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Old October 2, 2013, 10:13 PM   #1
Dashunde
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Shooting a dog?

New neighbor has a growling feisty snarling small Border Collie mutt sort thing, great.
My Lab is 14 years old and pretty mellow, rarely leaves the yard except to poop (thank God) or to chase his ball when thrown by one of the neighbor kids.
I have little doubt the new dog would come into our yard for a fight, and its owner said it'll snap at kids.

What are your thoughts on dealing with the dog if it starts a fight or messes with my 16 month old daughter?
I'm initially thinking pepper spray and a kick in the gut? No legal or wife trouble that way, not sure how effective it is thought...
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Old October 2, 2013, 10:44 PM   #2
overthere
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How about asking your neighbor to make sure he keeps his dog on his own property?
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Old October 2, 2013, 10:45 PM   #3
shortwave
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Have you taken your concerns to your neighbor?

If the dog will snap at kids and is showing that much aggression, it has no business running loose period.

I think I'd be having a heart to heart with the neighbor BEFORE something happens. If the neighbor is less than receptive during the talk, I would not hesitate to call the authories

If the dog would happen to jump on your daughter, you can shoot it till your fingers fall off. The damage to your daughter is already done. All the shooting, lawsuits etc. will not take away the possible severe damages that could be done to your daughter after the fact.

Bottomline, I would not hesitate in killing any animal attacking any kid but I would feel really bad if I knew about the aggressive animal before the attack and didn't do everything in my power to prevent it from happening.`
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Old October 2, 2013, 10:55 PM   #4
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Always remember you have a right to protect yourself, your wife, 16 month old, even your lab in your property or elsewhere.

Last edited by BuckRub; October 2, 2013 at 11:51 PM.
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Old October 2, 2013, 10:56 PM   #5
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We had a neighborhood aggressive dog whose owner didn't seem to care when he got out. Several talked to him, no luck. Lots of discussions on shooting, poisoning, teasing, etc. Cops/animal control needed more documentation.

Ultimately the dog was trapped and taken to the pound. The owner got the message after bailing the dog out. More of a cooler head solution.
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Old October 2, 2013, 10:57 PM   #6
Dashunde
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Yea, he's a real nice guy. He knows full-well the dog is "challenging" and I doubt it'll be out without a leash. But even my old hound manages to sneak outside once in awhile.
I've never really had a dog quite like it around. I'm not a fan.
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Old October 3, 2013, 12:12 AM   #7
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A situation avoided is the best type to deal with. Think gun only as a last resort and only to protect from severe harm. Wasp spray purchased at the big chain hardware stores and even at some grocery stores is terrific for fending off unwanted dogs and bad guys. The can will shoot to a range of about 15 - 20 feet and the animal or bad guy will need immediate medical attention to wash the sting from the eyes. It is probably a lesson the animal or human will never forget and the ramifications are far less than having to use your gun. Keep in mind, once your gun comes out of its holster other than at the range or for cleaning, your life has begun to change forever...no matter how right how are.
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Old October 3, 2013, 01:08 AM   #8
Psychedelic Bang
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Collie behavior is to bark a lot. I have a Collie he has a big bark, but there is a huge difference between a big bark while tail wagging, and a growl an sneer.

I highly doubt your neighbor's dog would enter your yard and fight, and I would suggest that you try to meet the neighbor's dog so you can have some info about the dogs gender, age, if it is fixed, and the sort.

I also have a neighbor with, "somewhat of a scary dog," a growling, sneering mutt of sorts. One day, when I saw that particular neighbor out of a walk with her dog, I introduced myself to her and her dog. What I found out was, "both her dog, and my dog have a lot in common," both have been rescued, and rescued dogs can be a little apprehensive of any human they do not know.

Perhaps your neighbor's dog is a rescued dog?

The way human beings treat animals, is very much the way they will treat other human beings. There is little else, that will give you the same insight into a persons behavior, as to how they treat all types of life on this planet.

