The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 21, 2012, 07:21 PM   #26
Edward429451
Junior member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2000
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 9,494
It can't happen here is a shortsighted view nowadays. The flip of this is the guys (& gals!) who know it can happen and carry at all times, even around the house. Count me in that camp. Being armed when you answer the door gives you the best chance for survival if it's trouble knocking on the door. Plus, it makes it real convenient to get in a few minutes of presentations here and there. At home is a good place to build muscle memory.
Edward429451 is offline  
Old September 21, 2012, 10:08 PM   #27
JohnKSa
Staff
 
Join Date: February 12, 2001
Location: DFW Area
Posts: 18,332
I've commented before that it's actually amusing to hear people being interviewed after some sort of crime takes place because they all say the same things:

I couldn't believe it was happening.
I never thought it would happen here.
I never thought it could happen to me.
It took me awhile to realize it was actually happening.
etc.

People go through their lives expecting NOTHING to happen and, as a result, they're always surprised when something does happen.

You don't have to go through your life always expecting that something's going to happen to you, but you should at least always be open to the idea that something COULD happen so you won't be caught flat-footed, telling yourself that: "I can't believe this is really happening." instead of doing the things you need to do to survive.
__________________
Did you know that there is a TEXAS State Rifle Association?
JohnKSa is offline  
Old September 21, 2012, 10:48 PM   #28
Vermonter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 17, 2010
Posts: 954
john

Couldn't agree more
Vermonter is offline  
Old September 22, 2012, 08:35 AM   #29
Single Six
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 31, 2010
Location: N.C.
Posts: 1,522
I had never even heard of that small town in Texas....until the infamous Luby's massacre. Same goes for Littleton, Colorado. Right up until the shooting started, many folks who live in those places were probably of a similar mindset.
__________________
Seen on a bumper sticker: "Exercise. Eat right. Take vitamins. Die anyway."
Single Six is offline  
Old September 22, 2012, 10:29 AM   #30
45Gunner
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 8, 2009
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Posts: 1,728
I've posted this several years ago so in this thread I will give you the Reader's Digest Version:

I lived in a high rise Condo. You need to get through a guard to get through a gate and then need to get through a second guard to gain access to the building. I was alone in my Condo when I heard the door open, knowing there was no scheduled maintenance, I went to investigate. I was met by three armed individuals. They shot me, left me for dead, and cleaned out nearly $200,000 worth of art and other valuables.

It couldn't happen here because of the security around and in the building? Obviously I was wrong. I moved from the Condo after my recovery and into a gated community. However, I have a state of the art security system, a four legged early warning system, and always carry a firearm on my person or right next to where I am sitting or sleeping. I no longer have thoughts of it couldn't happen here and hopefully have planned for every contingency by playing the "what if" game from every area of the house, every window, and every door.
__________________
45Gunner
May the Schwartz Be With You.
NRA Instructor
NRA Life Member

Last edited by 45Gunner; September 22, 2012 at 10:31 AM. Reason: spelling
45Gunner is offline  
Old September 22, 2012, 02:21 PM   #31
Chuckusaret
Junior member
 
Join Date: December 5, 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 708
I live in SE Florida and it did happen very often until the Castle Law was approved. There has been a dramatic reduction since this law was adopted and home owners began shooting the bad guys.
Chuckusaret is offline  
Old September 23, 2012, 07:10 PM   #32
Vermonter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 17, 2010
Posts: 954
45 Gunner

Glad you lived to tell the tale. Stories like yours inspire me to stay alert and persue my personal security.
Vermonter is offline  
Old September 24, 2012, 10:44 AM   #33
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague County, Texas
Posts: 10,425
Funny thing about events "not happening here." For many people in many communities all over the US, it never happens there. This doesn't make the mindset correct, but only notes that the mindset is fully supported with long term support for many people in many communities/locations.

It is a funny thing that we are vigilant because we know it can and does happen, even if it hasn't happened to us...and we have the stats to back up our assertions. At the same time, the naysayers have have the stats to back up their assertions as well. Even if it does happen in their community, it still may be wholly unlikely to happen to them...statistically speaking.

On the down side, those living in remote areas where "it will never happen" may feel confident that it won't and it certainly may not, but if it does, help isn't likely to just be minutes away (which is already too long), but 10s of minutes away.
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher."
-- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old September 24, 2012, 02:13 PM   #34
Vermonter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 17, 2010
Posts: 954
DNS

Quote:
but if it does, help isn't likely to just be minutes away (which is already too long), but 10s of minutes away
This is the reason for my intrest in such topics. We are further from society than one would think on many levels.

Regards, Vermonter
Vermonter is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 12:02 AM   #35
shortwave
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 17, 2007
Location: SOUTHEAST, OHIO
Posts: 5,936
Quote:
We are further from society than one would think on many levels.
Sometimes even in the inner city.

