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Old September 23, 2012, 07:42 AM   #1
sks
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P7M8 mag release question

I don't expect this to be a long thread just needing some information.

Found a used P7M8 for under $600.00 but the magazine release is the European style from the bottom. Does that give any clues as to age, or other particulars about the gun?

Has markings from Alabama (perhaps imported there?).

Sold my last P7M8 15 years ago to purchase a P228 and sure wish I had another one. Couldn't afford both at the time but now I can.

Thanks for any information. Hope to have it in my hands by the middle of next week!
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Old September 23, 2012, 09:35 AM   #2
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First off... it isn't a P7M8 if it has a european mag release. The M8 has the levers at the trigger guard. Other than that and the plastic heat guard over the trigger, the two styles are essentially the same. The European mag release is most commonly called the PSP in order to differentiate the two models.

The price is good even for a PSP and I'd jump on it provided the gun is in good condition. The gun was imported as part of a huge number of police trade-ins a few years ago that sold for around $450 to $700. Most of these were produced in the low to mid 1980s, with serial number below 60K.
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Old September 23, 2012, 09:41 AM   #3
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What you found wasn't an m series rather it was a p7 The m series ( m8 m10) were developed for the american market with our love of the mag release location on the 1911 .
There have been some police trade inns from germany imported in recent years that have lowered the market value on shooter grade p7s somewhat . The original p7 had small grips that fit the frame , and a thin mag release that protruded from the frame quite a bit . This proved to be a problem due to officers releasing the mag in the course of getting in and out of vehicles . The mag release was redesigned as a lower profile lever that spanned the width of the frame , along with grips redesigned to shield it as a retrofit . About the same time HK started putting a relief cut on the butt with the wide release to insure it could be hit under stress .
Thats about all i can tell you on the mag release off the top of my head , though the folks over at hk pro forum could likely fill you in on when it was made ect .. I know there should be either a date or code on the slide that would give you exact year of manufacture . Some had the last two years rollmarked and some had a code iirc . I cant honestly remember which mine had and its in the safe right now LOL .
Hope the meager info i had to hand helped .
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Old September 23, 2012, 10:24 AM   #4
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That's a good summary.
While you mention a 'european mag release ' the P7 is different in that it's pushed forward to release .Other European ones the release is pushed backward !! That is a significant difference ! During IPSC matches I've surprized ROs in the speed I've been able to reload ."How can he reload so fast ?"
You 'milk it out' by lowering you're left hand , with forefinger on the floorplate extension and thumb pushing foreward on the release.In other words squeezing thumb and forefinger together as you pull you're hand down and magazine out. This provides very fast and positive reload. Your hand then is ready ,in position to to pick up the next mag. !!
For the M series I found it easy to use the trigger finger to operate the release and in the process it keeps the trigger finger away from the trigger.
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Old September 23, 2012, 03:20 PM   #5
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The P-7 PSP is a great CCW pistol because there is no mag release button to send the mag sliding across the concrete !

Great pistol but NEVER shoot anything but jacketed bullets in it...lead will ruin the gas system.
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Old September 23, 2012, 03:41 PM   #6
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Thanks much for the info. I was unaware of the differences and appreciate the heads up on that. The gun has "noticable" wear on both sides of the slide. No scratches but definitely worn as from many holsterings. The price right now is $585.00 with the box but only one magazine.

I don't see them often and that is why I was tempted to get my hands on this one. The first one I had was great for CCW.
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Old September 23, 2012, 09:20 PM   #7
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The P7 is one of the best shooting guns I own. $585 doesn't sound too bad. I paid almost $900 for this one a few years ago with only one mag.

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Old September 24, 2012, 02:53 AM   #8
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Quote:
The gun has "noticable" wear on both sides of the slide. No scratches but definitely worn as from many holsterings. The price right now is $585.00 with the box but only one magazine.
You are looking at German police surplus P7. Probably carried a lot and shot very little. It may say "BMI" on the slide like mine does. They came into the U.S. the last several years. I got one of the first batches back in 2002 or so imported by PW Arms, Redmond, WA, but the more recent ones came through HK whose U.S. operations are located in Trusseville, AL.

That's a good price, and they'll only be going up.
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Old September 24, 2012, 10:55 AM   #9
Mike Irwin
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I picked up one of the PSPs a few years ago. Paid around $600 for it, IIRC, with two magazines and tools.

Instruction manual is in German...

I LOVE the P series guns. Fantastic shooters. But, if something goes wrong with one, HK is something of a pain in the ass to deal with.

Spare magazines are specific, magazines for the M8 with the American-style magazine release will NOT work in the PSP.

And, spare magazines are expensive. Midway has them for $67.99 a piece, which is, relatively speaking, a good price.

My P7 is the only gun I keep loaded in my gunsafe.

Just in case.
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Old September 24, 2012, 06:04 PM   #10
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Thanks again for the replies and information.

Pilot: this one has Trusselville, AL marked on the side. Shop was closed today so I didn't get to go by and check again. Not sure about the BMI markings.

Don't know why I'm hesitating, my wife said to go buy it if I wanted it. And I've got $300.00 in gift cards. Probably go pick it up tomorrow. I wasn't aware of the PSP vs P7M8 but have done lots of reading since these posts and feel good about the gun. My last one was a nice shooter and I expect this one to be the same.

Thanks for the tip on the mags MI. It only has one and I'll definitely have to get one or two more.

Will post pics hopefully tomorrow!
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Old September 26, 2012, 09:36 AM   #11
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bought the PSP

Went back to the shop and there was the PSP so I bought it for $580.00. These photos are before cleaning it up. It was DIRTY on the inside and the magazine was black as soot inside as well. Much better now! Sticker inside the box says A Grade so I assume that would be good.







