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Old November 27, 2012, 05:48 PM   #76
bowfishn
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Back in the early 80's a buddy of mine had bought a used Smith and Wesson 9mm I think it was a model 59, it was the most inaccurate handgun I have ever seen. It left me with a bad taste for Semi-Auto handguns until in the early 90's when I picked up and shot my cousins model 1911 45acp that had been put together by Caspian Arms of Hardwick, Vermont. That was the most amazingly accurate handgun I have ever seen. The handgun fit my hand and natural point so well that at 20 yards shooting at an 8" metal gong, I could not miss, as fast as I could pull the trigger it would ring the gong and that was without using the sights. I should have bought that gun from him.
Any ways I will never myself ever say they are not accurate.
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Old November 27, 2012, 06:51 PM   #77
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I'm definitely a caliber snob! Having had a 9mm as my side arm in the service, I would not want to even touch one with a boom stick!

I heard this over the grape-vine several times: "9mm is for queers and Nazis, take your pick!"

I see nothing wrong with the .45 ACP and if you want to shoot cheap ammo, then get a .22 LR.

Quote:
"They all suck, so pick the one you shoot best."
Some sucks less than others!
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Old November 27, 2012, 06:57 PM   #78
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^^^ That quote has been taken out of context way too many times in this thread. Like I originally posted, that statement was referring to the 9mm vs. the .40 vs the .45.
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Old November 27, 2012, 11:20 PM   #79
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I pick my 9mm over my 44mag for HD!
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Old November 28, 2012, 12:37 AM   #80
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Getting back to the OP

Quote:
It was simply a private conversation.
This person is a great shooter, he hangs out with Mas, he teaches pistol shooting and sells guns to the public. Oh. I'm sorry. I missed the part about the private conversation and posting on a very public TFL. Sillly me. For those still wondering what the definition of what, 'is', is, let me assure you that, while I've never been acused of being, The Sharpest Knife in the Draw, I do know the definition of the word, 'all'.

Now let me tell you what kind of caliber snob I am:
Last night a young women working at a jewlrey store about 2 miles away put the run on two armed robbers whom drew and started firing at her first. The Local PD is asking the public to keep an eye out for one or two young men whom are in need of medical treatment for recent Shopping Mall gunshot wounds. Now, whatever caliber she was using solved the problem(s). So I'll have the same caliber she used, if you please.
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Old November 28, 2012, 01:30 AM   #81
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Quote:
This person is a great shooter, he hangs out with Mas, he teaches pistol shooting and sells guns to the public. Oh. I'm sorry. I missed the part about the private conversation and posting on a very public TFL. Sillly me. For those still wondering what the definition of what, 'is', is, let me assure you that, while I've never been acused of being, The Sharpest Knife in the Draw, I do know the definition of the word, 'all'.
I'm really not sure why you seem so angry about this. I simply relayed a comment a very experienced coworker made to me. If you go back and read my original post, I say very explicitly that I asked him whether he prefers the 9mm, .40, or .45 and that was his answer.
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Old November 28, 2012, 03:18 AM   #82
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Between the time I quoted your source and read your response, a women, not two miles away from me, used one of those mentioned calibers to save her life and the lives of her co-workers from two armed robbery creeps.

Have you given any thought to how many GGs already have or prepare themselves for the time they will be asked to waltz into harms-way armed only with a 9mm, a 40 s&w or 45 acp? And your buddy sits back and tells you,
Quote:
They all suck, so pick the one you shoot best."
Now isn't that productive and worth repeating.

Until your friends and neighbors figure out how to CCW a 18 inch Remington 870 or Colt M-16A2, the equipment between you going home in one piece or being the Medical Examiner's 9:30 appointment, will most likely be one of those,
Quote:
They all suck, so pick the one you shoot best."
your source mentioned.

