The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > NFA Guns and Gear

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old September 19, 2006, 08:08 AM   #1
ChowYunFat
Member
 
Join Date: September 18, 2006
Posts: 50
Is it legal to own an MP5 in the states?

I've seen a lot of gun shops selling M4/M16-type guns and AK-47-type guns but no MP5s. Are MP5s banned? Do they make a semi-automatic version of the MP5?
ChowYunFat is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 09:05 AM   #2
VUPDblue
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 18, 2005
Location: Central Indiana
Posts: 1,978
There are several companies that make MP5 clones in semi-auto, and there is a semi-auto variant (close to an MP5 but not exactly the same) out there called the HK51. Full auto transferrable MP5's are out there but they sell in the 5 figures. Hope this helps.

nick
__________________
Silencers have NEVER been illegal !
VUPDblue is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 09:56 AM   #3
mikel_holt
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 4, 2006
Location: Tuscumbia,AL
Posts: 122
H&K used to sell the SP89 which is the semi variant of the MP5. I don't know if it's still in production or not. An MP5 registered before '86 is still legal to own if you can afford it. I don't understand the fascination with them myself. It takes too long to load mags. I've shot a silenced one and one time did it for me. They're typically a waste of ammo.
__________________
To err is human, to forgive is devine. Neither happen to be my policy.
mikel_holt is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 10:22 AM   #4
FS2K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 9, 2006
Posts: 1,853
Being that Heckler and Koch is a German Company

Their "Assault" type rifles and Carbines are no longer legal to import into the US for civilian use.

While the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban has expired there are still alot of restrictions on the import of foreign manefactured "assault" type rifles. The HK's fall into the catagory of banned import weapons.

HK's civilian version of the MP5 was a HK94 basically a 16" barreled semi-auto version of the MP5 also chambered in 9 x 19mm. The HK SP89 is the pistol version of the MP5 weapons system, and the HK SP89PDW (Personal Defense Weapon) is the semi-version of the MP5K (Kurtz) The HK51 is actually a .308 caliber carbine, and not considered a part of the MP5 family.

As VUPD mentioned there are several US manefacturers that are producing MP5 "clones" in legal configuations like Bobcat Weapons, Ohio Rapid Fire, and Vetor Arms (though they do not offer a 9MM version). Special Weapons also manefactured MP5 look-a-likes that looked like the MP5 but did not share the HK's rotating bolt design.

I own a Bobcat BW89PDW, their version of HK's SP89PDW. Bobcats are assembled using genuine Heckler and Koch parts but mix them up with US manefactured parts in order for their weapons to me 922R compliant. The possess enough US made parts to allow them to be legally owned in the US. The Bobcats are high quality items and are very reliable. I am totally saticfied with my gun and would recommend Bobcat Weapons to anyone looking for the next best thing to a HK MP5 at 1/4 the cost.

Hope this helped.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Raptor40.jpg (180.8 KB, 1287 views)
File Type: jpg mp5gal2.jpg (89.8 KB, 1124 views)
__________________
Just a big fan of guns.
FS2K is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 11:53 AM   #5
AK103K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2001
Location: PA -- In the shadow of the Shade
Posts: 7,996
Quote:
It takes too long to load mags.
As opposed to what? HK mags are about the easiest to load.

They dont take long to empty though.

Just out of curiosity, which SMG do you find better as an all around gun?


Mines a Fleming HK94 to MP5 conversion. They were once reasonable, this one was $800, $450 for the 94, $350 for the conversion.

Its got a few tens of thousands of rounds through it over the years and in all that time, the only thing that ever broke was a roller retainer clip. The gun was still running with it broken, I only noticed it when I was cleaning.

__________________
“The enemy is anybody who's going to get you killed, no matter which side he is on.”
― Joseph Heller, Catch-22
AK103K is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 01:37 PM   #6
Evil Monkey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 2, 2005
Posts: 533
Quote:
Special Weapons also manefactured MP5 look-a-likes that looked like the MP5 but did not share the HK's rotating bolt design.
What kind of laced weed are you smoking?

No roller locked HK ever had a "rotating bolt"....BECAUSE THEY WERE ROLLER LOCKED, DELAYED BLOWBACK!

I believe Special Weapons are NOT "look alikes", they are the real deal, of course with out HK markings. Vulcan/Hesse makes "look alikes" because I hear they use blowback operation instead of traditional HK delayed blowback operation.
__________________
I was at the casino the other day and went to the high rollers table. I asked the dealer 'what's the minimum bet?' He said, "a hundred dollars." I said what's the maximum? He said, "a box of .45"
Evil Monkey is online now  
Old September 19, 2006, 03:01 PM   #7
FS2K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 9, 2006
Posts: 1,853
Awe did I upset you Monkey?

