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Old September 11, 2012, 11:29 AM   #1
Marquezj16
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What type of ammo do you use for carry/home defense?

In another thread, someone mentioned having to explain to a juror the type of ammo used.

"I wouldn't wanna have to explain to a jury in a court of law why I used it."

My question is what do you use for SD/HD ammo? Does the thought of having to explain your ammo choice to a juror affect your decision?
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Old September 11, 2012, 11:39 AM   #2
allaroundhunter
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Quote:
Does the thought of having to explain your ammo choice to a juror affect your decision?
No, it doesn't.

Currently I use Hornady Critical defense in my M&P9. I do not worry about having to explain why I chose 'X' JHP instead of 'Y' JHP just because it isn't what the local police carries. Is it good advice to use what your local police force uses? Sure, but carrying Remington Golden Saber instead of Speer Gold Dots does not make me a blood-thirsty killer.
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Old September 11, 2012, 11:39 AM   #3
Constantine
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Quote:
My question is what do you use for SD/HD ammo?
Speer Gold Dot +p's in any caliber





Quote:
Does the thought of having to explain your ammo choice to a juror affect your decision?
No, no, no...Heck no..
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Old September 11, 2012, 11:47 AM   #4
Marquezj16
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I use Hornady CD, TAP, Fed HST or Win PDX. It all depends on what shoots best with the pistol used. I don't for a moment think I will get tried based on the ammo I use or do I let it stop me from choosing the type of ammo.
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Old September 11, 2012, 11:48 AM   #5
aarondhgraham
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Its your attorney's job to defend you,,,

I use ball ammo,,,
But we won't go into why.

In one of the training sessions I have attended,,,
They brought this same subject up for a discussion topic.

One of the instructors (a lawyer) said this is a common tactic in a civil suit,,,
The plaintiff's attorney will often try to paint you as a villain,,,
Based solely on your choice of ammunition.

If you use hollow-point he paints you as a rabid killer,,,
If you use ball ammo he paints you as a para-military whack-job.

One man suggested we call our local police and ask what they use,,,
And if possible to use the same brand and design.

Personally I don't think you can prepare ahead against this strategy,,,
You will be damned whether you use HP or FMJ ammunition.

It's up to your attorney to defend against this tactic.

The best advice I can relate on this is what I received from the class,,,
Only use commercially available self-defense ammunition,,,
Don't use your own (or anyone else's) handloads.

Aarond

.
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Old September 11, 2012, 11:48 AM   #6
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9mm HD/SD - Corbon DPX 115gr
.45 HD & Carry - Winchester PDX 230gr
.380 Carry - Hornady Critical Defense 90gr

All factory, all the time for any defensive purpose
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Old September 11, 2012, 11:58 AM   #7
Loronzo
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I carry these in my .40 ( http://www.extremeshockusa.com/cgist...d=3472900.7552) with 2 backup mags of Hornady "Zmax". My carry pistols are loaded with Hornady Critical Defense. Undoubtedly if in a SD situation I would be most concerned with removing the imediate threat. Also there is a concern of overpenetration that by using HP's or the like would be a better option than FMJ ball load.

As long as you aren't violating state or federal laws I would think you should carry what you are comfortable with/ shoot accurately. Confidence in your ammo could mean the difference in life or death in a shooting. Worrying about what would happen if in trial would (in most cases) mean that the shooting appeared unjustified from the get go. Let's be honest, 99.9% of the people on these forums carry for protection only. We train regularly, keep our firearms in good repair and try to avoid confrontation as much as possible on the premise that if we are faced with a life or death situation that we will live, even though we hope beyond hope we never have to draw and fire our weapons.

Now on the other hand you might have a hard time explaining to the responding officer why your AP. 223 round went through your house and the neighbor's and hit his dog in the back yard... then you may be explaining that one to a jury. I would recomend just carrying what you are comfortable/familiar with, take into account your surroundings and load accordingly, there is no "perfect cartridge" same as no "perfect gun" for every situation but some are better than others. (Again just make sure to follow all applicable state and federal laws regarding the procurement and usage of ammo).
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:02 PM   #8
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There are a variety of different bullet designs within what I think of as the "acceptable window of performance." Of those, I try to stick with those that perform best in my carry pistol.

As for juries . . Handloads are a huge no-no, but that's an evidentiary matter that's been hashed out elsewhere. There are cases in which the choice of bullet design has been something of an issue. Harold Fish was one such case, IIRC. Accordingly, I recognize that bullet choice can be an issue with jurors. So do I let the prospect of explaining my choice to a jury affect my decision? Not greatly, but it wouldn't be honest for me to claim that it "absolutely, in no way" colors my decision. If I can get the same performance out of a bullet called the "XDR-28" as I can another called the "MurderousManMauler 5000," guess which one I'm going with.
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:07 PM   #9
RedBowTies88
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M855 for home defense.