Used to live in rather rough area in south Cols.,Ohio that,due to budget constraints, had 6 LEO's assigned per shift in that precinct. Precinct was fairly large.
Worked with and knew all of them and they were goods cops. But when things got jumpin on a good Friday or Sat. night, response time could be very long. Very long like, you better handle business on your own if you have to and let LEO handle the paperwork when they arrived.

Now, thankfully, I live in the country and don't have to listen to sirens and gunshots 24/7 but would probably still have to take care of business cause response time would most likely be around 20-30mins. on a hot run.

Last edited by shortwave; September 25, 2012 at 12:13 AM.
shortwave is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 12:51 AM   #36
youngunz4life
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2010
Location: United States of America
Posts: 1,877
thx for the thread, Vermonter and on a side note, it reminded me of the double homicide in vermont commited towards the beginning of last decade while I was living closeby over the border in new hampshire: two teenagers(one named parker) murdered a college professor and his wife. the home they chose was random.
__________________
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" -Admiral Farragut @ Battle of Mobile Bay 05AUG1864
youngunz4life is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 01:17 PM   #37
Vermonter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 17, 2010
Posts: 954
drug mentality

younguns your welcome for the thread.

To me Vermont as a whole is a very safe state and statistically we have very low crime rates. The exception is the resort community mentality. Folks come here thinking they can do whatever they please because they are on vacation. Those folks tend to buy drugs. The folks who tend to sell drugs are folks that tend to have violence and stupidity follow them.

Funny thing is the drug fellas stick out like a sore thumb. They are so obvious here it isnt even funny and yet they get away with it.

Regards, Vermonter
Vermonter is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 03:04 PM   #38
Hiker 1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2011
Location: Colorado
Posts: 505
Denial is a very powerful human condition. Overcoming it forces people to make decisions they would rather not make. Why prepare to defend yourself when "it will never happen"?
Hiker 1 is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 07:14 PM   #39
Edward429451
Junior member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2000
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 9,494
That's right, with knowledge comes responsibility. I believe that some actually prefer the ignorance is bliss philosophy because it allows them to be lazy. Later on, they can say I never thought that would happen...
Edward429451 is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 09:50 PM   #40
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague County, Texas
Posts: 10,425
Not necessarily lazy, but as folks here so often have noted, if you think you are some place where something might happen, leave or move, but we can't spend our lives leaving and moving away from places that have become seemingly or apparently unsafe. It isn't that it would be lazy, but totally impractical. I know I can't live my life only going places that are "safe" and my safe neighborhood had a murder in it just a few years after I moved in. It was nice that I had a cop for a neighbor, but he was the one who did the murdering.

Also, it would drive some people nuts to continually consider the fact that they are not living in a place that is as safe as they would like.
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher."
-- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 10:05 PM   #41
Tinner666
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 12, 2012
Location: Richmond, Va.
Posts: 344
The painter in the shop next to mine poo-pooed my gun toting ways for the year he was there. Said he had a bat and that was all that was needed. I went to my shop one morning and had Police Line tape all over. Somebody took an axe to him.
Most of the hoods in the area know me. Once while inside doing paperwork, I heard somebody say "Not here! This guy shoots! Let's go somewhere else." Evidently, they're learning.
__________________
Frank--
Member, GoA, NRA-ILA, SAF, NRA Life Member
Tinner666 is offline  
Old September 25, 2012, 11:18 PM   #42
youngunz4life
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2010
Location: United States of America
Posts: 1,877
I'll take this a little further too....

Quote:
Funny thing about events "not happening here." For many people in many communities all over the US, it never happens there. This doesn't make the mindset correct, but only notes that the mindset is fully supported with long term support for many people in many communities/locations.

It is a funny thing that we are vigilant because we know it can and does happen, even if it hasn't happened to us...and we have the stats to back up our assertions. At the same time, the naysayers have have the stats to back up their assertions as well. Even if it does happen in their community, it still may be wholly unlikely to happen to them...statistically speaking.

On the down side, those living in remote areas where "it will never happen" may feel confident that it won't and it certainly may not, but if it does, help isn't likely to just be minutes away (which is already too long), but 10s of minutes away.
I'm not big on stats(I waste money on a lottery ticket here and there...go figure), but if you want to talk stats: many many times(and it has been documented and studied multiple multiple times), a rapist, burglar, car trespassing thief, or whatever the case will find the window that is open with only a screen, the unlocked door. He might have been at your neighbor's house but that area was secure or had lights. the stats say you are more vulnerable. An entire family(mother, father...both young w/multiple young children) was killed in richmond virginia this millenium on new years day while getting ready for an afternoon party, get together. the absolute only reason why they were chosen was the bad guys saw the front door open as they drove by. one child was actually dropped off while the bad guys were there and the mom answered the door and let her in(she apparently only thought she was being robbed...the family was burned to death while bound).

