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Old September 28, 2012, 06:54 AM   #26
Tinner666
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Smaller is easier for me. Lighter. I have a bad back and I swear I can feel the weight of every extra round I carry. That said, I still carry a nearly full G26.
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Old September 28, 2012, 08:36 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbob86 View Post
Easier to conceal a smaller gun.

30yd vs. 50 yd. group size is pretty irrelevant for self defense purposes: You'd have to do some pretty vigorous mental gymnastics to come up with a scenario where 50 yard accuracy would be important in a self defense situation. If such a case did arise, you might have some difficulty convincing a jury that you had no other option than to take careful aim and shoot a guy half a football field away because you felt you were in immediate danger of death or serious bodily harm .....

The odds of you needing a gun are generally pretty small*, and if you do, ANY gun will do in most cases, because generally, nobody wants to be shot with anything. In the small minority of cases where the gun is actually fired, the odds that it will occur at greater than conversational distances are pretty small as well.....


* provided you do everything else you can to avoid bad situations and people..... if you are going to sit in your car in a part of town known for trade in recreational pharmacueticals in the wee hours.... you are going to skew your odds just a bit....
I agree with this.

Carry whatever suits you, but I doubt I'll be taking any 50-yard self-defense shots. Not saying it'll never happen, but I'm willing to bet the odds are pretty slim.
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Old September 28, 2012, 08:48 AM   #28
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If such a case did arise, you might have some difficulty convincing a jury that you had no other option than to take careful aim and shoot a guy half a football field away
+1 lol. But I agree for self defense purpose being able to shoot up to about 15 accurately with your carry gun is mandatory. In a real life scenario I'd argue it's not likely to end up in a shoot out that requires you to shoot out to fifty yards.
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Old September 29, 2012, 11:45 AM   #29
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I carrier the LC9 or S&W 642 because they are easier to conceal. I'd rather shoot a 1911 or 6" revolver.
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Old September 29, 2012, 04:29 PM   #30
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Fullsize, if you do not mind me asking where you live? carrying a full size in 100 Mississippi heat, can be done, but not always easy
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Old September 29, 2012, 04:34 PM   #31
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I can comfortably carry, and easily a conceal my Ruger SR9c all year. After experimenting a lot with the upper limit of what I can carry in warm weather, a Glock 19 is right at the tipping point between 'yes' and 'no'. My PPQ is on the wrong side of that line in warm weather. Of course, we wear heavy clothes 8/12 months in Oregon.

Why do I prefer to carry the largest types that I can carry?

1. Controllability. If I have to shoot while moving, with a one-handed grip, my SR9c gives me greater grip, improved felt recoil, and a far superior trigger to the DAO single stacks dominating the subcompact category.

2. Accuracy with longer shots IS a worthwhile consideration in places (like Oregon) where the law allows you to shoot to save another person. 0-12 feet is most common in self defense, but there are shooting situations every month where action was taken at longer range. Texas bystander shoots man to save stabbing victim... Responsible citizen makes 165 yard (!!!) shot with .357 revolver to defend a police officer...

3. Capacity. 10+1, plus 10 or 17 in a spare mag on my belt.


If I have to use my weapon, I want to have something that gives me the best possibility of putting shots where they need to go, as fast as I need them to get there.
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Old September 29, 2012, 04:50 PM   #32
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I carry a Kel-Tec P11.

It's small and light, but chambered in 9mm. 10 +1 capacity and gets covered easily with a t-shirt.

I wold love to carry my 5" Colt .45 all the time, but it's not easy for me to cover up.


It really doesn't matter what you carry as long as it's comfortable to you. As long as it goes bang every time.

By the time you recognize a threat, the BG will be on you. Pull it and keep squezzing the trigger till the threat stops.
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Old September 29, 2012, 05:06 PM   #33
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My first handgun bought specifically for carry was a HKUSPC. Still too damn big. Replaced it with a 3" 1911 that I still carry, as it is perfect. I would opine that most will gravitate toward smaller rather than bigger, with a few exceptions, the longer they carry, as long as they are satisfied with performance and are willing to trust their life to it.
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Old September 30, 2012, 02:48 PM   #34
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Just to clarify I do most of my practicing at 10 to 20 feet. Long shots are a useful part of "gun-fu". What about situations when a robber is retreating and you take a shot at his tires. Or a loose pitbull is charging one of your children, Or you get caught in a situation when you get the "opportunity " to take down a cowardly gun man shooting at innocent people. All pistols work up close when defending ourselves, but what about the times when a well placed shot will save OTHERS?
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Old September 30, 2012, 02:56 PM   #35
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What about situations when a robber is retreating and you take a shot at his tires.
Really...?
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Old September 30, 2012, 03:16 PM   #36
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to sigcurious: ??really

Yes, really. Not saying its likely but its a scenario where accuracy would be critical. My point is that dynamic situations can arise and go from 10 ft to 50 yds and still be self defense situation. When I was in the military, I saw all kinds of situations where the weapon I had became
inadequate in a hurry. Defending my life AND THE LIVES OF OTHERS and staying within the law, I want every advantage I can have at my disposal, because frankly, criminals and terrorists don't care. I DO
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Old September 30, 2012, 03:32 PM   #37
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And how exactly is shooting at the tires of a retreating robber's car defending your life or others?
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Old September 30, 2012, 03:37 PM   #38
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to tennjed. i live in Arkansas

We get 100 degree weather too? In the heat I wear an untucked xl tshirt with whatever shorts or pants I want. I carry iwb at 2 or3 o'clock with my BUG in my left pocket and my extra mags at 9 o'clock and 2 speed loaders in right pocket. Cellphone in my left pocket. Wallet in my left back pocket, boot knife and flashlight in my back right pocket or right cargo pocket. Never had a second look from anyone, I am considered to be hyper vigilant so I am looking for who's looking. Comfort for me is not having to where a chemical
biological warfare suit in the desert. Period.
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Old September 30, 2012, 03:50 PM   #39
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to sigcurious.

