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Old May 3, 2016, 01:05 AM   #1
979Texas
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The Weatherby Magnum Calibers...

This is kind of a general post/thread. The only specific is the Weatherby Magnum calibers. I know some dislike them, some like them, some consider them pointless, etc. Anyways I'm just very curious about them and would like any kind of info, advice, pros, cons, personal opinions, stories, advice, and experiences on these calibers.

I for one have no experience with these calibers, but I have done some thorough research and would simply like to know more about these calibers.

Any input is appreciated, there are no right or wrong opinions on this thread as long as they have something to do with the Weatherby Magnum calibers, from the .224 through the .460 Weatherby Magnum.
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Old May 3, 2016, 09:02 AM   #2
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Haven't visited it for several years, but there's a website for Wby aficionados.
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Old May 3, 2016, 01:38 PM   #3
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Thank you Art, would you happen to know the name of the website? Or how I could go about finding it?
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Old May 3, 2016, 02:30 PM   #4
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I own and reload for 300WBY and 340 WBY. The forums I'm familiar with are www.weatherby.dk.forum and Weatherby Nation. I prefer the one based in Denmark. There are member there knew Roy and know Ed. Ed comments from time time.

Weatherby rifles aren't for everyone. The rifles aren't cheap. The ammunition prices scare of most consumers. The recoil scares off most shooters.

I inherited the 340WBY from an uncle that I would shoot with and reload for. It's a MKV Deluxe, circa 1970. It was made in Germany by Saur and Sons. It is a work of art. It's in my brothers gun safe in Spokane.

The appeal for me, aside from a fascination with things grossly overpowered, is that chamberings at the Weatherby level of intensity, are easier to shoot long range, accurately. IMO.

The point blank range on 300WBY is right at 400yds. That's point and shoot out to 400. This with a 180gr TTTx. Not that I have ever used this feature. Any kill I ever made with the 300WBY, I could have made with a 30-06, or heck a 30-30. A sample of two mule deer, but neither moved more than a few feet.

I have for all intents and purposes retired the Weatherby's and shoot a Cooper varmint rifle chambered in 6.5-284, ballistically identical to 300WBY.

Weatherby rifles may be difficult for most people to shoot accurately. It sure is for me. I can do it for about nine rounds.

Weatherby rifles are really a superior hunting tool in the right hands.

If you own one shooters may think your a snob. Real shooters will know you're a real shooter.
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Old May 3, 2016, 03:12 PM   #5
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Quote:
I know some dislike them, some like them, some consider them pointless, etc.
You're right, and I happen to be one of the ones that likes them. My favorite is the .240 Mark V that my father talked me into buying when I was in my late teens. I spent most every penny that I had at the time and could barely stomach doing so, but I've never regretted it since. I can honestly say that I truly love that rifle. (It helped that the fella selling it to me had ordered it for a guy buying it for his wife and put $200 down on it three years prior and he'd never seen him again, so he knocked the $200 off my price and threw in a set of four bolt Redfield rings and one piece base to sweeten the deal.)
I can not speak for all the calibers, my only experience is with the .240 and .300, but when someone eludes to Roy's endeavors as being pointless I have to disagree. Necessary? No, but certainly not pointless.
When you can push a 100 grain bullet out to 400 yards with that .240, carrying the same energy behind it that the .243 Winchester can only carry out to 250 yards with the same projectile, I think there's a point to it.
I also think that Roy accomplished similar performance gains with all of his calibers that he developed, but I'm likely biased.

added: If you don't handload, you may want to consider something else because the factory loaded ammunition available is very pricey. But if you handload, and like em faaast and flat the Weatherby calibers are hard to beat!
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Old May 3, 2016, 03:37 PM   #6
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If someone can handle the recoil and doesn't mind the cost they offer some amazing speeds. But with the advancements of modern optics and bullets they don't have nearly the advantage they once did.

Bullet speed at the muzzle is far less important than bullet speed at impact. There are several options in bullets today that can be fired in a 30-06 that will hit harder at extended ranges than the bullets available 60 years ago from any of the 300 magnums. They start out a lot faster from the 300's, but by the time they are 500-600 yards down range the newer bullets will be moving faster because of better aerodynamics.