Its probably a thread that is headed for a lock, but hopefully my post will stay in tacked, even if it blatantly asks you to examine your behavior and ask yourself why your perceive your neighbor's dog this way, and try to reassess your conclusion to see if you can find any wholes in your logic.
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Old October 3, 2013, 01:43 AM   #9
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Talk to the neighbor with the dog, other neighbors about the dog (just to see if it's all bark and no bite), and check into your local laws/regulations.


Sometimes, the local regs will be on your side, more than the owner's.

One of my brothers lived in a neighborhood where one of the residents let his 3 aggressive and territorial dogs roam all over the place, and refused to listen to complaints. The town LEOs claimed they couldn't do anything about it.
When the dogs knocked his little girl off her bike and looked like they were about to attack her... he kicked the crap out of them, until they ran off. (He would have preferred a weapon, but didn't have time to grab one.)

When they came back the next day, and were even more aggressive and threatening, he put one down with a shotgun. Police responded to "shots fired" and "dead dog in the road" calls.

When the responding officers couldn't find any witnesses, one of them told my brother, "I know you did it, and that all these people are covering your [butt], because they hated those dogs too. But, they really don't need to, since everybody knows those dogs are aggressive; and it's just a $25 fine for discharging a firearm in the city." (-just an infraction, not even a misdemeanor.)

To which, my brother retrieved $50 from his wallet, and replied, "Can I prepay for 2 more?"
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Old October 3, 2013, 02:22 AM   #10
Pond, James Pond
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Quote:
If the dog will snap at kids and is showing that much aggression, it has no business running loose period.

I think I'd be having a heart to heart with the neighbor BEFORE something happens. If the neighbor is less than receptive during the talk, I would not hesitate to call the authorities
This.

Prevention is always best. It guarantees a better outcome, keeps you happy as you and yours are safe and keeps you neighbour happy (because his dog doesn't take a bullet).

Talking to the authorities documents that there is a potential issue, in case the worst were to happen, shows you are trying to do the right thing and tells you where you stand.

I have had an issue where a Staffordshire Bull female has thrice had a pop at one of my dogs. Each time the Staffy has been off-lead which is not permitted but often ignored. The last time it happened, the dog went off when its owner called, but not before I'd punched in the side of the head to get it to move off.

I went to the police asking what my options were, making it clear I didn't want to shoot this dog. They confirmed pepper-spray was the best option. If I need to use it, I can now say I had approval from the police for this kind of action.
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Old October 3, 2013, 05:58 AM   #11
spacecoast
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The fact that you are already contemplating shooting the dog, prior to any confrontation, indicates that there is a problem. I hesitate to call it "premeditated" but it's dangerously close. Shooting is what you do when circumstances prevent you from doing otherwise. You need to discuss your concerns with your neighbor, make an attempt to befriend the dog and see if maybe it's just frightened or aggressive because it doesn't know you, etc. If I were you, I would also take steps to prevent my daughter from being exposed to danger until the threat is better understood.
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Old October 3, 2013, 06:24 AM   #12
rebs
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By all means get this settled with your neighbor before something bad happens. Find out if the dog is all bark and no bite or will it definitely bite. Shooting the dog after your daughter is bitten and scarred isn't going to do much for your daughter now is it ?
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Old October 3, 2013, 06:31 AM   #13
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spacecoast sounds about right. You come across like you don't like the dog and you are trying to conjure up ways to get rid of it or harm it in manners that appear legal. The dog has not yet caused a problem and by your description, the owner is a responsible owner, but it sounds like you are waiting for the dog to get out so that you can cause it harm. After all, you already have little doubt what it will do...

As noted, talk to the owner. Talk to a lawyer. As you have now announced things you should not have announced.

BTW, from your own description, it sounds like the potential problem between the dogs is more likely to occur because of your dog. You noted that your dog doesn't get out except rarely, but then note that you apparently lose control of your dog and it sneaks out (which is your fear of the neighbor dog because of your care and control of your animal). Under "rarely" for when it gets out of the yard, you included it does so when it poops (which dogs poop EVERY DAY if not more than once a day), or when the kids throw the ball. So it sounds like your dog gets out a lot. The neighbor's dog doesn't as per your description, but you are worried about IT being the problem.
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Old October 3, 2013, 06:41 AM   #14
TimSr
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I know of no US jurisdiction where it is lawful to allow your dog, on or off leash, to enter another's property without permission.