My opologies for wondering off the Orginal Post.
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Old November 28, 2012, 03:46 AM   #83
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Quote:
Quote:
They all suck, so pick the one you shoot best."
your source mentioned.
That's not my post, that's someone else in this thread quoting ME. Go back and read the second post in this thread, which is the ONLY post where I quoted my co-worker and where I made it very clear which three calibers he is talking about.
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Old November 28, 2012, 03:59 AM   #84
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Quote:
Between the time I quoted your source and read your response, a women, not two miles away from me, used one of those mentioned calibers to save her life and the lives of her co-workers from two armed robbery creeps.

Have you given any thought to how many GGs already have or prepare themselves for the time they will be asked to waltz into harms-way armed only with a 9mm, a 40 s&w or 45 acp? And your buddy sits back and tells you,
Quote:
"They all suck, so pick the one you shoot best."

Now isn't that productive and worth repeating.
I still don't understand where your anger is coming from. His point is that there is A) not a lot of difference between the three calibers, and B) none of them can be relied upon to immediately stop a threat so you need to put as multiple rounds on target as quickly as possible.

That's it.

Nobody is insulting people who use those calibers in self defense. He alternates between carrying a 9mm and a .45 just as I do. But the important thing is to realise the limitations of those calibers and make sure your shooting makes up for those limitations as much as possible.

It's unfortunate that you saw other people quoting me and didn't realise that MY quote was put in full context as to the calibers involved, but I really don't think your misunderstanding warrants the vitriol you've directed my way.
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Old November 28, 2012, 07:29 AM   #85
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Enough, folks.

If you want to delve into issues regarding personality and such, please take it to e-mail.
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Old November 28, 2012, 08:36 AM   #86
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Quote:
Have you given any thought to how many GGs already have or prepare themselves for the time they will be asked to waltz into harms-way armed only with a 9mm, a 40 s&w or 45 acp? And your buddy sits back and tells you,
Quote:
"They all suck, so pick the one you shoot best."
As former military and a cop whose job has required them to unintentionally waltz into harms way carrying only the mentioned calibers, I can ASSURE you that the quote is 100% true.

All pistols suck in relation to the 870 behind the seat or the M16 in the trunk (or the Ak47 that the bad guy is hosing you down with).

Any time we KNEW we were going into harm's way, nobody had a pistol in their hand just because they all SUCK in relation to a long gun.

However, when you're on the street, whether in uniform or civilian CCW mode, political correctness does not allow you to carry your long gun at all times. Therefore you must compromise your equipment down to a pistol level, which unfortunately SUCKS if you need to stop someone no matter what caliber it is.
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Old November 28, 2012, 07:07 PM   #87
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I have both 9mm and .45 ACP and like them both, though my EDC is a .45 ACP, as I just shoot it better than any other handgun cartridge. .40 doesn't do it for me and I'm not interested, but I'd be the first to say if .40 is what you shoot best, then that's likely what you should carry. All 3 are proper primary defensive carry cartridges, all 3 are quite accurate at defensive distances.
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Old November 30, 2012, 03:13 AM   #88
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I hear the same from guys with Mazda sports cars about my old Corvette all the time. Just think of a line from a old Tom Hanks movie about stupid.
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Old November 30, 2012, 08:37 AM   #89
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Quote from Mike Irwin: "Enough, folks.

If you want to delve into issues regarding personality and such, please take it to e-mail."

HOORAY!!!!!!!!!!
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Old November 30, 2012, 09:40 AM   #90
qwiksdraw
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Practice what you carry; Carry what you practice.

If it's all about shot placement then experience and proficiency with your handgun will make up for caliber choice.