Quote:
The point blank range on 300WBY is right at 400yds. That's point and shoot out to 400.
Modern optics have made this pretty much irrelevant. Rifles with flat trajectories no longer have any real advantage. Use a range finder, dial in the distance on the scope and it is point and shoot for as far as the shooter has the skills to shoot. And with much more precision than the old point blank range method.

Of course you can use the modern bullets and optics with one of the Weatherby's as well. But a lot of people like the idea of having 30-06 recoil and still being able to put the same energy on target as a 300 WBY mag from 60 years ago.

I don't dislike them. I think they were an important step in cartridge development. But I also think they are past their prime and in decline.

It is a lot like comparing the muscle cars of the 1960's to the cars of today. You can use modern technology in a tiny 3.5L V-6 turbocharged engine in a 1/2 ton truck and out pull a truck from 50 years ago that had an engine twice as big. And still get 3X better fuel mileage. You just don't need the big 450 ci engines anymore to get performance from a truck, and you no longer need a bucket of powder to get performance from a rifle.
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Old May 3, 2016, 04:39 PM   #7
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I have quite a few Weatherby's. 257, 300, 30-378. I also have several Vanguards in common calibers. I always considered them the working man's custom rifle. One step above the Remington's, Winchester's, Rugers, and the rest. I own them as well. A nice Mark V with a walnut stock is a thing of beauty, especially today when most of the rifles are so ugly that they should be sold in the garden section instead of in the sporting goods section. Right next to the shovels, rakes, post hole diggers, and toilet bowl plungers. Recently I've been purchasing Weatherby ammo for around $40 a box. This is WEATHERBY ammo. I doubt many can find premium ammo for standard calibers at that price. I handload for all of them.

It took the big companies over 60 years to come out with calibers to compete with the old "Bees". Mostly with the "short magnums" and RUMS and so forth. Everybody got all excited when someone re-invented the wheel. Weatherby owners just smiled. Most don't remember that Weatherby had the 1.5 inch accuracy gaurantee years before the other companies even dreamed about such accuracy in their products. I may be wrong, but I think Wby came out with the < 1 MOA gaurantee first as well. And in standard calibers to boot. I would not hesitate to put any comparable brand of rifle in a standard caliber against a Vanguard. Be it a Model 700, 70, or a 77 with similar features. I have them all and straight out of the box the only one that may outshoot the Vanguard is a darn Savage.

When I purchased my first Weatherby (.300) many years ago it came with a paper target. I swooned over the small group and ran out and bought a box of ammo, came home, ran in the backyard and began shooting. The group was around 2.5 inches at a hundred yards. I was mad as Hades! I called Weatherby and left a rather nasty message. It was a weekend too. The next afternoon, a Sunday, the phone rang and when I picked it up there was a gentleman on the other end calling from California asking about my Weatherby rifle. I was shocked! He told me that he had come in to check on some things and found my message. I proceeded to rant and rave about the rifle and he responded by asking me if I had the original target. I said absolutely. He then asked what grain bullet was recorded at the bottom of the target. I hollered 180 grains! He asked me what I was using. I said 150 grai............duh... He chuckled, told me to pick up a box of 180's, shoot them and if the rifle didn't perform to call him back and he would make things right. I humbly and embarrasingly told him I would. Sure enough, after picking up a box of 180's, the rifle shot perfectly. I was hooked. I really doubt that if I had purchased a Remington that someone would have called me back on a Sunday afternoon to talk about my rifle. Since then I have never had any trouble calling them and talking to a human being who spoke fluent English about any questions I may have. So yea, I guess you can say that I like the "old Bees".

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Old May 3, 2016, 04:53 PM   #8
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I've owned 257Wby (custom),270Wby (custom),300Wby (custom), 7Wby from Wby custom shop,300Wby factory and 30-338Wby factory.

257Wby nephew has,300 Wby custom friend has that and I sold 7Wby,300Wby factory and 30-338Wby. 270Wby was last build which I still use.

My 270Wby will handle 170gr Bergers and Berger has loading data for 7Wby with 180gr VLD and 210gr in 300Wby so there is interest.

