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Old September 25, 2012, 08:38 AM   #1
supermick83
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Cz 527 in 223 bolt problem

Hey guys I've got a 527 for almost a year and I've just noticed when I push a new round up onto the bolt the swivel bracket on the bolt gets pushed out ever so slightly and I think It is effecting the closing of the bolt leaving it quite stiff. It hasn't ever effected the accuracy of the rifle but I was just wondering could I shave the slightest bit off the bracket so when the bullet is fed it won't push this out? has anyone any experience with this? Thanks
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Old September 25, 2012, 08:48 AM   #2
geetarman
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I am not sure what you mean by "swivel" bracket.

Are you talking about the extracter?

Are you shooting reloads or factory loads?

Got a picture of the condition you are describing?

Factory loads should feed just fine and if the bolt is stiff, it may not be fully worked in yet.

Is the bolt stiff to close with no round loaded?

I have some bolt rifles that I have had for thirty years and the bolt is still a very snug fit.

One thing you can try is remove the bolt and work in some white lithium grease.

Reinstall the bolt work open and close it. . .a lot. That should smooth things up.

I don't know how your rifle is set up but rifles like my old Remington 700 does not chamber rounds that are just layed in the breech. To feed, the rounds must be pushed down into the magazine.

My newer 700P does not have that issue at all. Depends on the rifle.

If this issue has just started, I would suspect faulty sized reloads or lack of lubrication.

I have not checked but I suspect your rifle is a controlled feed as opposed to push feed.

In a push feed system, the round can be placed in the breech and the bolt will load the round and the extracter will engage the rim upon loading.

A controlled feed system will allow the magazine follower to push the round up into the extracters before the round is loaded and will keep the round in close contact with the bolt face until the round is fired.

You will have a problem trying to load a round in a controlled feed system unless you first push the round down into the magazine well.

YMMV
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Last edited by geetarman; September 25, 2012 at 09:02 AM.
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Old September 25, 2012, 09:02 AM   #3
supermick83
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ye I've attached pics. No not hard to close when empty, They're factory rounds and ye I do mean extractor I couldn't think of the name of it!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg bolt1.jpg (48.6 KB, 53 views)
File Type: jpg bolt2.jpg (62.4 KB, 40 views)
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Old September 25, 2012, 09:06 AM   #4
supermick83
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no there's no problem just putting round in without the clip in and the bolt slides by gravity up to lock position so its not friction its just that extrctor that swells out when i'm loading it
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Old September 25, 2012, 09:06 AM   #5
geetarman
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I have to run off to the dentist. . .fun. . .fun. . .fun.

I added some prose to my missive.

Try greasing up the bolt and make sure the round is pushed down into the magazine well before you try to load it. . .and take care when you do that.

I will check back after I recover from the pain
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Old September 25, 2012, 09:09 AM   #6
supermick83
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Enjoy the dentist thanks
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Old September 25, 2012, 10:31 AM   #7
Malamute
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I think its just tight. The extractor is a strong spring, eesistance when closig hte bolt isnt anything to be alarmed about, though it sound slike its only giving resistance when it has a round in it. The extractor may be a slight bit long in the rim groove of the cartridge. My 98 actions dont move the extractor noticably when loaded compared to not, but if yours works, it probably wont cause a problem. It could be fitted a little, but I'd likely leave it alone.


Quote:
....You will have a problem trying to load a round in a controlled feed system unless you first push the round down into the magazine well

There shouldnt be any problem dropping a round in the chamber in a Mauser action, unless its a military action that hasnt been modified. The "controlled feed" doesnt by nature preclude the extractor being able to snap over a cartridge rim, the military guns just weren't done that way. There's no real reason they shouldn't work when properly set up. The front edge of the extractor can be beveled to allow this, all the commercial sporter Mausers I've seen are done this way as are virtually all the commercial actions based on Mausers, and the 1903 Springfield, and it was common for sporter conversions of miltary actions.
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Old September 25, 2012, 03:19 PM   #8
supermick83
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sound guys thanks a mil sure if its nothin to worry about then I wont bother touchin it!
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Old September 26, 2012, 02:24 AM   #9
Sweet Shooter
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Quote:
There shouldnt be any problem dropping a round in the chamber in a Mauser action, unless its a military action that hasnt been modified. The "controlled feed" doesnt by nature preclude the extractor being able to snap over a cartridge rim, the military guns just weren't done that way.
Wrong. It is tight because it is not meant to be loaded like that.

