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Old September 27, 2012, 10:05 AM   #1
LantanaTX
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Ready to order a Caracal F, Should I be stopped?

Hello,

I am new on here. I have SCCY CPX-2 which has been great and reliable. I am now looking for a full size 9mm. After reading and watching a ton of revews, The Caracal seems like a fantastic gun regardless of price, but it is $100 cheaper than a Glock. I was suprised to see that people who owned Glocks and then bought a Caracal, perfer the Caracal. Is there a better gun for the money out there? I keep hearing about the great trigger and softest 9mm they have shot. Many describe the accuracy as a tack driver. About to place an order and thought I would give you guys the opportunity to try to stop me. I don't care about being made in UAE. They are our ally. If I proceed, I will probably call it my Camel Jockey Glocky.
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:13 AM   #2
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It looks interesting. I saw a video on YouTube with a guy shooting 1000 rounds through one with a jam.
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:14 AM   #3
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The only reasons I haven't ordered one yet:

1. Lack of aftermarket support, though that will likely change
2. No real track record yet, though it has passed many hard tests
3. No posted experiences of folks dealing with Caracal USA service
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:20 AM   #4
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Seems like lack of track record is here in the US since it has only been here since the begining of the year. It been produced since 2007 and the testing it went through by the Germans is impressive. I saw that a trigger kit is now available which takes it down to about 3.5 pound pull. I was impressed by the guy on you tube that did a long term test. Over 10,000 rounds and never cleaned. He highly reccomended it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdHuzWJaryo
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:39 AM   #5
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I'm not saying don't buy it, but perhaps look into: can you find a replacement recoil spring for it? Will they sell you one? Or perhaps is the spring of a different gun compatible with it?

That's the main issue with import guns if they have to go through another company to import.

For example, I bought an EAA EZ9, but EAA changed their lineup and no longer imports or offers spare parts. Now KVAR imports them but no one has been able to get a spare part from them that I know of.
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:39 AM   #6
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Nope - get it. Prices are still low. I have had mine for over 8 months now. It's flawless and I was inherently accurate with it right off the bat. No getting used to it at all. GREAT PISTOL!
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:45 AM   #7
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Quote:
I saw that a trigger kit is now available which takes it down to about 3.5 pound pull.
I was talking more about aftermarket sights and holster options as well as ease of acquiring mags.

Personally I could care less about turning a trigger into 3.5 lb. I shoot DA/SA normally. The idea that a 5.5 lb trigger is somehow an obstacle to accuracy is amusing to me. Not directed at you personally.

Quote:
I was impressed by the guy on you tube that did a long term test. Over 10,000 rounds and never cleaned. He highly reccomended it.
A sample size of one is a poor statistic . I've seen individual Glocks with tens of thousands of rounds through them with no issues, and seen new Glocks the choke out of the box.

When I say track record I mean one thing Glock has going for it is that thousands of people are using them daily. That's a good test of a design. Now I think the Caracal is an awesome design and I think it will prove itself over time. But I have no desire to be a beta tester of sorts.

As always, YMMV.
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Old September 27, 2012, 11:25 AM   #8
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Woundn't the German Military have shot more than one too? I understand there requirements are pretty tough and include more than 10,000 rounds, dirt, sand, water etc. Gun is also NATO certified. For a new pistol, is seems to have very good credentials so far. I am not interested in the trigger mod, just pointing out that things are becoming available. I know holsters are available but I would not carry this gun. I use the little sub capact 9 for that. The Caracal would be for home, car and at the range. I am not interested in much aftermarket. Just would like to know more about the customer service here in the USA. That is hard to get a handle on since no one seems to have had an issue and reported it online.
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Old September 27, 2012, 11:46 AM   #9
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Guess it's the cowboy in me that would rather explore the West myself instead of waiting in my NY apartment for other folk to do it. No offense to those who prefer the wait, it's just that life is too short for me to wait for other people to try out and create track records on new pistols.