Buffalo Bore 115gr flat nose 9x18 for CCW
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:12 PM   #10
Marquezj16
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To poster above

Quote:
Buffalo Bore 115gr flat nose 9x18 for CCW
Things that can get you in trouble in NJ
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:15 PM   #11
buckhorn_cortez
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I use Winchest PDX1 - it's one of the rounds chosen by the FBI. If the government uses it to shoot...whomever....then I shouldn't be restricted in my choice to use it either since its "governement approved."
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:35 PM   #12
RedBowTies88
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Things that can get you in trouble in NJ
More like things that will land you in jail for 10+ years..unless of course you come from a broken "ethnic" background... then you get a slap on the wrist.

Luckily for me, I have a Utah non-resident CHL that i can use when I travel to america.
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:41 PM   #13
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Quote:
I use Winchest PDX1 - it's one of the rounds chosen by the FBI. If the government uses it to shoot...whomever....then I shouldn't be restricted in my choice to use it either since its "governement approved."
There's that. I like it because my sub compact .45, doesn't really care for "traditional" HPs. The edge tends to stick on the ramp - not an issue with the PDX1s due to the rounded tip.
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:45 PM   #14
SRH78
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CCW- 357 Sig, 125 grain Winchester PDX1

nightstand gun - 357 Magnum, 125 grain Buffalo Bore

I also keep my Super Redhawk loaded with 45 Colt lead hollow points.

Quote:
Does the thought of having to explain your ammo choice to a juror affect your decision?
If it didn't, I would have some NASTY handloads in my Super Redhawk that do enough damage to make most rifle rounds jealous.
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Last edited by SRH78; September 11, 2012 at 01:08 PM.
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Old September 11, 2012, 12:57 PM   #15
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There only person on record for getting in "trouble" in a criminal prosecution for using a particular type of ammunition, was someone using a 10mm as it was more "powerful" than what the police used in Phoenix. So as of now, I would be concerned about using a 10mm if I cared about that issue. My attitude is make sure you are justified in using deadly force. Use a .500 S&W but make sure you are justified in using deadly force and don't sweat the ammunition as long as it will do the job.
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Old September 11, 2012, 01:06 PM   #16
Woody55
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I pretty much do what @aarondhgraham mentioned.

I don't use hand loads. I think that's the easiest way to be characterized as some sort of crazy gun freak who wants to kill someone. Besides, I hand load for target shooting.

I found out what the local police are authorized to use, and - at least as to type - if not the exact brand, that's what I use. I figure it isn't likely to antagonize the DA and would give my attorney (God forbid) the most ammunition (pun intended) to refute the opposition's arguments.

As far as effectiveness goes, well I don't want to kill anyone anyway. And I've always figured that as you threaten, shoot and hit someone you probably take care of 90% of your problems at each level.
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Old September 11, 2012, 01:08 PM   #17
RedBowTies88
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There only person on record for getting in "trouble" in a criminal prosecution for using a particular type of ammunition, was someone using a 10mm
That may be the only case where someone got jammed up becuase the cartridge he was using was too powerful..However as far as getting in trouble for a "type" of ammo several people in NJ have been arrested/charged/served time for being in posession of hollow point or expanding ammo.
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Old September 11, 2012, 01:09 PM   #18
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Quote:
There's that. I like it because my sub compact .45, doesn't really care for "traditional" HPs. The edge tends to stick on the ramp - not an issue with the PDX1s due to the rounded tip.
One of the reasons I've chosen the PDX1 - the bullet profile is rounded and the rounds feed in all of my semi-auto pistols.

I also like the fact that it is nickel plated as the smoother outer surface of the cartridge helps in feeding in the magazine.

Quote:
...several people in NJ have been arrested/charged/served time for being in posession of hollow point or expanding ammo.
Reason #4951 for not living in NJ...if the FBI can shoot citizens with their chosen ammunition - then I should be able to use exactly the same ammunition.
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Old September 11, 2012, 01:09 PM   #19
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We've had a few home invasions recently in our area, so I talked with our local officials. Their sidearms are Glock 40s with JHP, so they were not concerned with my selection of .357, 41Mag, 45ACP, and 12ga.
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Old September 11, 2012, 02:15 PM   #20
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When I get thru shooting all of my Cor-Bon DPX in 9MM and 45ACP, I will be moving into my supply of Winchester Ranger T for 9MM +P+, 40S&W and 45ACP+P. Both brands are street proven, but the Winchester costs 1/3 of what the Cor-Bon does.
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Old September 11, 2012, 02:20 PM   #21
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I use either Speer Gold Dots or Federal Hydroshock HP ammo depending on what gun I'm using.

I have zero concerns about explaining my ammo choice to a jury. If I shoot someone it will be because my life was in danger and I needed to stop the threat. The ammo I used simply helped me to do that.
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Old September 11, 2012, 02:32 PM   #22
sigcurious
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I use Federal HST, never was concerned with what a jury might think. I chose it because it works in my pistols and it can be had at reasonable prices compared to the other SD ammo choices at my LGS.
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Old September 11, 2012, 02:35 PM   #23
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i use rusty titanium poison tips. i dont care about the jury as long as im alive.
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Old September 11, 2012, 03:06 PM   #24
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i use rusty titanium poison tips
Nice! I didn't know they still made those. Isn't that what Roy Scheider was cooking up in Jaws?
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Old September 11, 2012, 04:50 PM   #25
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I'd rather save my life with hollow points and face the jury then face my maker.
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