You seem upset. Glad you like your Special Weapons SW5. And thanks for the term correction, appreciate it.

Well, no matter the terms used here's some reading for you to consider on your "real deal" Special Weapons SW5's:

Here is my take on Todd and Wendy Bailey from Special Weapons
He is a jackass who does things that border on criminal. He has also got to be the crappiest businessman alive, and is an inverterate, compulsive liar. All I ask for is an apology and refund of the difference between the introductory price and the rip off 11/99 price gouge.

Here are my problems
#1 After 160 rounds the front site fell out due to the fact that the roll pin was never inserted.
#2 plastic lower has developed considerable lateral play from front to rear.
#3 Front forearm is exceptionally loose and where the front pin goes through to hold it on contacts the barrel and cocking tube and has already started to gall both areas.
#4 Firing pin head has started to mushroom
#5 Ejector face has started to mushroom
#6 The mag well is off spec and mags rattle or fall out becasue of disporporting.

Nick1
Annon ville, California
U.S.A


Todd Bailey puts out unreliable, unsafe products. He always threatens to sue anyone that tells the truth.

John - La Mesa, California
U.S.A.

I purchased a sw-5 from Speciality weapons and continually have malfunctions,failure to feed problems and casing dont eject and wind up inside the gun. The magagazine does not fit in the well properly making it loose. are there any remedies to these problems?

Cliff - Washington, North Carolina
U.S.A.


I sure hope your life doesn't ever depend on these "copycats" in a real fight. The big gun-makers charge more for their weapons for a reason. Good materials, good machining, and good quality control cost more. Leave the crap for the gang-bangers. Want cheap but reliable, buy surplus SKS rifles for a song, and they won't get you killed from jamming when you need it to work.

Marc - Makaha, Hawaii
U.S.A.

From another website under the search for "Special Weapons"

Special Weapons, or "Speshul Wepunz" as is they are commonly called in the industry, is a bottomfeeding company in Mesa Arizona, famous for low quality products and dishonest business practices. The owner, Todd Bailey, has been banned from every major firearms board in the US.

And more from http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.co...w5/pagesw5.htm

factory unit has the axle pins flush with the sides of the trigger mechanism housing and flat on the ends. All the axle pins in an HK trigger mechanism housing are teh same width - that is, the same as the width of the housing. The SW5 pins (A) seem to be randomly cut from dowell pins. This kindof shoddy detail work is typical of Special Weapons Products. The clearance cut for the semiauto shelf (B) is adequate. Quality manufacturers, however, copy the factory unit by welding a plate to cover this cut. The plate gives lateral rigidity to the trigger mechanism housing. Note that SW left the bare metal from the cut open to corrosion - they didn't even bother to refinish the unit after cutting on it. The weld at (C) however was never dressed down. This prevents the trigger mechanism housing from fitting into the grip frame without pounding it in and splaying the grip frame walls outward.
When converting a standard fullauto trigger mechanism housing to semiautomatic, a pin must be installed in the housing to limit trigger sweep. While the SW pin is functional, the complete lack of finish work is indicative of what you can expect from the compay.
Why would SW run this part of the trigger mechanism housing across a belt sander to reduce it smaller than the factory unit? Simple - the sloppy welds on the rest of the unit prevent it from fitting properly. I guess it was easier to grind down a correct area than to fix the incorrect ones.
The bolt carrier is another fine example of why Special Weapons has earned a reputation as the bottom-feeders of the industry. Apparently, due perhaps to welding the cocking tube on crooked (or welding through the cocking tube, leaving a ridge inside), the bolt carrier wouldn't fit. But again, instead of correcting the problem, they just ground down a correctly dimensioned part to make it fit. Disgusting.
Perhaps after examining the product closely, you will understand why I choose not to work with any products from Special Weapons, Todd Bailey, or any of his front companies.

I apologise for getting Vulcan/Hesse mixed up with Special Weapons, but as you can see it wasn't without reason.

Guess you got the exception to the rule Eh Monkey?
__________________
Just a big fan of guns.
FS2K is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 04:01 PM   #8
Evil Monkey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 2, 2005
Posts: 533
I don't own any SW products and I don't care for them. What got me PO'd is when you said that original HKs had a "rotating bolt".

I guess you found out my pet peeve. I hate when people get gun facts all screwed up. I don't even like when I am wrong!
__________________
I was at the casino the other day and went to the high rollers table. I asked the dealer 'what's the minimum bet?' He said, "a hundred dollars." I said what's the maximum? He said, "a box of .45"
Evil Monkey is online now  
Old September 19, 2006, 04:16 PM   #9
FS2K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 9, 2006
Posts: 1,853
Good deal Monkey, now I know to be more careful!

