Question about newest load manuals

shredder4286 · November 14, 2012, 10:21 PM

Howdy,

When I started handloading, the 8th Hornady load manual had just came out, so I bought it. I saw on Midway USA that the 9th is out now. If I wanna keep shooting the same loads- i.e. powder, bullets etc- do I need this new manual, or can I just continue using the same data? Thanks in advance

loademwell · November 14, 2012, 11:08 PM

Keep using what you have... I used to use a book I picked up at goodwill Believe it was Lyman 45th edition, 1970.

Had the New Lee book at that time too. (last addition I think)

Comparing side by side, I think they were almost the exact same. Maybe the Vol. was diff. by a few feet, but it wasn't enough for me to change loads.

shredder4286 · November 15, 2012, 12:06 AM

Ok, because I really couldn't justify buying a $25 book if I don't absolutely need it. Thanks for the info

**Brian Pfleuger** · November 15, 2012, 12:19 AM

You don't need more than one manual and you really only need that for doomsday when the Internet is gone.

Hodgdon/IMR/Winchester
Alliant
Nosler
Vihtavouri-Lapua
Ramshot

and others all have their data online, for free.

UtopiaTexasG19 · November 15, 2012, 11:01 AM

You might occassionally need a new manual if you are starting to load one of the many "newer" cartridges that may have not been listed at the time of print for your older booklet. Then again there is so much information on the internet one can go to powder manufacturers and get a lot of loads there.

Misssissippi Dave · November 15, 2012, 12:06 PM

It is good to have at least two or more sources for any new load you want to try out. Powder and sometimes bullet manufactures will have information on the Internet or you can ask the bullet manufactures if they have load data as well. For established loads I wouldn't think you need to update you manuals unless the powder manufacture has made a change for their powder. Even then you just back off 10% and work the load up again.

old roper · November 15, 2012, 12:13 PM

I think what happen manual # 8 was started and finished before they introduced some of their newer bullets and testing some of the newer powders. Nothing in Manual 8 about the 22 cal GMX bullets etc.

They may of jumped the gun on # 8 who knows for sure. I'll get #9.

shredder4286 · November 15, 2012, 02:38 PM

Good to know. I knew IMR and hodgdon had data online, but from what I remember, the bullets listed were kind of generic (i.e. 150 sp, no brand).

**Brian Pfleuger** · November 15, 2012, 02:51 PM

They usually show brand, such as SIE (Sierra) or HDY (Hornady) or NOS (Nosler).

Besides which, brand doesn't matter if you're using a bullet of the same weight and similar construction, such as traditional copper jacket, lead-core bullets. There's only so many ways to make a .308 caliber lead-core, copper jacket bullet that weighs 150gr, for example. They're close enough to interchange data, so long as you start low and work up, like always.

shredder4286 · November 15, 2012, 03:46 PM

Cool, that's kinda what I thought. I just wasn't sure if the b.c. and design of different bullets of the same weight and caliber would be enough to require entirely different data.

**Brian Pfleuger** · November 15, 2012, 03:57 PM

There is some variance in length due to things like plastic tips and whatnot but as long as the basic construction is the same, and not a solid bullet like Barnes TSX versus traditional copper-jacket lead core, the variances in primers, case capacities, chamber dimensions and powder lot burn rates will more than mask any small differences in bullet length.

Starting low and working toward max also stabilizes the results, any change that produces significantly higher pressures should be reasonably evident before you reach a dangerous situation.

**Unclenick** · November 15, 2012, 03:58 PM

Also note on the Hodgdon site you have to click on the Print button to see what case, primer, and barrel length they used to get the velocities they list.

I agree that replacing a manual seldom is justified except to get new cartridge data. In Hornady's case they will usually give you data on a particular bullet and chambering combination if you ask them, so you can keep your old manual up to date that way. I usually replace a book I use a lot about every third or fourth version.

shredder4286 · November 15, 2012, 04:08 PM

Excellent. Thanks a lot for all the info, and clarification on my question.

