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Old September 28, 2012, 06:43 PM   #76
ScottRiqui
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The low bore axis of the .380 produces as much recoil as the 9mm in many guns
I thought that a low bore axis was usually desirable, since it produces less muzzle flip than a higher axis, all else being equal?

Could it be that the increased felt recoil in a .380 comes from the blowback mechanism most of them use, rather than the relative position of the bore to the grip?
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Old September 28, 2012, 08:14 PM   #77
Seaman
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380.....BUG only

How about the Mississippi woman who was shot thru the brain with a 380 (thru & thru), survived, and then made tea for the investigating officer.

If the same shot had been made with a 9mm para bullet, which is heavier and travels significantly faster, it is likely that the victim would be immediately (and permanently) stopped.

Have carried the Sig P238, ankle BUG, but prefer the PPK in 32 ACP for that role. Better cartridge.

Carry a 9mm, 40 cal, 44 spl or 45, and survival chances improve.
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Old September 28, 2012, 08:22 PM   #78
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The woman in Mississippi took the bullet right in the middle of her forehead, and it passed between the lobes of her brain before exiting the back of her skull. Her survival was extremely unlikely, but not something that couldn't have also happened with a slightly larger bullet.

Also, what makes the .32 ACP a better cartridge than the .380 ACP?
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Old September 28, 2012, 08:29 PM   #79
Deaf Smith
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how lethal is the .380 acp round?
Why does everyone down it so much is it really that bad?
A 2.7mm Kobri is 'lethal' but it as virtually no stopping power.

The mission of a defensive handgun is to STOP an attack, if possible instantly.

The .380 is not real high in that category. Better than lessor rounds but there most certainly are much better rounds for defensive use.

I have a few .380s, one even used by my wife (as well as a .32 that is used by my wife) but I prefer rounds with a better record of 'stopping power'.

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Old September 28, 2012, 08:58 PM   #80
Seaman
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Ahoy ScottRiqui,

"...but not something that couldn't have also happened with a slightly larger bullet."

The reason for my conjecture is due to increased velocity (300 fps) of a somewhat larger bullet (about 25%) which should cause greater turbulence and wound damage.

Of the crime scenes I am aware of where a victim used a 380 vs a larger caliber, the larger caliber always stopped the good guy. Not a scientific survey, just an interesting observation.

"Also, what makes the .32 ACP a better cartridge than the .380 ACP? "

For most shooters it means better accuracy due to less recoil, faster follow-up shots, and in my tests with various media, the 32 ACP cut slightly deeper.

In fact, fixed barrel 380 pistols are snappier than several of today's new 9mm para pistols...ie the Walther PPS.

The 380 is a marginal cartridge and takes great skill if used against a capable determined assailant.
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Old September 28, 2012, 09:02 PM   #81
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Seaman wrote: How about the Mississippi woman who was shot thru the brain with a 380 (thru & thru), survived, and then made tea for the investigating officer.

If the same shot had been made with a 9mm para bullet, which is heavier and travels significantly faster, it is likely that the victim would be immediately (and permanently) stopped.

Have carried the Sig P238, ankle BUG, but prefer the PPK in 32 ACP for that role. Better cartridge.

Carry a 9mm, 40 cal, 44 spl or 45, and survival chances improve.
So please explain Rep. Gabby Giffords please:

A human can be an extremely tough object to stop.
Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement. Caliber is secondary when it comes to hand guns.
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Old September 28, 2012, 10:22 PM   #82
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There is no doubt that a more powerful round is better but Shot placement is still what is going to determine how fast the target goes down. If shot placement is the same the target will most likely go down faster if hit with the more powerful round. I know a cop that shot a BG 4 times with a .45, 185 HP rounds, didn't knok him down, the guy turned and walked across the street and fell. Still alive to this day. None of the rounds hit him in the head, neck, or backbone.
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Old September 29, 2012, 01:32 AM   #83
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How about the Mississippi woman who was shot thru the brain with a 380 (thru & thru), survived, and then made tea for the investigating officer.

If the same shot had been made with a 9mm para bullet, which is heavier and travels significantly faster, it is likely that the victim would be immediately (and permanently) stopped.
The bullet went thru her brain in a very lucky path that did not hit the lobes. the 9mm is the same dia. as the 380 and would have had the exact same outcome. It being faster and heavier would not have made a difference. the dia. is what mattered in that shot.
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Old September 29, 2012, 01:45 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by Seaman View Post
How about the Mississippi woman who was shot thru the brain with a 380 (thru & thru), survived, and then made tea for the investigating officer.

If the same shot had been made with a 9mm para bullet, which is heavier and travels significantly faster, it is likely that the victim would be immediately (and permanently) stopped.

Have carried the Sig P238, ankle BUG, but prefer the PPK in 32 ACP for that role. Better cartridge.

Carry a 9mm, 40 cal, 44 spl or 45, and survival chances improve.
Phineas Gage took a gunpowder-propelled railroad spike to the brain and lived. Flukes happen. The vast majority of folks shot in the head or heart aren't getting up, .380 or .45 ACP.

I made a neat hand-sized group with my LCP at ~20 yards today. Shot placement. I can put those rounds where I need them, quickly, and while one .380 round is marginal, seven of them delivered rapidly center mass will do the trick enough for me to get the heck out of there and call 911
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Old October 10, 2012, 02:11 PM   #85
Beagle45ACP
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Lethal enough for me to carry one with confidence.

Lethal enough that I would prefer to not be shot with one.
Even though I haven't gotten my CCW yet, once I do, I'll be looking into a .380 because of this line of thought right here.
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Old October 10, 2012, 06:05 PM   #86
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I'd argue you can't really rely on any handgun below .44 Mag to do that reliably.

I agree, but I would delete all after "handgun" and before "to."
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