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Old September 24, 2012, 04:11 PM   #26
lee n. field
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What's the smallest/lightest handgun (any caliber) that you shoot well?
I suspect most people shoot more accurately with guns that have a little heft, longer barrels, and hand-filling grips. And therefore, they probably shoot worse with tiny pocket guns. I'm interested in guns that provide a good compromise between "shootability" and portability.

Which smaller sized handguns perform best for you at the range?
So far, Kel Tec PF9.

Smaller than that, we shall see. I haven't done much with guns smaller than the PF9 yet.

"Shootability" between the PF9 and the micro-380 class guns may hinge on the difference between the two finger vs. one finger grip. Two finger grip is not a problem for me.
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Old September 25, 2012, 07:51 AM   #27
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Believe it or not,,,

This little 22-PLY from Taurus,,,
Is very easy to shoot accurately.

It has a natural point-ability that is somewhat amazing to me,,,
I can consistently hit a 8" circle at 25 yards with this gun.

It fits my J-frame & K-frame size hands very nicely.


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Old September 25, 2012, 08:27 AM   #28
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Another Sig P238 380 auto fan
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Old September 25, 2012, 12:54 PM   #29
Bob Wright
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I shoot the NAA .22 Short revolvers fairly well, except the barrel/cylinder gap burns my thumb.

I have found that some degree of accuracy is obtained by holding the grips between the thumb and forefinger of the shooting hand, and pressing the trigger with the forefinger of the other hand, coming up from below the pistol. A fair amount of accuracy is possible clear out to three or four feet.

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Old September 25, 2012, 02:11 PM   #30
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The smallest/lightest I shoot well would probably be my S&W442.
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Old September 25, 2012, 02:46 PM   #31
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+1 for the Sig P238. I had one for a while until my wife shot it. I bought a better model for her with night sights and finally got mine back. With proper technique it is surprisingly accurate.
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Old September 25, 2012, 08:04 PM   #32
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I shoot my Kahr PM9 the best of all my handguns.
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Old September 26, 2012, 10:53 PM   #33
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Kel-Tec P11

The smallest pistol I can shoot well (that I have tried) is a Kel-Tec P11, which is a 9mm that weighs 14 oz. empty and holds 10 rounds in a double-stack magazine. I have a pinky extension on the magazine, and feel this is essential to shooting it well.

This gun is easy to carry and conceal in a Fobus paddle holster. I also have a couple of pocket holsters for it. It will easily fit in a jacket pocket, or even in the front pocket of a looser fitting pair of jeans or in the back pocket of a pair of carpenter jeans, like a wallet, using a pocket holster.

These guns can be had for about $300. Some people hate the long trigger pull on this gun, but I think of it as the automatic safety feature. I don't want any manual safeties on any defensive gun. Some people have had trouble with it jamming, but I polished the feed ramp on mine to a mirror finish and it is 100 percent reliable with Remington Golden Sabre 124gr.

Some people will dish Kel-Tecs, but I feel this particular model is a good gun, but could sometimes use a little tuning. The KTOG forum is a great place for support, and Kel-Tec is well known for great warranty service.

For a long time it used to be smallest and lightest 9mm made, but now others have copied it, and perhaps done a slightly better job. I have not shot any of the new crop of very small 9mm's.

I think of this gun as a mini-Glock. It is very similar. Glock does not make a gun this light and small.
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Old September 27, 2012, 01:34 PM   #34
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It varies, of course.

Originally Posted by Idek
I suspect most people shoot more accurately with guns that have a little heft, longer barrels, and hand-filling grips. And therefore, they probably shoot worse with tiny pocket guns. I'm interested in guns that provide a good compromise between "shootability" and portability.

Which smaller sized handguns perform best for you at the range?
Idek, I'm passing certain you are correct. I shot both NRA Bullseye and PPC competition for a number of years. While I was never a threat to those who were champions, I did watch them and see their guns. None of them shot tiny gripped guns with ultra short barrels. Not a blessed one. Of course, large grips and long barrels don't contribute to a concealed self-defense gun. But then, self-defense guns have a different requisite level of accuracy.

I collect .32 ACP pistols of the 'Art Deco' period. I shoot them a bit just to see how they work and determine their accuracy levels - at least in my hands.

Just because I fell into it, I also have a Beretta 418 (I think, the model numbers are somewhat vague at times) in .25 ACP and made for vest pocket carry. The Beretta 418 has a 'two finger' grip. My middle and ring finger fit the grip, that's all. (See attached photo.) In spite of that, if I have good light and can find the sights, I can put all the shots on a regular piece of typing paper at 7 yards. (Two handed, slow fire; testing the gun itself.) (See attached photo.)

The pride of my .32 collection is a nicely preserved 1935 Beretta. With the 'pinky spur' on the magazine, I can get all of my short pudgy fingers on the grip. (See attached photo.) This is another pistol limited by the small, fixed sights (more limited by the 'small' than the 'fixed') and a 'Michael Moore' trigger (too heavy and much creep), but at twenty-five yards will hold shots in the head of an NRA B27 target.

I also have several short barreled revolvers. One in particular is a Smith & Wesson five screw, Military & Police (later Model 10) in 2 inch barrel form. It has a full grip, but only a 'snubby' barrel. With standard .38 Special ammo (158 grain RNL bullet at 750-800 f/s) it will stay on a B27 target at 50 yards as long as I pay attention.