It will eventually break the extractor. Modify all you want but if you shave a bit off it you are reducing it's effectiveness... it's an extractor and needs that purchase. If you want to single feed that's fine... just click it into the mag and let the bolt do what it is supposed to do... control the round being fed. The bolt face on a CRF is minus the walls purely for this reason. It's a beautiful thing to watch.
-SS-
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Old September 26, 2012, 09:02 AM   #10
Malamute
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I'm curious where you get this information. The bevel doesn't change the extractors ability to do its job extracting in any way I can tell. If it will cause the extractor to break, I doubt Springfield would have done the 1903's that way, or Ruger, or any of the other makers, including all the commercial Mausers made that I've seen. The extractor on all of those are functionally identical to the military Mausers, only they have a bevel on the front edge to allow the extractor to snap over a cartridge rim. So far I haven't heard of any rash of broken extractors in any of those guns.


Quote:
Wrong. It is tight because it is not meant to be loaded like that.

What does this mean? The OP said he noticed it being "tight' when he chambered a round with the magazine in, and it wasnt tight when it wasn't loaded from the magazine. It sounds like it's less tight if he simply drops a round in rather than feeding it from the magazine, the opposite of what you have said is the only right way.
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Last edited by Malamute; September 26, 2012 at 09:09 AM.
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Old September 26, 2012, 10:31 AM   #11
supermick83
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Sorry guys no its tight no matter what way I load it and I brought it out today and took few shots off and it pulled shell out of the barrell but didn't throw it out even though it normally would. I haven't touched it as the problem I am havin didn't effect the shooting but now two things... Any thoughts?
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Old September 26, 2012, 10:46 AM   #12
Sweet Shooter
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That's odd.

If you have been single-feeding the rounds and allowing the extractor to snap over the case rim, that extractor may have already taken a "set"... which is why it would appear tight in the bolt raceway—perhaps. I single round feed mine all the time but I always click the shell into the mag and allow the bolt to pick it up.

The 527 has a very stable ejector design that relies on inertia of the rearward moving bolt. You do need to operate the bolt in a positive manner because the ejector just sits and waits for the bolt to drag the spent case back... try it more briskly. I have found the same with the pickup of the cartridge... that you need to operate the bolt firmly. If this is difficult make sure you run some good quality grease in bolt raceway both sides. CZ bolts can be prone to bind a little if they are pushed into battery off axis... when dry. Also make sure you have grease behind the lug under the extractor that area often gets neglected because it's not in sight most of the time.

Try some good grease, and be deliberate about cycling the bolt... maybe get some snap caps to practice this?

Edit... and actually I re-examined the photos and I can see that the extractor has taken a set I think... see image... there should be no gap here.

-SS-
Attached Images
File Type: png CZBolt.png (88.9 KB, 16 views)

Last edited by Sweet Shooter; September 26, 2012 at 11:20 AM.
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Old September 26, 2012, 01:25 PM   #13
supermick83
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I took the bolt stop off there because I noticed the ejector looked a bit loose and found the spring in the bolt stop had snapped so that solves the ejector problem I'll just have to tip the gun to the right when i'm ejecting now til I get a replacement spring... Live in ireland so it's a hard job to get any little gun bits like that!Thanks for taking a look at the photo I'll fix that tomorrow always somethin
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Old September 26, 2012, 01:32 PM   #14
Rimfire5
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The ejecton of a round from the CZ 527 bolt requires that the bolt is pulled all the way back to the stop to eject the cartridge.

That is the "extra added feature" that comes with a Control Feed bolt. The cartridge remains frimly seated in the extractor until the bolt reaches the rear of its travel.

I won't tell you the number of times that friends who shoot my CZ have wound up with a cartridge still hanging in the bolt because they don't complete the bolt cycle.

Pulling the bolt all the way pops the cartridge out smartly.

I don't notice a particularly stiff closure when chambering a round from the magazine with my CZ 527 .223. It does take a bit more effort with a round in the chamber but that is normal with every rifle caliber that I shoot.
It is the same with my CZ 550 .30-06.
Of my multiple rifles, only the two CZs have a full control feed mechanism and they both eject only when the bolt is completely cycled. You can't short cycle a CZ action.

As for added effort in closing the bolt with a cartridge being loaded, my Remington 700 seems to add the most effort with a cartridge being loaded. My Winchester Model 70 is incredibly smooth with or without a cartridge.
My Savage .308 takes effort somewhere in between.
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