pretty much ramblin...bottom line there is no such thing as "it doesn't happen here"
__________________
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" -Admiral Farragut @ Battle of Mobile Bay 05AUG1864
youngunz4life is offline  
Old September 26, 2012, 06:04 AM   #43
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague County, Texas
Posts: 10,425
Quote:
pretty much ramblin...bottom line there is no such thing as "it doesn't happen here"
And yet people can live in a place for decades where it doesn't. Yeah, there is such thing, only there is no guarentee about it.
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher."
-- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old September 26, 2012, 07:17 AM   #44
Wildthang
Member
 
Join Date: September 26, 2012
Location: Northern Ohio
Posts: 16
Well I have been preaching to the girls to always keep the garage door shut, and look when they hear a noise out in the front of the house. They are nieve and seem to think that just because we are out in the country that nothing will ever happen. I am starting to convince them otherwise, but it has taken a long time to get them there. It just seems like women refuse to beleive that anybody would really want to harm them. They use to argue with me that there is no crime ever in our area, and nobody would ever hurt us, on and on. They use to think that I was just paranoid which really made me mad. So it has been a tough road to convince 2 women that they need to be aware and on guard. They are both 35 years old, city girls, and have never in their lives been exposed to a violent act, so they just do not understand the mind of a criminal!
Wildthang is offline  
Old September 26, 2012, 09:28 AM   #45
Patriot86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 23, 2010
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 1,293
Quote:
It had become more common in Orlando, too, but many of those robberies seemed to target illegal immigrants - who were extremely unlikely to call police.
I moved back to Illinois from Florida in 2007; there was a noticable uptick in home invasions in the couple of years before I left though. Mostly middle class areas. The HI was typically the result of someone leaving a garage door open at night and the bad guys entering through the garage; or someone out in an open garage late at night confronted by the bad guys.

Live by these two words: Home Carry


Something good to know is also your typical area LEO response time. I had to call the cops for the first time sunday night; there was a drunk guy who could not stand in the lobby of my building. Cops were there in about 2 mins; I was rather impressed.

Last edited by Patriot86; September 26, 2012 at 09:36 AM.
Patriot86 is offline  
Old September 26, 2012, 02:42 PM   #46
youngunz4life
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2010
Location: United States of America
Posts: 1,877
DNS, I can't debate your post, but I am hardpressed to believe that "nothing truly happens here".

they might say that when something happens there or when something happens to them, but stuff does happen. nearly every single community has some dirt even if you do go back some decades. the saying is flawed for people to say that too. the truth is it can happen to them. many many crimes are completely and totally random bad luck. basically, you just won the lottery but you're not getting an annuity "in cold blood" movie/book/true story just one of ten million examples. we're all going to the same place it is just a matter of when and how: murder, palne crash, car crash, accidental shooting, heart attack, frozen cybergenics(spelling, and so-on

PS- you quoted my ramblin line so I sortof followed it up in this post

all the best
gunz
__________________
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" -Admiral Farragut @ Battle of Mobile Bay 05AUG1864
youngunz4life is offline  
Old September 26, 2012, 02:52 PM   #47
aarondhgraham
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 1, 2009
Location: Stillwater, OKlahoma
Posts: 7,075
It just happened here,,,

This morning at approximately 7:50 a junior high student here in Stillwater, Oklahoma "...died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head...".

This article gives a few details about what happened this morning.

I'm not stunned by the news of this apparent suicide,,,
Perhaps I'm getting too familiar with the frequency of these type of events.

I am deeply saddened at the grief the parents will have to endure,,,
I truly hope the media shows some empathy in their reporting of the event.

Aarond

.
__________________
Caje: The coward dies a thousand times, the brave only once.
Kirby: That's about all it takes, ain't it?
Combat: "A Silent Cry"
Aarond is good,,, Aarond is wise,,, Always trust Aarond! (most of the time)
aarondhgraham is offline  
Old September 26, 2012, 04:13 PM   #48
sigcurious
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 25, 2011
Posts: 1,755
A couple of things that you can use to help inform yourself and loved ones. My local PD/Sheriffs office(they're integrated) provides this service, which maps incident reports. I'd imagine other PDs might have similar services. Also there's a company called alert id, which is a bit broader allows users to post info along with other LEA provided information.
sigcurious is offline  
Old September 27, 2012, 12:46 PM   #49
Vermonter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 17, 2010
Posts: 954
aarond

Sorry to hear that
Vermonter is offline  
Old September 27, 2012, 08:25 PM   #50
youngunz4life
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2010
Location: United States of America
Posts: 1,877
I second that Aarond. ...just barely a teenager, that is upsetting and a very tough pill to swallow
__________________
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" -Admiral Farragut @ Battle of Mobile Bay 05AUG1864
youngunz4life is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.13718 seconds with 7 queries