It's not, but shooting out a tire will halt his retreat and allow a better chance to stop a criminal. But you win. I see what you're getting at and I respect it. My view from outside of the 0-12 foot box that defensive shooting can get lulled into. But what if we change the robber, into a k
idnapper?
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Old September 30, 2012, 04:03 PM   #40
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Sounds like a good way to endanger the kidnapping victim a) by shooting at the vehicle they are in b) by reducing the drivers ability to control the car.
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Old September 30, 2012, 04:07 PM   #41
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I carry as big as my clothing will allow. Typically a j-frame in the summer and my Coonan in the winter.

Its hard to strut around on the beach in a thong when you are trying to CCW a Desert eagle
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Shot placement is everything! I would rather take a round of 50BMG to the foot than a 22short to the base of the skull.

all 23 of my guns are 45/70 govt 357 mag, 22 or 12 ga... I believe in keeping it simple
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Old September 30, 2012, 04:26 PM   #42
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to sigcurious. kidnapping scenario

I know what you mean. But I'm sure you would risk your loved one surviving a wreck versus never seeing them again or being tortured, or mutilated, or worse. Its all"what if's" but its theses situations that shock us the most I 'm not trying to say I have the perfect answer because I don't. But when performance becomes a part of our armed citizen life style, and adrenaline is affecting that 2" or 3" grouping that we have at the range at 10ft, what would you wish you had? More rounds? More accuracy? More ballistic performance? Are those the thoughts you want when they drive off with your loved one? Or lying there bleedinh when crooks lookoutt man shoots you from up the road? Again, I'm just speaking about being ready for worst case, not just common bad.

Last edited by fullsize only; September 30, 2012 at 04:37 PM.
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Old September 30, 2012, 05:08 PM   #43
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For me, it's weight more than size in everything except extreme heat. I find a fully loaded glock 17 easier to carry than my 3" model 13. I found that as guns got lighter, I could carry bigger with less discomfort.
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Old September 30, 2012, 05:41 PM   #44
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I agree curiousg. That does help. Its easier to carry my g17 or my xdm than my sp101. 357 4".
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Old September 30, 2012, 06:50 PM   #45
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Fullsize, have you considered carrying a 6" revolver? I tend to believe a long barrel revolver to the most accurate handgun for most at longer distances. You can also find 8 round 357 for higher capacity
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Old September 30, 2012, 07:23 PM   #46
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But when performance becomes a part of our armed citizen life style, and adrenaline is affecting that 2" or 3" grouping that we have at the range at 10ft, what would you wish you had?
I'd say more time with your gun. My groups are smaller than that at 7 yards. Only when I open it to 20 yards do they get that large, or at rapid-fire. Beyond 20 yards will be a problem proving self-defense in court, most likely even beyond 10. And it's self-defense for me, as to why I carry. Of course, YMMV.
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Old September 30, 2012, 07:37 PM   #47
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stevie ray and tennjed

That is true stevieray, but again 7 yds with a cool head is not impossible, impressive yes. But how much of that do you lose under stress? I'm only stating what I believe gives best performance. If you spent equal time with a g17 that you spend with a g19, which will most people shoot better with? And if you can conceal it, what is TFL"s opinion on why they don't. Thr long shot scenarios are hypothetical possibilityies, that's all. Would you really want to be out of the fight at 90 yds? Not typical defense range I get it, but do you think a mad gunman, or a wild animal cared about those statistics?
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Old September 30, 2012, 07:54 PM   #48
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If you spent equal time with a g17 that you spend with a g19, which will most people shoot better with?
Wouldn't know, I have a G26 that I do just fine with. And believe it or not some do better with the baby Glock than the full-sized. Search these forums and you'll see examples of that.

Knowing a madman is coming for me at 90 yards, I would probably know ahead of time and therefore be armed with my Colt 6721 along with my EDC. And I change my EDC to a G29 for the possibility of wild animals at my Northern exposure. If I knew wild animals were going to be in my vicinity for some reason or another, I'd opt for my FAL.
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Old September 30, 2012, 08:15 PM   #49
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Lol! I hear ya man! I like the option for the wild animals. How's that FAL. shoot? I keep a dpms ar10 in the trunk of my car and raging bull 5" .44 mag in the glove box.I'm in the south where its a lot of wild hogs wild dogs and wild people. You'll face one the three in a 6 mo span for sure.
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Old September 30, 2012, 08:47 PM   #50
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Accuracy up close is what I prefer; if I get that part right the size of weapon wont matter caliber might. 50, 30, 10, yards would be hard to justify, 10 to 15 feet or less is probably the norm. I'm comfortable with a sr40 with just a basic Galco IWB and a bodyguard. 38 with a King Tuck when I put on a suit ( which is often) and I'm ok with either comfort wise. I may change the sr40 for a sp101 2.25. Use what you feel will work for you, but don't make 50 yard accuracy your criteria.
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