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Old September 19, 2012, 08:39 AM   #1
Vermonter
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Mindset: It will never happen here.

http://www.rutlandherald.com/article...19927/0/SPORTS


Above from Rutland Herald. Sometimes it charges for access to articles.
I have posted here in the past about building clearinig as well as other T&T topics. I live outside of the resort town here where the properties are not left unoccupied until winter. I have been counseled here by some very knowledgeable folks and for that I am truly greatful. This home is exactly one home away from one I manage. If these folks had picked the next driveway my phone could well have been ringing to go shut off the alarm system.

I have learned a good many things here on T&T and I am greatful to everyone who has contributed. The most useful thing I have learned is to not fall into that sleepy little town mindset of "That will never happen here"

So if you are in a sleepy little town somewhere thinking things like "That will never happen here" let this be a lesson to you.

Kind Regards, Vermonter

Last edited by Brian Pfleuger; September 20, 2012 at 08:35 AM. Reason: Copyright
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Old September 19, 2012, 09:45 AM   #2
Lee Lapin
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"When it's least expected, you're elected!" - John Farnam

See http://www.defense-training.com/quips/quips.html for more...
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Old September 19, 2012, 10:23 AM   #3
mete
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Just watch the news ! "That type of thing never happens here " a very common comment of folks that just HAD IT HAPPEN in their neighborhood !!

So they move into a 'gated community' because it's safe. So do drug dealers for the same reason. Well of course both groups are wrong .

When I try to educate people ,it's "oh you're over reacting"
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Old September 19, 2012, 10:49 AM   #4
zombietactics
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I live in a part of California often referred to as "the bubble", because there is a lot of money and "nothing bad ever happens here".

We had the 6th break in burglary last week. That's 6 in less than 3 years.
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Old September 19, 2012, 11:39 AM   #5
Frank Ettin
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Now why would crime happen in nice, affluent neighborhoods?

Because the people who live there tend to have the nicest stuff to steal.
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Old September 19, 2012, 12:34 PM   #6
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Quote:
Now why would crime happen in nice, affluent neighborhoods?

Because the people who live there tend to have the nicest stuff to steal.
If you would have told me a year ago I would be reading about an armed home invasion in Highland Park, IL one of the safest suburbs in this area I would have called you a Liar. I think I have read about TWO of them in that area now just over the summer. The Northern Chicago burbs are my stompin ground; I grew up here. When I was younger this stuff did not happen; but slowly the criminals are starting to realize all these north shore; anti gun; BMW driving types are easy marks who don't even lock their doors! All they have to do (most of the time) is wait for dad to leave for the office and mom to leave with the kids, or better yet the whole lot to leave on a 2 week vacation. I guess in the two cases i read about the criminals wrongly thought everyone was gone.

My buddies mother was robbed while she was out of town for a month in Hawaii; its funny because they got a bunch of jewelry and cash but they did not find a big stash of his late fathers guns. My friends wife was lucky that she did not run into the robbers because she had been checking on the home 3 or 4 times a week to get the mail.
Anyways; her home is also in one of the safest suburbs around this area and to boot it is about 1 mile from the police station, you cannot drive by that area and not see a cop on traffic duty.


The only people who expect to be victims of violent crime are violent criminals(gang bangers) themselves; moral of the story be ready for anything.


Quote:
I live in a part of California often referred to as "the bubble", because there is a lot of money and "nothing bad ever happens here".

We had the 6th break in burglary last week. That's 6 in less than 3 years.
I seem to remember the case of a guy in that area; maybe early to mid 2000's who shot 3 or 4 home invaders, didn't they try to railroad him? Can't seem to find a link I remember reading a couple of news stories about it a year or so after I moved to Florida in 2000.

Last edited by Patriot86; September 19, 2012 at 12:47 PM.
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Old September 19, 2012, 01:53 PM   #7
Vermonter
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Affulent and secluded

Well being that the community in question is a ski resort. Affulence should come as no supprise. There are pleanty of homes and condos here that are vacant all spring and summer. If the owner comes to them once a month they are lucky. Then again there are flat screen tvs and other electronics as well as some very expensive dishware.

