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Old November 5, 2012, 11:40 PM   #1
PiperSuperCubPilot
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Is 8 Rounds Enough?

I'm considering a S&W 627 8 shot .357 Magnum for an "all around" handgun. It's big but could be concealed if needed. It's big enough for home defense too.


But I'm concerned that 8 rounds isn't enough when there are 15 shot .45 semi autos and such around.

Criminals are known to attack in groups of 5 and sometimes more in my area, both in the home and outside.


Thoughts?
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Old November 5, 2012, 11:45 PM   #2
RamItOne
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Why not belt fed then?

I just bought the s&w 327 8 shot 357
Don't have a primary use for it.

Normally have my M&P 9mm by the bed.

Do you own any other firearms?
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Old November 5, 2012, 11:47 PM   #3
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It is plenty. Except, of course, when it's not.

The "typical" self-defense shooting is often described as three, threes. It's over in 3 seconds with 3 shots fired and takes place inside 3 yards. Of course, some shootings aren't typical. There's no way to know, in advance, whether you'll get a typical one or not.

That said, there are plenty of people who rely on and have successfully relied upon 6 shot revolvers for carry and home defense. If you are comfortable with the gun and shoot it well, it's not a bad choice, in my opinion.
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Old November 5, 2012, 11:48 PM   #4
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I'm sure it's 'enough', but...

For a while my CC gun was a 5 shot SP101 357. 38's were fine but I soon discovered full 357's were enough of a handful that accurate follow up shots just took too long. After chewing on this issue for a couple months, I sold it and picked up a Kahr K9. 8+1, takes +p ammo.

On a side note I discovered the 3" version I had was the same exact size as my Sig 220.
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Old November 6, 2012, 12:16 AM   #5
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If your area has problems with group attacks I would personally invest in a rifle and shotgun for the home. Carry in your person what you shoot the best
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Old November 6, 2012, 12:55 AM   #6
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I certainly wouldn't lose any sleep over having ONLY 8 rounds of .357 magnum. Sure there could be a situation where that's not enough. Of course there is a situation where a Glock 17 with several 33 round magazines wouldn't be enough. Think how many people are out there with less than 8 rounds of 9mm, .40 or .45. Heck, think of how many are out there with absolutely nothing! Get proficient with it and I think you are about as prepared as you need to be realistically.
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Old November 6, 2012, 01:40 AM   #7
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If you're attacked by a group of 5, 15 rounds won't be enough either.
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Old November 6, 2012, 02:57 AM   #8
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A group of 5 who all have guns? Probably not.

A group of 5 where one or two have guns, and the others have fists, knives, or clubs? Possibly.

A group of 5 who don't have guns. Odds get somewhat better.

Of course, the ability to use cover and concealment, to move, to use one's body as a weapon as necessary, to use a member or members of the group as barriers between oneself and the other members of the group would all be factors that could increase the odds of surviving / winning.

Or, one could just assume one can never beat a group of 5... in which case, one can't.
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Old November 6, 2012, 03:32 AM   #9
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Not all of us are Sergeant York; yet, Sergeant York beat more than five at once.

His accomplishments are uncommon, but taking on five or more and surviving is not unique.

Does that mean we can all expect to be that successful or lucky? No.

But it does mean that numbers are not everything.