In short, 'small' guns will shoot about as well as the shooter will allow. However, I must confess I feel much more comfortable with a full sized belt gun. They are easier to control, especially in a hurry.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Beretta 418 two finger grip.JPG (160.7 KB, 26 views)
File Type: jpg Beretta 418 7 yd shot group deliberate.jpg (225.3 KB, 21 views)
File Type: jpg Beretta 1935 three finger grip.JPG (163.4 KB, 23 views)
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Old September 27, 2012, 02:01 PM   #35
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The smallest handgun I target shoot with is a Glock 27. If a person was stupid enough to stand still and let me shoot at them, I'd hit them 25 yards away.

The smallest handgun I've shot is a KelTec P3AT which is a .380 pocket pistol. It worked just fine at five yards. i didn't try to get any further away than that. It didn't seem to be intended for use much beyond that.
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:16 PM   #36
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I shoot my sig p238 pretty well. Im not saying ill ever do competitive shooting with it but I can hit the target at any realistic pistol range.
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Old September 28, 2012, 05:32 PM   #37
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Beretta Tomcat 3032 in 7.65 mm Browning.

In Single-Action mode, it is ~4 lbs. A little stacking but not bad.

For such a small pistol, I can keep it on target easily. I love 'cocked and locked', even on the mouse pistols.
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Old September 28, 2012, 06:06 PM   #38
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380 Walther PPk
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Old September 28, 2012, 09:48 PM   #39
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Please define shoot well for me LOL. If we are talking about center mass hits at 3 to 5 yards then just about anything will get the job done but if we are talking consistent center mass hits at 15 yards that is a whole different ball game.

For me the CW9 is a great balance. I do not pocket carry so I do not need the smaller CM9/PM9. I can get a full grip on the CW9 and it completely disappears in a IWB holster under a T-Shirt and I do not notice the weight at all.

I can get consistent groups of under 3" at 15 yards so for me it meets all of my needs for a carry gun role. I know that I can draw and fire with enough accuracy to score meaningful hits at self defense ranges which is the guns intended purpose.

That said it does not compare to the accuracy of my Govt 1911 or BHP.
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Old September 28, 2012, 10:09 PM   #40
Bill DeShivs
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My first handgun was a "4 Aces" derringer, then a "Little Ace," then I moved up to a lightweight Browning .25. I guess I learned the hard way, but I was able to shoot them accurately enough to be very confident in carrying them. Some years later I got a .22 short NAA mini revolver and carried it for many years. One of the most accurate guns I ever owned was a Beretta Minx M4 (the longer 3-1/2" bbl. version.) I used to hustle people with their brand new custom-built, bull bbl. target .38s. I would challenge them to a match, shooting at a cardboard 50 rd. .22lr box hung from the target carrier at 25 yards. The most hits out of 5 won. I made a lot of people very mad.
I have collected and shot pocket guns for a long time. One thing I learned was most of them are very accurate, but hard for most people to shoot.
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Old September 29, 2012, 06:01 AM   #41
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I have had two keltec 380s, and both were accurate out to 15 yards. I had a Kahr PM9 and, while I very much appreciate Kahrs, the little keltec easily out shot it in my hands.
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Old September 29, 2012, 08:18 AM   #42
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I had a Beretta 950 in .22 short that I always shot very well. I bought it sort of on a whim because it was pretty, but it wound up having a very nice trigger.
After I got my .380 I didn't really have a purpose for it though, so I sold it.
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Old September 29, 2012, 08:37 AM   #43
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I cheat at target practice, and I am good with my LCR, LCP, P3AT,SOLO CDG, they all have CT lasers.
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Old September 29, 2012, 01:21 PM   #44
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+1 on the Seecamp. Off hand at 15 feet all rounds into an area slightly larger then a playing card. In fact last I shot it we were teaching a female civilian "citizens academy" class and on the line I pulled the Seecamp and put all the rounds into the target as noted above. The gal on the line with me at the station asked to take the target home to show her hubby. I think she planned to say she shot it....

Can do as well with my old Iver Johnson TP .22 just a fantastic little pistol. In fact doing tin can shooting at 25 yards ia not a problem atall.

Last edited by Sulaco2; September 29, 2012 at 01:27 PM.
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Old September 29, 2012, 01:23 PM   #45
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LCP... Amazingly accurate shooter for its size.
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Old September 29, 2012, 07:29 PM   #46
Shadi Khalil
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Originally Posted by redhawk45 View Post
Smith and Wesson 637 or Kahr CM9 equally well, especially under 30 feet.
I agree except I got rid of my Kahr's and still have the 637. Despite that, the Kahr's are excellent choices for a small semi auto.
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Old September 29, 2012, 11:12 PM   #47
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Colt Mustang .380 ACP. Much more accurate than I expected for a small gun.
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Old September 29, 2012, 11:26 PM   #48
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I've seen a few people mention the Kel Tek P11 so......

A long time ago in a marriage not so far away. I had a Grendel P-10, amusingly it was a fairly decent shooter. Kept about 1.5" at 10 yards, just a horrible pistol to load. I let the ex keep it.
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Old September 30, 2012, 02:27 AM   #49
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+1 on the Sig P238. Very accurate for me and a lot of fun to shoot.
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Old September 30, 2012, 07:09 AM   #50
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LCP... Amazingly accurate shooter for its size.
Agreed. I can reliably get really tight groups at 5-7 yards, but it falls off after that.
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