Have a good one Buddy.
__________________
Just a big fan of guns.
FS2K is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 04:39 PM   #10
FS2K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 9, 2006
Posts: 1,853
I agree with AK103K

I don't find the MP5 design magazines particularly hard to swap out, especially with a paddle type release lever installed. Even without it it isn't that time consuming at all, especially with the bolt open.
__________________
Just a big fan of guns.
FS2K is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 07:29 PM   #11
mikel_holt
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 4, 2006
Location: Tuscumbia,AL
Posts: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by A103K
As opposed to what? HK mags are about the easiest to load.
As opposed to how little time it takes to empty them. I don't think anything comes close tothe MP5. I just don't have any use for any SMG. My taste in NFA goods runs to silencers and belt fed guns. I can empty a 30 round mag fast enough in a semi thank you very much.
__________________
To err is human, to forgive is devine. Neither happen to be my policy.
mikel_holt is offline  
Old September 19, 2006, 07:43 PM   #12
AK103K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2001
Location: PA -- In the shadow of the Shade
Posts: 7,996
as with any SMG or full auto for that matter, how you shoot them determines how fast they empty. There are definite advantages to full auto when fired properly that semi auto cant do, no matter how fast you try to pull the trigger.

But hey, to each his own. Sometimes its just fun to dump a mag and show the non believers its easy to put all the rounds into the center of an IPSC target at 10-15 yards with one pull of the trigger.
__________________
“The enemy is anybody who's going to get you killed, no matter which side he is on.”
― Joseph Heller, Catch-22
AK103K is offline  
Old November 12, 2006, 02:08 AM   #13
flashguy
Member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2006
Posts: 39
Hk51

The HK51 is not a variant of the MP5, although they are visually quite similar. The MP5 is a 9mm submachinegun and the HK51 is a 7.62x51 (.308) assault rifle. The HK51 is not manufactured by H&K, but is very similar to the HK53 in .223 that is H&K made. HK51s are conversions of (usually) HK91 semi-auto battle rifles, shortened and modified with after-market auto sears to be select-fire weapons. I know this because I have 2 of them: an HK51 (8.9" barrel) and an HK51K (4.7" barrel). They very closely resemble MP5s if you don't notice the larger magazines. They are a lot of fun to shoot. If you like spectacular shooting, here are a couple of photos of my HK51 at night:

one round


multiple rounds


enjoy!
flashguy
flashguy is offline  
Old November 16, 2006, 07:38 PM   #14
ghost457
Junior Member
 
Join Date: July 29, 2006
Location: Northeast Ohio
Posts: 1
Here's a place where you can buy MP5's....... scroll down about halfway

http://www.onlythebestfirearms.com/nfa1.html
__________________
Those who commit an act of terror forfeit every right they once had.

Molon Labe!
ghost457 is offline  
Old December 6, 2006, 11:35 PM   #15
shooter71
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 13, 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 129
this is a great thread..i should have read this before i posted mine since its pretty close to the same..i was at youtube today and im seeing 11,12 yr old kids shooting full auto mp5? whats up with that? is their dad an leo or i mean how do you about that not that i really want to own a full auto smg..but id like to shoot one..im trying to educate myself on the MP5 and was curious
shooter71 is offline  
Old December 7, 2006, 06:00 AM   #16
AK103K
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2001
Location: PA -- In the shadow of the Shade
Posts: 7,996
Quote:
....and im seeing 11,12 yr old kids shooting full auto mp5? whats up with that?
My kids were 5 when they started shooting mine.
__________________
“The enemy is anybody who's going to get you killed, no matter which side he is on.”
― Joseph Heller, Catch-22
AK103K is offline  
Old October 8, 2012, 06:38 PM   #17
BDD8
Member
 
Join Date: October 8, 2012
Posts: 27
Shooter71...heard of Knob Creek Shooting Range in Kentucky? You should go there if you want to fire a full-auto MP5 or any other full-auto weapons not normally available to civilians (e.g. mini-gun, gatlin gun, flame thrower using napalm...etc.).

I'd like to go there once. Could be a lot of fun. They say it's a "family friendly" place. But being that it's Kentucky I have only one reservation not being white. Are they very racist (not to imply that their all racist...that would be naive of course)? Dunno...
BDD8 is offline  
Old October 8, 2012, 07:31 PM   #18
Tom Servo
Staff
 
Join Date: September 27, 2008
Location: Foothills of the Appalachians
Posts: 10,388
Necro thread from 2006.
__________________
Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change.
--Randall Munroe
Tom Servo is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.11643 seconds with 10 queries