This also begs the question, when your dog leaves your property to poop, whose property is he on? Just asking.

If you are going to make a fuss about this dog entering your property, just expect the same scrutiny as the law is not limited to dogs that might bite.
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Old October 3, 2013, 08:06 AM   #15
Skans
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Is the OP living in the city or in the country. It's common to let dogs roam off-leash in the country. You don't want to go shooting someone's dog that wonders onto your property but isn't causing trouble - this happens frequently to me when I'm in in N. Georgia. Usually the dog just smells me cooking bacon outside, waiting for scraps.

While I tolerate other people's dogs coming onto my property (as long as they aren't causing trouble) in the country, I would not tolerate it in a suburban setting. Houses are too close together - pit-bull and baby might be no more than a few yards away from each other, across property lines. There's not enough time to react and rules should be stricter when people live close to each other about minding your dog.
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Old October 3, 2013, 08:20 AM   #16
Rifleman1776
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It is well established that you have a right to protect yourself, others and property.
But, these days some prosecutors and judges will be serious animal lovers and will not tolerate any injury to an animal regardless of circumstances. Doesn't make sense but that is the way things often are.
However, I caution all here to be careful with their responses.
I once gave a solution on another, similar thread, and got spanked by the mods for what I said.
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Old October 3, 2013, 08:36 AM   #17
Lordy123
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Quote:
Always remember you have a right to protect yourself, your wife, 16 month old, even your lab in your property or elsewhere.
This is not true in all states, in WI dogs are considered property and I cannot legally use lethal force to protect my property from damage.
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Old October 3, 2013, 08:57 AM   #18
zincwarrior
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Are these fenced yards or open yards? If fenced, make sure the fence is nice and strong. Also a nice big can of extra strong pepper spray may be in order.

I second, that I've not heard of Collies as being dangerously aggressive, vs. something that would be hard to stop with pepper spray.

Talk to the guy if he's a nice guy Express your concerns.
Quote:
Collie behavior is to bark a lot. I have a Collie he has a big bark, but there is a huge difference between a big bark while tail wagging, and a growl an sneer.

I highly doubt your neighbor's dog would enter your yard and fight, and I would suggest that you try to meet the neighbor's dog so you can have some info about the dogs gender, age, if it is fixed, and the sort.

I also have a neighbor with, "somewhat of a scary dog," a growling, sneering mutt of sorts. One day, when I saw that particular neighbor out of a walk with her dog, I introduced myself to her and her dog. What I found out was, "both her dog, and my dog have a lot in common," both have been rescued, and rescued dogs can be a little apprehensive of any human they do not know.

Perhaps your neighbor's dog is a rescued dog?

The way human beings treat animals, is very much the way they will treat other human beings. There is little else, that will give you the same insight into a persons behavior, as to how they treat all types of life on this planet.

Its probably a thread that is headed for a lock, but hopefully my post will stay in tacked, even if it blatantly asks you to examine your behavior and ask yourself why your perceive your neighbor's dog this way, and try to reassess your conclusion to see if you can find any wholes in your logic.
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Old October 3, 2013, 09:00 AM   #19
zincwarrior
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Quote:
Is the OP living in the city or in the country. It's common to let dogs roam off-leash in the country. You don't want to go shooting someone's dog that wonders onto your property but isn't causing trouble - this happens frequently to me when I'm in in N. Georgia. Usually the dog just smells me cooking bacon outside, waiting for scraps.
I will freely admit that if you are cooking bacon outside and I happen by, I too will be waiting for scraps.
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Old October 3, 2013, 09:11 AM   #20
Vanya
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There's a lot of good, sensible advice here, and I think we've established that the dog shouldn't be shot without a very good reason for doing so. So, since this isn't really gun-related at this point... time to close it.
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