Back in later part of the 70's early 80's I got tired of reloading and I got that factory 300 Wby and I got 5 boxes factory fill my elk/deer tag for couple years with that rifle/ammo. Good thing about Wby ammo, it shoot in Wby rifles

One of our LGS was pretty had to find brass but I could walk in a buy 270Wby brass if I needed .
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Old May 3, 2016, 06:05 PM   #9
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Like Rancid, I own a few of the Vanguards in standard calibers as well, and just this last Christmas bought a couple of them in .308 for my sons Christmas gifts.
I think that something that folks tend to overlook about the Vanguard. When Weatherby shipped production of their Mark Vs from Japan back to the States, the tooling stayed behind. The Vanguards are produced in the same factory as the Japanese Mark Vs were, same processes, (as are the Howa rifles to my understanding).
You're paying far less but basically getting the same barrel two inches shorter and blued with less luster attached to a different but very good action.
At least that's the way it was explained to me by a Weatherby rep out in California back in the mid 90s when I called and asked about them when they had become exclusive to WallyWorlds for a period of time.
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Old May 3, 2016, 06:45 PM   #10
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Remember this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wk9JgGSt4to
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Old May 3, 2016, 07:12 PM   #11
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I bought a German-made Mk V in 1971. A special deal; the #2 profile barrel, 26" in .30-'06. I didn't like the trigger, so I installed a Canjar. Had to do a bit of tweaking of the forearm. Wound up with a reliable sub-MOA shooter. Toted it in desert-mountain mule deer country as well as Cen-Tex hill country, for some 35 years. If my legs hadn't cheated and gotten old, I'd still be toting it.

Ever see the photo of the Eland that Roy killed with his .257? Crosswise through the hams, with an exit wound of about half a football. Good gun, lousy shot.
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Old May 3, 2016, 09:44 PM   #12
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Thank you folks very much for the great input so far. I really like what I'm hearing from what folks have share.

And no Art I have not seen the picture of Roy and his Eland. But I have read that he successfully killed a Cape Buffalo with one shot from his .257.

Thanks so far guys, keep it comin' I'm lookin' forward to hearin' more.
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Old May 3, 2016, 10:42 PM   #13
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The 257 and 300 are my favorites. I own the mark v's and they are on the heavy end of the spectrum. I also put heavy scopes and mounts. They are what I consider bean field rifles. The recoil on the 257 isnt bad but I sure wouldn't want a mountain rifle in 300. If you get one please get a chronograph to shoot thru. Most people think the recoil is unnecessary until they shoot the ol 06 thru the chronograph after you shoot your Roy's. Velocity and energy do matter.
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Old May 4, 2016, 05:54 AM   #14
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When you say weatherby I think 300. That was the company claim to fame and most popular loading. I prefer big bullets and more moderate speed. There was, and will always be a demand for the extreme.

The Weatherby were noted for two design features. First was the radius shoulder which is tricky to machine and I think time has proven that to be an unnecessary complication.

The second was a long freebore and that maybe a useful gimmick since it is used to good advantage in the ar15/556 chambers. But this has not become standard practice and is an accuracy liability.

Today there is the 300 RUM.This lacks the above and does away with the belt. A better design, FWIW.

I like to 30-06 as about an optimum 30 caliber and if I want more power prefer larger bore and if I want longer range a smaller bore. The day where we 'imagine' one gun for all hunting is long gone. Today is the age of specialized guns.

It was a sexy gun in its day. For me, I nether care or the ballistics or styling of the rifles.
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Old May 5, 2016, 10:34 PM   #15
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I like these commercials.
This,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikMQSnUvZqk

And this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDEqC2PfbYU
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Old May 6, 2016, 06:28 AM   #16
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As I posted I have 270Wby custom as such it doesn't have the Wby freebore.
This is post from the Wby site
http://www.weatherby.dk/showthread.p...270-Wby-reamer
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Old May 6, 2016, 05:28 PM   #17
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I have nothing against them, but I've never felt the urge to buy one. Their basic game is ultra-magnums with increased free bore. The free bore tends to make them less than ideal from an accuracy perspective. Hence why they have essentially no target shooting following.