I've been shooting the Caracal for two years now since they first snuck into the States. Currently my favorite striker fired pistol.

You can still get an original WW marked QS F pistol at Compact Firearms if you want to spend a little more for the rarity.
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Old September 27, 2012, 12:20 PM   #10
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So from your posts so far all you've done is laud it with praise, which is cool you like it . But if that's the case why make this thread? Sounds to me like you've made up your mind already, so just order it.
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Old September 27, 2012, 12:24 PM   #11
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Guess it's the cowboy in me that would rather explore the West myself instead of waiting in my NY apartment for other folk to do it.
Indeed, trying new products makes you a regular Lewis and Clark team member.

I like trying new products too, , but I don't buy the first year of a car model and I wouldn't jump on the Caracal bandwagon yet. Again, as I have already stated, I think they will be fine pistols. But personally I'd like to see how the company develops in the US before I hand over my money.
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Old September 27, 2012, 12:37 PM   #12
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The Caracal has been around quite awhile - it's not a "beta" pistol. It's entry into the U.S of A has been delayed but it has been tested extensively in other parts of the planet. It's been out, as stated, since 2007.

I have two Glocks and a Smith M&P. I think the Caracal is better than either of them. It fits my hand better than my G19 and the trigger is much better than the stock trigger on my Smith. I shoot better with it than my Glock and a little better than my Smith.

For the price - which was less than a G19 - it was a no brainer for me.

As far as there is no information as to how good the service is for Caracal...well I haven't heard of any having any issues yet save for one rather useless video on the subject where someone had issues but went into no details as to the why of it... Hard to judge service if there hasn't been a need for it.
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Old September 27, 2012, 12:42 PM   #13
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Is there a better gun for the money out there?
In my opinion---no.

I really have nothing but good things to say about my Caracals. Once I get night sights for them they'll likely become my defensive guns.

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Old September 27, 2012, 12:57 PM   #14
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Thanks for the feedback everyone. I am probably going to go ahead and order one from Centerfire Systems. I tried to find failures and one guy had failire to eject after a detail strip. In the video he hated the gun and drops it on the ground. I then found a follow up video where he admits to installing the ejector spring wrong.

I agee with Spodwo in that this is not a new pistol... just new to Americans. After researching all I could, it seemed almost too good to be true, so thought I would ask for more feedback here, just to make sure I wasn't making a mistake. Seem like an incredible deal. Usually when you pay less you get less quality. Doesn't seem the case here. looks like paying less gets me a superior pistol. How often does that ever happen?? I am sold. The onlly thing I worry about is getting the F or the C. I thought the F might be a little less recoil and a little more accurate than the C, but the C may fit my hand better. Has anyone handled and shot each of them?
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Old September 27, 2012, 01:03 PM   #15
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I have a F model with about 1k thru it now. Been perfect and a very smooth trigger. I use mine for a range gun and a bedside gun. I think they are just as good as any of my XD variants or Glock.
There are quite a few types of kydex and other holsters out for them now and different type sights are on the way also.

I got mine off slickguns for $399 shipped ... I think they were $412 last time I checked. ... googling caracal F sale brings up a few different places to buy from.
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Old September 27, 2012, 01:05 PM   #16
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Hard to judge service if there hasn't been a need for it.
This is true. But there is always the lemon, no matter how good the original design. I'd be happier if I had a story of someone getting a lemon, going to Caracal, and having them replace it for them than there being no story at all.

For those of you saying it's been out since 2007, I'm aware of this too. But what major country uses this as a service pistol? What European police department uses it? From what I can tell its only users are OPEC members that aren't exactly using them heavily (they don't need to).