This is however a rare occasion in that the BGs broke into the only obviously occupied home on that street. Either they knew something was present that they wanted to steal or they actually ment to harm someone.

Break ins are not uncommon here. Normally they find a nice home on a secluded street that is obviously vacant. They head out at night and empty the place. Insurance pays the tab owners aren't hurt and they sign a managment contract with myself or one of my competitiors. (homes that are not professionally managed tend to show it from the outside IE gras is too long and there is never a truck in the driveway.)

My point is that this is the first "home invasion" type situation as supposed to your typical run of the mill robbery.

Regards, Vermonter

This was 4 am on a vacant street with say a dozen homes on it. They went to the only one with a car in the driveway and possibly a light of some sort on. (I cannot confirm weather or not lights were on but there had to be at least one car in the driveway.)
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Old September 19, 2012, 04:05 PM   #8
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Just recently a little town about 15 minutes from here had an incident where conflicts between 2 neighbors led to one shooting the other in the back of the head and then killing himself. I am armed whenever and wherever I can do.

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Old September 19, 2012, 07:00 PM   #9
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While I will never think "it will never happen here", I am fairly certain that even in my neck of the woods, things like this are still "unlikely to happen here".
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Old September 20, 2012, 05:39 AM   #10
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That's why I try to tell people to wake up and look whats going on! You never know when your card will be pulled.
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Old September 21, 2012, 01:08 PM   #11
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Surprisingly, many home invasions are done when the residents are at home.

Think about it this way, affluent neighborhood means nice stuff. Probably a safe(maybe hidden) with the best goodies tucked inside. If I were a burglar, unless I'm a proficient safe cracker, I would want you home. Makes entry to safe or to get your hidden goodies much easier if I'm holding a gun to you or a loved one.

Too, I posted this a while back on another thread that according to LE, several counties here in Ohio have had a drastic increase in HI's in rural areas during daylight hours when the perp had to know someone was home(cars in driveway,doors open, etc).
There has been enough of these incidents that the sheriff's of a couple different counties have been on TV warning rural residents of such and to start keeping house,out building and car doors, windows locked. And stay alert of their surroundings.

Since it can take from 15-30min. LEO response time to many of the rural areas, residents of these areas have to realize that they are prime targets and change their thinking that living in the country versus the city does NOT mean you're more secure or less prone to something such as a H.I.
A lot can happen in 30min. especially if a perp gets the drop on us inside the seclusion of a dwelling and the nearest neighbor/help is not within hearing distance.

The fact that many counties are in financial straits and have had to lay off deputies hasn't helped either.

Last edited by shortwave; September 21, 2012 at 01:14 PM.
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Old September 21, 2012, 01:19 PM   #12
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If they want electronics, etc, better if nobody is there.

If they want prescription meds, cash, or other things that may be locked away, easier if somebody is home.

Either way, I worry about capabilities, as I can't predict intentions.
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Old September 21, 2012, 01:43 PM   #13
shortwave
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Quote:
If they want prescription meds, cash, or other things that may be locked away, easier if somebody is home.
...

...which has become a problem of true epidemic proportion.

Addiction to prescription drugs, especially opiates, has been, and continue's to increase at astounding rates.
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Old September 21, 2012, 02:11 PM   #14
Skadoosh
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Quote:
Surprisingly, many home invasions are done when the residents are at home.
That's what home invasions are. When no one is home, its called burglary.
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Old September 21, 2012, 02:38 PM   #15
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skadoosh
Quote:
Surprisingly, many home invasions are done when the residents are at home.
That's what home invasions are. When no one is home, its called burglary.
Actually, it's burglary whether or not anyone is at home.