The basic problem with all very hot cartridges is the thing they do (namely, increase your potential hunting range) isn't very useful. I don't consider it ethical to try to hunt beyond about 400 yards, and a basic 7mm mag will reach out that far and a few hundred yards further, no problem. What do I need a 7mm Weatherby for? I've already got more reach than I can ethically shoot.

Similarly, my .45-90 will drive a 400 grain solid through 50+ inches of hardwood. I've never actually managed to stop one short of using dirt, and never felt like digging one out of the dirt to figure out how far it went. What more is a .460 Weatherby going to get me? The most armored shot on an animal I know of is to brain an elephant from the front through the sinuses, and the non-magnum's got enough juice to get that job done (and comes in a lever gun to boot). There's no where else to go.
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Old May 6, 2016, 05:29 PM   #18
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The whole family of Wby cartridges is way overrated.

Understand, I'm not saying don't get one if you want it. But outside of use on African dangerous game, the standard & non-Wby magnum cartridges will do just fine.
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Old May 6, 2016, 07:23 PM   #19
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Roy Weatherby was a gunsmith, a rifle smith, and a wildcatter back in the heyday of wildcatting. He came up with his line of proprietary cartridges in a time when people thought the 30-06 was hard to beat. He used FN M98s until he exceeded their strength, so he developed his MarkV action with the help of JP Sauer. He built rifles that shot flatter, faster, and hit harder than anything else available on the market. His designs have influenced several generations of cartridge developers. He was part engineer, part showman, part hunter.

His cartridges could not be chambered in any other rifles, so if you wanted a Weatherby cartridge, you ended up with a Weatherby rifle. Western hunters liked the flat trajectory and extra range of the 240 Weatherby, the 257 Weatherby, and the 7mm Weatherby. African big and dangerous game hunters wanted the extra energy offered by the 300 Wby, 340 Weatherby, 375 Weatherby, 378 Weatherby, and the monstrous 460 Weatherby, so his rifles enjoyed international popularity among big game hunters. For years, a Weatherby Mark V cost twice as much as a comparably chambered Winchester M70, so they were also a status symbol.

His cartridges may not appeal to everyone, but shooters who use them claim great things for them. I am not a fan of the big belted beasts, but if you feel you need it, go ahead.
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Old May 6, 2016, 07:48 PM   #20
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In 1971 the retail price on a Mk V was $315. A Sako Forester, Mannlicher stock, was $220.

I don't recall the retail price of a Model 70, then, but a like-new Model 70 African in .458 sold for $150 in McBride's in Austin, Texas.
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Old May 7, 2016, 12:59 AM   #21
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I think they are silly luxury magnums.

But if you think you need the horsepower, if you think you can take the recoil, and if your pocketbook doesn't mind, you might as well.
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Old May 7, 2016, 09:36 PM   #22
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They aren't silly, they are very effective. They shoot flat, with lots of energy and range. to each his own.
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Old May 7, 2016, 10:56 PM   #23
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I reload for 4 guys out of 6 in the hunting party who love my ammo.

But I have rules before I accept a new challenge.
I must have their rifles for extended periods of time.
I must have a box or two of the factory ammo they prefer to use.
I must have a history of the shooter for what he hunts, where, and what time of year.
I must know elevation details of their hunts also.

Three guys use the 300 Winchester Short Magnum cartridge, two in Tikka's, one in a Browning A-bolt. I develop loads for each rifle and inform each owner to use only ammo I load for a particular rifle is only shot in that rifle, or I won't load for them again.

The guy with the Browning A-bolt previously used a Pre-64 Model 70 Winchester in 270 Winchester - I told him I would not load for him after hearing some of his hunting stories of lost game, game that was usually hit hard but bullet did not exit to leave a blood trail. He has a tendency to shoot at game in excess of 500 yards, which means the projectile has loss a significant amount of velocity to perform properly. He lucked out on his last hunt because they had 1" of fresh snow the morning of the hunt so game was easy to track after being shot. He later admitted that the Hunting Guide told him not to come back unless he had a larger bore rifle, similar to the 300WSM the others were using.