But then, I'm just a rookie, so what do I know!
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Old December 20, 2012, 02:14 AM   #91
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Size (and distance) matters

As a newer pistol convert from the good ole clays sports I can say that all these guns are great for what they're intended to do. Personally, I love .22LR it's a heck of a lot of fun to shoot. DA revolvers, SA revolvers, autos...its all fun. Yes, but it's useless for Self Defense!(some say). Yes it probably is but if you're not 50 and a former Marine a .45 isn't going to handle well in your hands. Most of the guys on here have fired thousands if not tens of thousands of rounds of pistol ammo. So IMHO if you don't own a .22LR to train and have fun with your nuts. Particularly if you are introducing new shooters. My brother gave his wife a 9mm and just thought she'd be a good shot. Guess what she got scared of the recoil and never hit anything and gave it up. Now other guns have places too. For a real life someones coming and it looks like they are going to hurt me/ my family at close range most modern guns work. A 380acp is a good light self defense gun but you have to train with it at the right distance. Personally for center-fire I shoot 9mm and .38spl. They are cheap(er) to shoot and for most applications you can get good ammo that will do the job if you need it to. 45acp is great and no doubt it will put down your target but if your not extremely well practiced it is not the weapon for the average Joe defending his home and family. Point is all these guns and all the ammo types are good if applied with respect to their limitations. Pick which one works for you.
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Old December 20, 2012, 03:04 AM   #92
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I get the same kind of in reverse. When I got my 10mm the guy in the LGS said "What do you need that for" another guy said"why in the world would you get a cannon?

The same was said when I bought a 500 S&W.

If it makes sense to you why your buying the caliber that you choose then who cares what anyone else thinks?
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Old December 20, 2012, 04:39 PM   #93
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I would say "caliber ignorant" not snobs (the snobs may be a sub set of the ignorant"

I know a guy who likes 40 caliber and does not thing 9mm is up to snuff (with some reason due to a fellow LEO failing in a shootout with a 9mm though the circumstances were not described, bad shooting or no good SD ammo?).

My brother knew a guy who took 4 hits from a 44 magnum in a shootout (he had a high capacity 45 and won, though it took 8 hits to do so). He is firmly convinced its quantity not caliber or power (I am more than convinced if you shoot well that's what counts with modern ammunition)

As a former big bore advocate I can see the adjustment. People still like their V8s though a V6 and in some cases a I4 matches power and speed and is vastly superior fuel mileage wise.

When there are so many people who defend their larger calibers on the basis of superiority not choice its a hard mindset to overcome.
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Old December 20, 2012, 07:36 PM   #94
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For a few years I was a .40 S&W snob. Kind of. I guess.

I dig it because IMO, it really does blend the best attributes of 9mm and .45 cal.

And then... I read about how Navy SEALs carry 9mm +P. Now I am not quite as down on the 9 as I was. I still wont carry any .45 for defensive purposes though. I would just rather have a boat load of smaller rounds in the chute than having a "legend" on my hip.
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Old December 21, 2012, 05:31 AM   #95
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When you spend a fair amount of time in combat you definitely develop preferences. So sure you can call me a caliber snob, or a brand snob, or any other kind of snob you like. I love blackhawk socks and wont buy anything but so you can call me a socks snob too i guess.

I try to stay out of the caliber wars. If someone asks my opinion Ill give it to em. I know what is best for for me and when it comes to handguns there are no 0s, 1s, 2s, 6s, 8s or 9s in what I carry.

You can carry whatever you like. You can even try to sell me on it. Just don't be disappointed when you don't get anywhere.


"I read about how Navy SEALs carry 9mm +P" Some might but this as a blanket statement is untrue.
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Old December 22, 2012, 05:39 PM   #96
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There is sooo much crap in here it is ankle deep.....if you are in head first......
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Old December 22, 2012, 06:31 PM   #97
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Wheres a mod then you need something closed. hehe
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Old December 23, 2012, 11:45 AM   #98
buck460XVR
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There are caliber snobs, platform snobs and brand fanboys. Not really a problem, but why some insist on bein' buttholes too is beyond me.
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Old December 23, 2012, 02:36 PM   #99
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Every once in a while? I see them constantly online.

But their rants don't change reality, just their perception of it.
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Old December 23, 2012, 09:37 PM   #100
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with modern self defense ammo I don't think it matters all that much. If we are talking fmj rounds then .45 acp all the way.

I think I would lean more towards 9mm over .45 for magazine capacity. Choosing 9mm over .40 as well simply because I can control follow up shots a little better than the snappy .40 cal.

my 2 cents
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