"Burglary" is, in general, today defined along the lines of: the breaking and entering of a building with the intent of committing a crime therein. Of course, the exact definition will vary somewhat from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, but that's the essence of it. So whether the building is occupied or not is irrelevant.

But whether or not the building is occupied is relevant to what crimes might be committed in the course of a burglary. If no one is home, it will be only property crimes. If someone is home, the crimes committed inside by the burglar could include crimes against persons as well.
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Old September 21, 2012, 02:56 PM   #16
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Yet the idea that a home invasion occurs whether or not anyone is occupying the home at the time of the burglary like the OP implies, is misleading.

I suggest that the OP reads this:

http://www.homeinvasionnews.com/home...-from-the-fbi/
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old September 21, 2012, 03:45 PM   #17
Vermonter
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Skadoosh

Quote:
Yet the idea that a home invasion occurs whether or not anyone is occupying the home at the time of the burglary like the OP implies, is misleading.

I suggest that the OP reads this:
Actually that is what I was pointing to. What I said was this is the first home invasion type scenario as supposed to a burglrey that takes place with no one present.

The definition of the term home invasion was not really my point regardless. My point was that nowhere are we safe. My point was also that typically in the past the theives here have targeted vacant properties. In this case they had to have noticed the difference between vacant and occupied.

Regards, Vermonter
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Old September 21, 2012, 03:53 PM   #18
JerryM
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I am not sure folks think it could not happen. I sure do not. However, there is a limit to the precautions I take as a result of playing the odds.

I have metal security doors, and usually carry, and at all times at night.

I do not carry in my home or when in the shower. I do not have guns at all times within arms reach, or in every room. I am willing to take my chances and relax at home without worrying that any moment I may be attacked.
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Old September 21, 2012, 04:15 PM   #19
shortwave
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Quote:
.... My point was also that typically in the past the theives here have targeted vacant properties. In this case they had to have noticed the difference between vacant and occupied...
...and the reason for my post as to the growing trend of the perp(s) wanting someone home.

The prior mentioned prescription drug problem has gotten so bad around these parts that DEA busted a group that was hanging out at pharmacies watching for especially more senior people to get their scripts and following them home, waiting for them to unlock door and robbing them of their script and other belongings.
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Old September 21, 2012, 05:00 PM   #20
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I think your assertion that the growing trend of criminals actually wanting the victims to be home in order to gain easier access to certain items....is a stretch. While it may be localized to your area, I seriously doubt it will become a widespread trend.
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Old September 21, 2012, 05:04 PM   #21
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Skadoosh, it was pretty common in the Atlanta area.

It had become more common in Orlando, too, but many of those robberies seemed to target illegal immigrants - who were extremely unlikely to call police.
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Old September 21, 2012, 05:30 PM   #22
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What do you mean by "common"? Because thats a relative term. "Increasing" is not the same as "common".
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old September 21, 2012, 05:33 PM   #23
MLeake
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By common I mean it seemed like the Atlanta Journal Constitution would report home invasions and/or burglaries of occupied dwellings an average of once to twice a week during the three years I lived in the area.

(Edit: The rate seems about the same since I left, so I had no correlation, thanks.)
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Old September 21, 2012, 06:10 PM   #24
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skadoosh
Yet the idea that a home invasion occurs whether or not anyone is occupying the home at the time of the burglary like the OP implies, is misleading.
As was your assertion that a burglary meant no one was home.

I've provided the correct terminology. Let's use correct terminology and not quibble about it any more.
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Old September 21, 2012, 06:38 PM   #25
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Quote:
Now why would crime happen in nice, affluent neighborhoods?

Because the people who live there tend to have the nicest stuff to steal.
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And the most money in the ATM machine that one home invader will drive you to while the other holds your family hostage---just before you are murdered.

Also, there are a large number of robberies that involve following people home and either robbing them in their driveways or forcing their way into the home. All it takes is a nice looking car to demonstrate your upper level social status, and get the wrong peoples' attention. Don't underestimate the robberies that occur in this manner.
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