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Old November 24, 2012, 05:36 PM   #1
jason41987
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less common cap and ball revolvers?

im trying to learn more about some of the less common cap and ball revolvers... common ones at this point are the colt armies, colt navies, and the remington armies... however, there were certainly more... so far ive learned a little bit about the starr revolvers, rogers and spencer revolvers, and the lemat...

what are some interesting pre 1873 designs out there, be them cap and ball or early cartridge that you could think of that would be worth learning more about and maybe adding to my collection?
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Old November 24, 2012, 06:09 PM   #2
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The Spiller & Burr is a very nice piece, one of the few brass frame replicas I'd consider owning.
It has a top strap solid frame similar to the Whitney revolver, which predated the Remington.
The available powder space in the .36 chambers is a bit less than in the Colt Navy, so even a max compressed charge would not over stress the brass frame.
Power level is about the same as a .32 S&W Long.
These have had a good rep for accuracy and reliability, though I haven't seen any reviews on them since the 70's.

The Colt Root model is an interesting piece, is uses a side hammer like the Colt revolver rifles did.
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Old November 24, 2012, 06:17 PM   #3
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The available powder space in the .36 chambers is a bit less than in the Colt Navy, so even a max compressed charge would not over stress the brass frame
Yes it will. Anything much over 18 grains in a .36 will beat it to death.
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Old November 24, 2012, 06:20 PM   #4
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Tranter, and Adams both early workable double actions ina variety of mostly British calibers. Both very good looking revolvers, saw service around the world.
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Old November 24, 2012, 06:37 PM   #5
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Anything much over 18 grains in a .36 will beat it to death.
18-20 gr is about all the Spiller&Burr chambers will hold they don't hold as much powder as the Colt chambers. The solid frame of the Spiller & Burr is a good deal less subject to damage than the open frame of the Brass framed Confederate Colt copies.
The S&B frame is more massive at the front than the remington frame, its squared off. The original plan called for the more streamlined top strap but to simplify production they left the frame blocky and thick at the front.

http://www.civilwarpreservations.com/newmus84.html
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Old November 24, 2012, 06:50 PM   #6
jason41987
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these are all some rather interesting designs... you never hear about or see these much, its always interesting to see them... im going to start collecting mid 19th century firearm replicas, would be nice to add some of these to the list, however, besides the spiller and burr, rogers and spencer, and the starr revolvers, who makes reproductions of these other ones?
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Old November 24, 2012, 09:56 PM   #7
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If you only want to talk replicas, you are limited to those guns folks reproduced because that is where the money is.

But there were dozens of makes of percussion revolvers in the old days, and some are available at reasonable prices because they are NOT popular brands.

How about Cooper, Starr, Bacon, Bliss & Goodyear, Freeman, Hopkins & Allen, Adams, Metropolitan, Manhattan, all of which can be found at reasonable prices and in shooting condition.

It is a bit of fun to show up among folks with replica guns and start to bang away with a genuine "double action" Starr. No, it is not a Pietta, it is a Starr!

Jim
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Old November 25, 2012, 03:39 AM   #8
jason41987
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i know the 1860 army and 1858 new army has a max load of about 40 grains, 30 for the 1851 navy, and roughly 60 for the walker and dragoons.... whats the max on the starr and the rogers and spencer?
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Old November 25, 2012, 08:48 AM   #9
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The solid frame of the Spiller & Burr is a good deal less subject to damage than the open frame of the Brass framed Confederate Colt copies.
Having a solid frame doesn't mean squat. If you see this you're headed for paperweight status.

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Old November 25, 2012, 12:31 PM   #10
jason41987
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ive seen some brass alloys that have me pretty interested.. theyre capable of great strength when considered with other brasses, possibly stronger than some steels, probably be too expensive to make a cheap enough brass framed pistol from it though... however, ive always thought the brass frames pistols to be a bit gaudy and never liked them aesthetically

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Old November 25, 2012, 07:32 PM   #11
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What!!!!????? Nobody likes the .36 Savage? If we're talking originals . . . that's an interesting one. . . . .

Many, many . . . and I do mean many . . years ago, I was at a household auction where they brought out an original Savage that was in pristine condition. It went for $125.00 . . . . but then that was probably 45 to 50 years ago . . . still, . . . I think about that every once in a while with a wistful thought and wished that I had had the money . . . .
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If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63
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Old November 26, 2012, 04:43 PM   #12
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I deliberately didn't mention the Savage and some others because they were either very high priced (Savage) or so rare (Rupertus) that finding one would be nearly impossible.

Jim
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Old November 26, 2012, 09:05 PM   #13
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Leech & Ridgon
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Old November 27, 2012, 01:35 PM   #14
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what did smith and wesson use at this time period or in the 60s in general?... i dont read much about them, and besides the colt saa, remington 1875, and the smith top breaks, what other revolvers were available in the 1870s and 1880s that are worth learning more about?
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Old November 27, 2012, 03:05 PM   #15
Willie Sutton
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Just an observation: The most knowlagable Cap and Ball guys on the site probably don't even read this area. Ther Black Powder and CAS forum has many experts posting daily. Might ask the Moderators to move the thread for more replies.

Willie

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Old November 27, 2012, 05:24 PM   #16
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i have no problem with a moderator moving this post if they feel id get a better response in another area of the forum
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Old November 27, 2012, 06:23 PM   #17
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The S&W model 2 was around during the Civil War. Wasn't cap and ball though. .32 rimfire.

After the Civil War there were more firearm makers than you could shake a stick at.
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Old November 27, 2012, 06:30 PM   #18
bamaranger
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the best

The finest cap & ball revolver ever made was the Ruger Old Army. Unfortunatley the new bean counters at Ruger saw fit to discontinue it, along with several other so called niche guns.

Now they make polymer guns (cheaply) that they can sell to a price point and still profit.

Now there's a thought, a polymer cap & ball .
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Old November 27, 2012, 09:01 PM   #19
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If bean counters urge discontinuance of a product it is because it isn't bringing in enough beans.

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Old November 30, 2012, 01:51 AM   #20
bamaranger
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Exactly.

We will sign you up for the new PCB (Poly Cap and Ball, may also be named the POA ...Poly Old Army... or the OAP).

Were I to plunk down real beans for a C&B I intended to shoot a lot, like a cowboy shooter, it would be for a genuine Old Army.
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