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Old September 8, 2012, 09:19 PM   #1
Pongo357
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Bullet weight

I have a Savage Axis in .308 Win. Their website says 22" barrel and twist is 10 which i assume to mean 1 in 10. Correct? I have been instructed that faster means lighter bullets, and slower means heavier bullets for great accuracy. Is that true and is 1:10 fast or slow for this rifle? If so, do i want to set up for 150 gr. 180 gr. or 165 gr bullets? Or can I switch around with rezeroes in between and still achieve at least repeatable hunting accuracy out to say 300 yds? (and no I don't think it'll ever be 300 yds, just a reference number)
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Old September 8, 2012, 09:38 PM   #2
golfnutrlv
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in a .30 caliber rifle, 1:10 is a FASTER twist. translates to 1 twist in 10 inches. Therefore 1:12 is SLOWER.

The three bullets you mentioned should all work fine in a 1:10. THe M1 Garand and the M1A have 1:10 twist barrels (with the exception of some of the newer M1A's). The US military typically ran 150 and 173/175 grain bullets for the most part.
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Old September 9, 2012, 01:36 AM   #3
big al hunter
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For that rifle and twist you can choose any of those mentioned and more. Heavier bullets need faster twist. Choose your bullet weight for the animal being hunted not the possibility of accuracy. Then shoot several brands to see which bullet your gun likes. For best results use : 150 & 165 grain for deer, black bear, antelope and the like. 180 to 200 for elk, moose, grizzly bear, buffalo. Bigger animals need more penetration=bigger bullets. Coyote, chucks, prairie dog, and such use 100 to130 grain.
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Old September 9, 2012, 06:29 AM   #4
PawPaw
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Quote:
Is that true and is 1:10 fast or slow for this rifle?
1:10 is really common these days for .30 cal barrels. I've got several Savage .30 cal barrels and they're all 1:10. In the past I've seen 1:12 and 1:14, but these days 1:10 is probably the most common twist for .30 caliber barrels.

Quote:
If so, do i want to set up for 150 gr. 180 gr. or 165 gr
That's personal choice. The rifle should perform fine for your stated purpose. Lots of folks are driving heavier bullets these days, but for under 300 yards I doubt you'd see any difference whatsoever. I suspect if we asked the game, they couldn't tell any difference either. As you do your testing the rifle might exhibit a preference, showing greater accuracy with one bullet over another. For myself, I like 150-165 grain bullets in the various .30 calibers, but that's simply personal preference. Lots of folks have great success with heavier bullets.
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Old September 9, 2012, 08:12 AM   #5
kraigwy
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Quote:
I have been instructed that faster means lighter bullets, and slower means heavier bullets for great accuracy.
Its the opposite, BUT, it has more to do with length then weight.

For example, lets say you have a 150 grn round nose, flat base bullet, and compare it to the same caliber, 150 grn spear point, boat tail bullet. The later is going to be longer and would require a faster twist to stabilize it or keep it stable.

Also, a faster twist will stabilize a shorter/lighter bullet better then a slower twist will stabilize a longer heavier bullet.

Taking your 30 cal bullets, a 1:10 will stabilize a 130 grn shorter bullet better then a 1:12/14 will stabilize a 180-190 bullet.

The 223s is a better example. The 1:7 the military uses will stabilize the 50-90 weight bullets, but the 1:12 doesn't preform well in anything over 55 grn.

Manufactures use the twist that will stabilize the widest range of bullets the customer will use. That's why they use the 1:10 in 30 cal. If you were going to make a Palma rifle using the 155s then people use the 1:12 or 1:14. But most people don't shoot Palma, they hunt and want 150-180 308s, hence the 1:10.

Back to the 223s, most manufactures use 1:9 instead of the 1:7. The reason being, the longer, 80-90 223 bullets require the bullet to be loaded longer, meaning they wont fit in the magazines of the ARs and other 223 Gas guns.

Those who use the 80 & 90s use then in competition, 600-1000 yards. They don't care that they don't fit the magazines because they have to single load them in matches anyway.

Another reason for the manufactures not using the 1:7 for everything is civilian varmint shooter may want the super light 40-50 varmint bullets that have thinner jackets. They want the bullet to come apart so there is lest fur damage (the don't exit) and the break up when the hit the ground, meaning less chance of ricochets. A super light jacked 40 grn bullet (made for the Hornet) could fly a part by over spinning, in the barrel or air.

The military doesn't use those thin jacketed bullets. Some military bullets are lighter then others of the same length, such as tracers vs lead core bullet.

A good rule of thumb, if everything else is constant, go to the faster twist.
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Old September 9, 2012, 04:13 PM   #6
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You should be fine with most common bullet weights. It might be less accurate with the real lightweights such as 110' or 125's, but most anything 150-200 will be fine.
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Old September 9, 2012, 04:46 PM   #7
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As always, Kraig knows his stuff.
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Old September 10, 2012, 02:05 AM   #8
lefteyedom
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Your Savage is a fine hunting rifle. Find the bullet/load that it groups best and stick with it. My humble suggestion is a 165 grains bullet. It is almost perfect the perfect 308 hunting bullet weight and the 1/10 twist will stabilize it just fine.
Happy hunting
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Old September 10, 2012, 11:07 AM   #9
Art Eatman
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I've found that in a thirty-cal, a 1:10 twist is fine for 110-180 range bullets. Sub-MOA is fairly easy.

So, 110 for coyotes, 150 for deer, and 165 or 180 for elk.
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