November 14, 2012, 10:21 PM	#1
shredder4286 Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2010 Location: NE Washington Posts: 333	Question about newest load manuals Howdy, When I started handloading, the 8th Hornady load manual had just came out, so I bought it. I saw on Midway USA that the 9th is out now. If I wanna keep shooting the same loads- i.e. powder, bullets etc- do I need this new manual, or can I just continue using the same data? Thanks in advance

November 15, 2012, 12:13 PM	#7
old roper Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2007 Posts: 691	I think what happen manual # 8 was started and finished before they introduced some of their newer bullets and testing some of the newer powders. Nothing in Manual 8 about the 22 cal GMX bullets etc. They may of jumped the gun on # 8 who knows for sure. I'll get #9. __________________ Semper Fi Vietnam VFW

November 15, 2012, 03:57 PM	#11
Brian Pfleuger Staff Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Central, Southern NY, USA Posts: 14,467	There is some variance in length due to things like plastic tips and whatnot but as long as the basic construction is the same, and not a solid bullet like Barnes TSX versus traditional copper-jacket lead core, the variances in primers, case capacities, chamber dimensions and powder lot burn rates will more than mask any small differences in bullet length. Starting low and working toward max also stabilizes the results, any change that produces significantly higher pressures should be reasonably evident before you reach a dangerous situation. __________________ Still happily answering to the call-sign Peetza. --- You do not HAVE a soul. You ARE a soul. You HAVE a body. -C.S. Lewis He is no fool who gives what he can not keep to gain what he can not lose. -Jim Eliott, paraphrasing Philip Henry.

November 15, 2012, 03:58 PM	#12
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 9,146	Also note on the Hodgdon site you have to click on the Print button to see what case, primer, and barrel length they used to get the velocities they list. I agree that replacing a manual seldom is justified except to get new cartridge data. In Hornady's case they will usually give you data on a particular bullet and chambering combination if you ask them, so you can keep your old manual up to date that way. I usually replace a book I use a lot about every third or fourth version. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Patron Member

November 14, 2012, 11:08 PM	#2
loademwell Member Join Date: November 6, 2012 Posts: 34	Keep using what you have... I used to use a book I picked up at goodwill Believe it was Lyman 45th edition, 1970. Had the New Lee book at that time too. (last addition I think) Comparing side by side, I think they were almost the exact same. Maybe the Vol. was diff. by a few feet, but it wasn't enough for me to change loads.

November 15, 2012, 12:06 AM	#3
shredder4286 Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2010 Location: NE Washington Posts: 333	Ok, because I really couldn't justify buying a $25 book if I don't absolutely need it. Thanks for the info

November 15, 2012, 12:19 AM	#4
Brian Pfleuger Staff Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Central, Southern NY, USA Posts: 14,467	You don't need more than one manual and you really only need that for doomsday when the Internet is gone. Hodgdon/IMR/Winchester Alliant Nosler Vihtavouri-Lapua Ramshot and others all have their data online, for free.

November 15, 2012, 11:01 AM	#5
UtopiaTexasG19 Senior Member Join Date: July 3, 2011 Location: S.E. Texas Gulf Coast Posts: 699	You might occassionally need a new manual if you are starting to load one of the many "newer" cartridges that may have not been listed at the time of print for your older booklet. Then again there is so much information on the internet one can go to powder manufacturers and get a lot of loads there.

November 15, 2012, 12:06 PM	#6
Misssissippi Dave Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Posts: 1,099	It is good to have at least two or more sources for any new load you want to try out. Powder and sometimes bullet manufactures will have information on the Internet or you can ask the bullet manufactures if they have load data as well. For established loads I wouldn't think you need to update you manuals unless the powder manufacture has made a change for their powder. Even then you just back off 10% and work the load up again.

November 15, 2012, 02:38 PM	#8
shredder4286 Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2010 Location: NE Washington Posts: 333	Good to know. I knew IMR and hodgdon had data online, but from what I remember, the bullets listed were kind of generic (i.e. 150 sp, no brand).

November 15, 2012, 02:51 PM	#9
Brian Pfleuger Staff Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Central, Southern NY, USA Posts: 14,467	They usually show brand, such as SIE (Sierra) or HDY (Hornady) or NOS (Nosler). Besides which, brand doesn't matter if you're using a bullet of the same weight and similar construction, such as traditional copper jacket, lead-core bullets. There's only so many ways to make a .308 caliber lead-core, copper jacket bullet that weighs 150gr, for example. They're close enough to interchange data, so long as you start low and work up, like always. __________________ Still happily answering to the call-sign Peetza. --- You do not HAVE a soul. You ARE a soul. You HAVE a body. -C.S. Lewis He is no fool who gives what he can not keep to gain what he can not lose. -Jim Eliott, paraphrasing Philip Henry.

November 15, 2012, 03:46 PM	#10
shredder4286 Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2010 Location: NE Washington Posts: 333	Cool, that's kinda what I thought. I just wasn't sure if the b.c. and design of different bullets of the same weight and caliber would be enough to require entirely different data.

November 15, 2012, 04:08 PM	#13
shredder4286 Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2010 Location: NE Washington Posts: 333	Excellent. Thanks a lot for all the info, and clarification on my question.