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Old September 26, 2012, 12:46 PM   #12
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Trusville Alabama gun...but without the roll marks or warning

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Old September 26, 2012, 01:28 PM   #13
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sks ,very good !!
If you have a problem using the slide hold open button you can make it much easier if you cut away a bit of the grip behind it . I found that mine rusted under the grips because moisture from sweat would get in there .That I solved by cleaning the frame and appling silicone wax around the edge of the frame under the grip.
Never lube the gas cylinder as lube will burn up and clog the cylinder.Some have complianed about not having the firing pin removal tool. That's hardly necessary as a paper clip, ball point pen or other things can be used.

ENJOY !!
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Old September 26, 2012, 06:47 PM   #14
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Very nice pistol and at a good price.

You may want to hunt down a cylinder scraper tool to keep the carbon cleaned out. The manual instructs to do this every 500 rounds or so.

You can get a manual on line too.

Great gun, but peculiar in some ways. Take the time to read up about the care and feeding.
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Old September 26, 2012, 07:01 PM   #15
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Thanks all. I will need to find a cylinder scraper as it was missing.

Thanks Mete for the information. Haven't checked under the grips but will give that a look.

Does the 11/85 refer to manufacture date?
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Old September 26, 2012, 07:42 PM   #16
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Methinks you ran across a great pistol in Grade A condition at a great price.
Last one I bought (probably 4 years ago) was a Grade B and I paid (IIRC) $600-650 for it. It was definitely not the nicest one I have seen or owned, but it scratched my itch for a while.

P7s are great guns. I bought my first back in 86 or so, and have owned six or seven of them through the years (including two M10s and an M13). I always end up selling the one I have, then a while later, buying another.

Been a while since I've owned one, and I find myself paying more attention lately to P7 threads and P7s for sale...
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Old September 26, 2012, 08:43 PM   #17
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Quote:
Does the 11/85 refer to manufacture date?
Yes. The NDS cartouche is for the Lower Saxony State Police, in Germany. The date and serial number indicate it was one of the last ones made for the production run for this agency. The proof mark is the military proof as opposed to the Ulm atlers used for commercially sold pistols.

This batch of police trades were graded by HK prior to importaion to Trussville. They were graded A,B or C depending on wear, not necessarily cosmetics. Some had parts replaced. This is known because a few came with brand new pistons. The piston will accumulate carbon over time, (which does not affect performance).

Enjoy the P7.

Last edited by PSP; September 27, 2012 at 04:53 AM.
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Old September 26, 2012, 09:44 PM   #18
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Looks like a nice Lower Saxony pistol , Congrats ! you will enjoy it .
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Old September 26, 2012, 10:21 PM   #19
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Yep, Nds is the Lower Saxoney code. My PSP has BMI, which I believe is the Ministry of the Interior Police.

Nice score. You will LOVE it. Make sure the gas port in the rear of the barrel is clean. I use a bent paper clip to check that it is clear.
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Old September 26, 2012, 11:21 PM   #20
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U.S Park Police

As an aside, the U.S Park Police, (not the Rangers, who plodded along with .38's and some .357's in the end) were issued HK-P7's for a while in the mid to late 80's. I don't believe they utilized them long, and made the jump to SIGS with the rest of DOI (including the Rangers!) in the early 90's.

USPP are urban only and work almost exclusively in DC and San Francisco. How the P7's got selected is a mystery.
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Old September 27, 2012, 07:31 AM   #21
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"As an aside, the U.S Park Police, (not the Rangers, who plodded along with .38's and some .357's in the end) were issued HK-P7's for a while in the mid to late 80's. I don't believe they utilized them long, and made the jump to SIGS with the rest of DOI (including the Rangers!) in the early 90's."


Sorry, Bamaranger, but that's not really correct.

I know, because one of my best friends is a lieutenant with the Park Police with over 27 years on the job and was for about 2 years their public information officer.

Park Police were armed for a long time (probably the 1960s through the 1980s) with Smith & Wesson Model 10s.

In the early 1990s (1990 or 1991, IIRC) they transitioned to HK P7M8s and P7M13s. Detectives and female officers generally got the M8s, all others got the M13s.

USPP carried those guns until sometime in 2010, summer I think is when the transition started, NOT to Sigs, but to HK P2000s in .40 Smith & Wesson.

The P2000 is the only approved duty weapon.

During the P7 years there were, IIRC, no approved off-duty weapons other than the P7 or a firearm that operated in the same manner. Given that HK was the only maker of squeeze cockers...

That policy started to change, though, and now USPP officers can carry off duty any firearm that is approved by an armorer and with which the officer can qualify. My friend generally carries a Ruger .380 off duty, but also has a Smith Model 36.


"USPP are urban only and work almost exclusively in DC and San Francisco. How the P7's got selected is a mystery."

Park Police also have a significant presence in New York City, and lesser presences in Philadelphia, and I THINK Florida and possibly Texas.
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Old September 27, 2012, 07:57 AM   #22
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The New Jersey State Police also carried them for a time.
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Old September 27, 2012, 08:24 AM   #23
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I have always wanted to see how a P7M8 would run in a defensive shooting style competition.
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Old September 27, 2012, 08:26 AM   #24
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I've used a P7M13 and my P7PSP in a couple of steel plate matches and have done very well with them.

I love the P7. I'm very accurate with it.
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Old September 27, 2012, 09:04 AM   #25
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yeah, i love the p7 in defensive or quick reaction type drills and competitions. it's abilities as a point-and-shoot weapon are unmatched IMO. if only it were hi-capacity...
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