is rather pointless to mandate a "gun free zone" when there are no means to enforce it or protect the people using the building.
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Old December 3, 2012, 08:37 AM   #14
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There IS a Federal Case addressing this, Bonidy v USPS:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=472340
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Old December 3, 2012, 09:50 AM   #15
Aguila Blanca
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Quote:
There IS a Federal Case addressing this, Bonidy v USPS:
That looks like a good case, but the one I would really like to see is one testing the "other lawful purposes" exemption in the Federal law being cited to prohibit all firearms from Federal facilities besides post offices.
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Old December 3, 2012, 05:55 PM   #16
Onward Allusion
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Quote:
BarryLee
The frustrating part isn’t the prohibition against carry inside the Post Office, but the fact that you cannot even have a gun in your car on their property. So, it isn’t matter of leaving a gun in the car, but having to leave it at home.
THIS is the reason for my post. It is bang-my-head against the wall frustrating that one can't even leave their gun in the car if they have to pick up a certified letter or ship off a package.

I just don't understand what the rationale of heck those who wrote the USPS regulations. I wonder if they are afraid of their own going off the deep end...
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Old December 3, 2012, 08:44 PM   #17
Aguila Blanca
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onward Allusion
I just don't understand what the rationale of heck those who wrote the USPS regulations. I wonder if they are afraid of their own going off the deep end...
What are you wondering about? Haven't you ever heard the expression "going postal"? What did you THINK that refers to?
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Old December 3, 2012, 10:24 PM   #18
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When I go to the post office I park in the business next door and walk over from there. Are all your guys' post offices really isolated? I understand that it's inconvenient but not impossible.

Last edited by ripnbst; December 3, 2012 at 10:34 PM.
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Old December 4, 2012, 12:02 AM   #19
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Wait, are you asking for the rationale behind a federal law?

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Old December 4, 2012, 11:41 PM   #20
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The latest in the Bonidy case can be found here: Bonidy vs US Postal Service

If you take the time to read the defendants MSJ, you will see all the justification you would ever want to see, in why the USPS doesn't want any guns on property it controls.
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Old December 5, 2012, 07:17 AM   #21
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Quote:
The frustrating part isn’t the prohibition against carry inside the Post Office, but the fact that you cannot even have a gun in your car on their property. So, it isn’t matter of leaving a gun in the car, but having to leave it at home.
They have to power to disarm you when you leave your home and going to the post office. Thats is just not right, another violation of the 2nd. What if you get car jacked, robbed or worse on the the way to and from ? You are on your own ? I can see not bring a gun in the post office but you should have the right to leave it in your vehicle while you run in. This is like another form of gun control, isn't it ? What next a law saying you cannot CC while driving a vehicle because of the drive by shooting in the ghetto ?
The 2nd amendment is being limited more and more soon there will be no where you can CC. The 2nd amendment says the right to keep and bear arms, it does not say anything about except where the government says you can't.
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Old December 5, 2012, 08:00 AM   #22
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If we are to take the post offices arguments against guns on postal property then I cant see why that same logic wouldn't or couldn't be applied to every ounce of federal property.

For myself I do not see a the post office as having some special need that out weights the right... Certainly any BG isn't going to obey the law so the only people left with out a firearm on postal property are lawful citizens...
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Old December 6, 2012, 06:09 AM   #23
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Quote:
we are to take the post offices arguments against guns on postal property then I cant see why that same logic wouldn't or couldn't be applied to every ounce of federal property.
It's not that the property is owned by the guvmint, the wording is actually "federal facility".

The term "Federal facility" means a building or part
thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal
employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing
their official duties.

18 U.S.C. section 930

During one of the firearm classes I took, a lawyer said he believed that a ranger station or National Forest visitor center would also fall under this definition out to the parking lot.
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Last edited by iraiam; December 6, 2012 at 06:16 AM.
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