I load the 300WSM to 3100 fps and very tight loading specifications using WIN760 powder, Federal 215 Magnum primers, and 180 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips. After hearing the results of some of their successes, I've decided to switch to 180 or 200 grain Nosler AccuBonds, dependent on rifle and cartridge.

The fourth guy uses a 270 Weatherby Magnum and a 300 Weatherby Magnum. I am currently shooting his factory loads to develop a base set of data to which I compare my reloading data to. I've started with his 300 Weatherby Magnum in a Model V. First of all, he had requested some trigger work to clean up the pull, or better said yank. The trigger pull on his stock rifle broke at 9.25 pounds average, higher than any rifle I tested previously. After disassembling his trigger and making slight modification in addition to cleaning up some surfaces, I was able to set it as low as 6 ounces, which is much too light for most hunting rifles. I did set it to 2.25 pounds, and he was very happy with it - I did recommend he practice extensively before going on his next hunt. My initial testing with IMR4350 and IMR4831 and 180 grain Ballistic Tips did not result in the velocity or accuracy I was expecting. I've since switched to IMR7828 with Reloder 22 & 25 available if I need it. After developing a loading I like while using the Ballistic Tips, I switch to the AccuBonds for final testing of velocity and accuracy. Then I develop Ballistic Charts for them based on information I receive about their specific hunts. I have not developed anything for the 270 Weatherby Magnum yet, and I am looking for recommendations for a 0.277" diameter projectile that will perform at the velocity this rifle is capable of producing. After all testing and development has been completed, I will load a minimum of 200 rounds for each rifle and owner. Then I return rifle and ammo to them. The owners buy the components I recommend in advance of any testing or loading by myself.

Shooters 5 & 6 shoot 300 Winchester Magnums and have indicated they have interest in my loading techniques.

All payments are by donation only. I am disabled and can no longer hunt - I miss it immensely. I've been reloading since 1972 for all rifles, revolvers, pistols, or shotguns I own except rimfire ammo. (Last count 47 different rifle carytridges.)

Two of the Six have been very helpful in assisting me with my disabilities, and one provides a place I can drive to - to shoot my 50BMG target rifles out the back of my 50CAL Reloading Trailer, which allows me to develop loads at the range with all necessary equipment I have in trailer with generator for electrical power.

While some will not like the fact I reload for others, others like these guys who work hard for their hunting trips have no qualms about my ammo knowing it has been developed for their rifles exclusively. They have shot together and compared my ammo to any of their factory loads and all have stated mine are more accurate, ................................. and look better also !!!

I anneal each cartridge before any other loading starts and I am a firm believer in neck turning for consistent neck tension and pull. Cleaning primer pockets and deburring flash holes is a given along with trimming and VLD reaming case mouth. I size to a 0.002" shoulder clearance to save wear & tear on brass. I apply Match processes to all hunting ammo. For what these guys spend on their hunting trips, they know they want the best ammo available by whatever means. I process dirty brass with SS Pins to make case inspection much easier.

The only complaint I've heard is: "Your reloaded ammo is too shiny". I take great care in providing only the best I can provide. (I wish I could walk and hunt again.)

One guy used my ammo to hunt a Red Stag in New Zealand. Must trust it and me.
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Old May 8, 2016, 12:30 AM   #24
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What I truely hate to see is a man that shoots a 6 lb rifle in 30-06 but says a mark V 300 weatherby is too much recoil. The mark V coming in at just over 8lbs with the same 180 grain bullet is no more punishing than the former. The muzzle blast may be a bit more but we're also comparing 26" barrel to a much shorter barrel. Most people flinch on the first shot of any magnum but if you can convince them to close there eyes on the second shot and they realize it doesn't hurt them after the shot, they then settle down and shoot just as good as they can with their own rifle.
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Old May 9, 2016, 06:30 AM   #25
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I will be watching this thread. I really want a Wtby Mag. I have no use for one at all. Pretty much anything that I have ever encountered will drop with a 30-06 or 460sw. But, that doesnt change my infatuation with big magnums. I want a 460wm will possibly settle for one of the lessor 416,375 etc...
May come from hearing one of my dads friends (whom I always looked up to) shoot that 300wb across the mountains Tioga. Unmistakeable sound when compared to the 270 and -06 that everyone else used.
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