To me that is a weakness at the moment. Of course this is true of all new pistols too. But Caracal is also a relatively new company and we don't have previous models to judge them on as with other manufacturers. Either way I think it will be very interesting to see what happens with it.
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Old September 27, 2012, 01:39 PM   #17
LantanaTX
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Tunnell Rat, Appreciate very much where you are coming from which is good sound advice. However if if everyone thought that way, Glock would still be looking for their first customer. I guess it is good that some are willing to take informed risks and be early adotpters so that the careful buyers can benefit from their feedback. If Caracal is as good as many think, I want in on this while the price is still cheap. I read that Caracal is also now producing this gun in Germany.
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Old September 27, 2012, 01:55 PM   #18
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However if if everyone thought that way, Glock would still be looking for their first customer.
This is true. I'll be the first to admit I'm not a first adopter, I leave that to others.

Quote:
If Caracal is as good as many think, I want in on this while the price is still cheap.
If Caracal is smart they will keep the price where it is. They'll have a hard time getting new adopters if they price it too high. Keeping the price lower further encourages others to take the risk. I would be surprised if the price jumped any time soon.
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Old September 27, 2012, 02:03 PM   #19
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The onlly thing I worry about is getting the F or the C. I thought the F might be a little less recoil and a little more accurate than the C, but the C may fit my hand better. Has anyone handled and shot each of them?
My F & C Review Video Link

Your thoughts are generally correct but we're splitting hairs here---both are accurate and soft shooting guns.

The review above was the 2nd ever that I shot so it sucks but it will give you a good idea of how both guns handle and compare to each other as I shoot them one after another (and chronograph one after another). I really like them a lot more than when I made that video as I was still getting used to them really. I'll be redoing the review of each one of these days in HD and a better format but that's how you learn I suppose....
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Old September 27, 2012, 02:53 PM   #20
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Thanks Plouffedaddy, I actually watched that video a couple of times. It was a good video and one of the few that showed both being fired. Is there much of a difference in felt recoil and accuracy? Much difference in how they fit the hand? I would probably prefer the C if it is only a slight difference.
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Old September 27, 2012, 04:10 PM   #21
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Is there much of a difference in felt recoil and accuracy? Felt recoil---slight. Accuracy---none that I can perceive. Much difference in how they fit the hand? Yes, they feel different. Very analogous to the G17/G19 if you've ever held them. I would probably prefer the C if it is only a slight difference.
At least 30 different people (probably more but I don't count ) have fired my Caracals now---most say the C feels better. I personally prefer the F for range use or duty use but I'm relatively large and have large hands (XL gloves).
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Old September 27, 2012, 04:16 PM   #22
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I'd mention something about the country of origin, but we all enjoy our AK's so that point is moot.
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Old September 27, 2012, 04:53 PM   #23
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Probably the same place you get your oil/gasoline from. The region of origin in not my favorite but at least it is from a country that we have good relations with. I am not going to let that keep me from having a great product as long as they are on our side.
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:14 PM   #24
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Careful we don't verge into the politics arena.

Do I consider the UAE a true ally? Not really, they know we'll protect them and the rest of OPEC, for good reasons. Money is a good motivator.

That said, do I care that the Caracal is made there? No, I don't. I own a number of HKs. Last I checked the US of A and Germany have had a few disagreements over the last century. Some of them got even downright mean. Yet here I am owning a German gun. Does that make me a traitor? I don't think so, though others might disagree. Simple fact is we move on. Some people can claim that this is wrong, but it's been happening a long time. Our history is filled with fighting wars against people who we later on end up fighting wars with. This is no different. Last I looked the AK market is doing very well, and I don't hear a ton of people crying foul there.

My number one quantifier for a gun: does it function well and reliably? Origin is far down the list.
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:33 PM   #25
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Quote:
I saw that a trigger kit is now available which takes it down to about 3.5 pound pull.
I'd suggest shooting the thing first. The default trigger pull is very smooth, and it feels lighter than that Austrian gun folks are so fond of.

Quote:
Keeping the price lower further encourages others to take the risk.
It cuts both ways. Sometimes, a low price makes consumers think a product is substandard in quality. I once spoke with a guy from Eagle Imports (importers for Bersa), and he agreed that they might see more traction if they raised prices by $100.
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