I will award you a 3rd dan in snark and sarcasm, though, Okie.
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Old November 6, 2012, 03:52 AM   #10
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Ah I am a sensei in sarcasm, however my snark is quite lacking.
My dates in highschool were uncommon, what York did was borderline Godlike.
My point is I keep seeing these post were people jump in and argue that 5 (or 7 or 10 or 1256) rds aren't enough because what if you are attacked by 6 (or 8 or 10 or 1257) thugs. If that happens 99.999993% of people are going to die or bleed alot more than they expected to when they woke up that morning. A person would be much better served with getting whatever pistol he could shoot the best and practicing as if his life depended on it. I carry 5 rounds and at least twice a week I try my absolute best to wear that little revolver out. Now if I get 5 guys coming after me who are deadset on causing damage, even after I drop the first one, my odds are dismal at best. That doesn't mean I'm just going to throw my hands up and say, "well it's been nice knowing you". I'm a mean vindictive SOB and at least 3 of these miscreants are taking a nap with me. However, I'm also a realist and if I live somewhere where being attacked by random wolfpacks of 5 or more is common, I'm not going outside for love or money.
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Old November 6, 2012, 03:56 AM   #11
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Random attacks by 5 or more, rare unless one is in a very bad part of town.

Random robberies by groups of 3, rare, but not so rare that one doesn't read about them at least once a week.

Defensive shootings where more than three rounds are absorbed by a bad guy who keeps on attacking, rare, but also not unheard of.

In most cases, just having a gun is good enough.

In some cases, having the gun and actually being willing to use it is good enough.

Other cases, having the gun, being willing to use it, and using it skillfully is good enough.

But in some cases, more is better.

It's hard to think of a case where fewer is actually better, with the exceptions of: 1) the gun with "more" is too big, so doesn't get carried; or 2) for whatever reason, the gun with "fewer" is the only gun the user can shoot all that well.
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Old November 6, 2012, 04:14 AM   #12
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I hope so. At least I hope 8+1 is enough.
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Old November 6, 2012, 04:24 AM   #13
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I believe we come from the same school, just maybe different classes. Willingness is a huge part. I do not train to pull my pistol and hold someone at gun point. I am not a LEO, that's not my job. My job if the need arises is to deliver much damage before much damage can be delivered to myself and mine. And so, if my pistol leaves its holster it means that I have exhausted all other options. It will not return to its holster unfired.
Situational awareness is also a huge part of the game. If you have 5 goons walking up on you then you had better be halfway thru your gameplan before the first words are spoken.
And you missed one other time when fewer is better and that's when someone uses a high cap mag to justify lack of training and skill. I don't know how many times I've heard someone say they've heard from ABC gun mag that only 1 in 5 shots fired in self defense hits the target so they're going to send all 18 rounds out so they hit at least 3 times. My only thought is, I hope to god my 6 year old isn't downrange.
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Old November 6, 2012, 04:37 AM   #14
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There had been a confrontation at a party next door around 1 or 2 am, I had been outside smoking a cigarette when some sort of confrontation happened next door. Saw some people drive off aggressively in a jacked up white F-150.

These guys came back around 5 in the morning, pulled up to our house and kicked their way through our front door. I was still awake in the living room with a friend of mine when this happened.

I did not have a weapon at the time, but i did confront the intruders that broke in yelling things like "what now mother ****ers?". I started yelling back with my own explicatives about how dumb these people are breaking into the wrong house... Guy in the foyer paused for a moment, looked around and started backing out the door.

Police were called, and because these drunken *******s picked the most conspicuous getaway vehicle possible to drive away from a university with 3 roads out of it. The police arrested 3 of them before they had gone a mile.

All in all, no one hurt... It is a good thing that they got out of the door before my room mate woke up from the commotion, opened his door to let out his pit bull and descend the stairs with a shotgun. 2 days later I had a loaded 12 gauge in my room in case any of them ever decided to come back.

This all being said... 5 large guys aggressive enough to kick their way through a front door at 5am.... 8 round will probably be enough to make them get out, but if they were persistent and armed... I would feel pretty safe behind a 12 gauge at the stop of the staircase.

Also this incident happened across the street from a respectable college, in an area with a relatively low level of violent crime. This sort of thing can happen anywhere.

Last edited by alex0535; November 6, 2012 at 05:19 AM.
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Old November 6, 2012, 06:47 AM   #15
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Quote:
But I'm concerned that 8 rounds isn't enough when there are 15 shot .45 semi autos and such around.
If you have to ask the question, then there isn't anything made that holds "enough" rounds for you. Get whatever you can find that holds the most bullets.
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Old November 6, 2012, 07:09 AM   #16
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The short answer is yes. Anything is better than nothing. ive carried my 1911's for a few yews and 8 +1 feels pretty good to me. well that and i always carry a spare mag or two.
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Old November 6, 2012, 07:12 AM   #17
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Do you mean you are considering buying a high capacity 45, or the possibility of facing a high cap 45 when you have 8 shots of .357?

If the possibility of being attacked by 5 people was greater than average, I would opt to have more than 8 rounds available. Glock 19/23/32

I typically carry a subcompact Glock that's 9 + 1
Yesterday, I carried my Glock 38 (45 GAP) 8 + 1
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Old November 6, 2012, 07:17 AM   #18
Mike Irwin
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I'm more than comfortable with a handgun holding just 5 rounds.

Even if you are set upon by a group, how many do you really think are going to stick around once you drop one or two of them?
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Old November 6, 2012, 07:18 AM   #19
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Well 8 rounds is enough until you need more
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Old November 6, 2012, 07:22 AM   #20
Mike Irwin
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"or the possibility of facing a high cap 45"

I'm more worried about running into a gang of rogue Jesse Venturas, all armed with portable gatling guns...
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Old November 6, 2012, 10:53 AM   #21
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1 shot - 1 bad guy.
If you're lucky and take out the lead dog the rest will scatter. Most criminals are not the committed when one of theres goes down
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Old November 6, 2012, 11:58 AM   #22
PiperSuperCubPilot
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I have a "thing" for revolvers. I enjoy them more than semi autos, and I'd argue that I shoot them better as well. Plus, and this isn't exactly a practical reason, but I just plain like revolvers more than semi autos!

If I didn't care about capacity, I'd get a 686 pre lock and a GP100 and be done with it. But the "internet hype" and several scenarios that have happened in my town with multiple (5 or more) attackers makes me feel like I should have more.


I do have a glock 26. If I CCw'd a revolver I'd have the 10 shot G26 as backup. Maybe that would offset the 6-8 round capacity enough?


Here's one of my main reasons for being concerned:

A couple of months ago, a friend of my families, a priest, was robbed in his home. It was 5 men, 3 of which had guns. The priest, of course, was unarmed, and soon found himself kneeling and facing the wall with a gun pointed at his head while the other thugs looted the place (not that there was anything to loot, priests aren't exactly rich). Finally the priest worked up the guts to stand up, turn around and yell at them "Get the F*CK out of my house!" (very priest-like!) and one of the thugs shot him in the stomach and they all ran away. The priest lived and is fine today, but it's a scary thing to think about.
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Old November 6, 2012, 11:58 AM   #23
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I bought a 627 Pro series with 4" barrel & 8 shot cylinder mainly for field carry but the weight of the N frame does tame the recoil of full 357 magnum loads pretty well...so double action is reasonable with practice ! I mostly shoot the magnum loads in single action mode and practice fast double action with +P or regular 38 special ammo which is very easy to get comfortable with and quite fun to play with at the range ! This model does accept and comes with a few full moonclips and I think there are 8 shot speedloaders available as well !
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Old November 6, 2012, 12:19 PM   #24
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Quote:
Criminals are known to attack in groups of 5 and sometimes more in my area, both in the home and outside.
Time for a new area, methinks.
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Old November 6, 2012, 12:34 PM   #25
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Quote:
Thoughts?
The stripped down version of your question is "How much is enough?"

I once had a disagreement with a fellow in the Klan. I thought I had "enough" with 40 rounds, but I underestimated their sense of community and had a tense period with a 20 or so of this fellow's best friends. My sense of "enough" was not informed by perfect foresight.

Whoever wrote that the first rule in these matters is to have a gun got to the core of the matter. You can't know how much was really enough until things are resolved.
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