The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Semi-automatic Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 5, 2012, 03:59 PM   #1
BoogieMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 4, 2012
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,287
Plastic or metal

Not a versus thread. Its just that I am a metal frame guy. My buddy is about to buy his first pistol and several people are steering him toward Glock. I told him, no issues that I know of with Glocks I just dont see any reason to buy one over say a CZ 75, Beretta 92, 1911, or a Sig P226.....
We live in NJ and carry is not an option any time in the near future. This is just a range gun. Maybe an occasional club steel match. With that in mind why would anyone buy a Glock? Either way I am pretty sure that he is going with 9mm at my suggestion. If your only shooting targets why pay the extra for bigger bullets?
I am tagging along with him for his purchase. I get most of the new gun thrill and no cost to me.
__________________
Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it.
Milton Freidman
BoogieMan is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:05 PM   #2
BarryLee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 29, 2010
Location: The ATL (OTP)
Posts: 2,798
I suppose I see the issue as less about the frame material and more about striker v. hammer guns. I own both including GLOCKS and have experienced no issue, but really it is kind of a personal preference.
__________________
A major source of objection to a free economy is precisely that it ... gives people what they want instead of what a particular group thinks they ought to want. Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
- Milton Friedman
BarryLee is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:13 PM   #3
Dragline45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2010
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 2,715
Quote:
My buddy is about to buy his first pistol and several people are steering him toward Glock. I told him, no issues that I know of with Glocks I just dont see any reason to buy one over say a CZ 75, Beretta 92, 1911, or a Sig P226
Comparing a Glock to a 1911, Sig, or Beretta is like apples and oranges as far as weight, style, and function go. Although I am not a Glock fan I would choose one as a carry gun over any that you listed based on size and weight alone.

I am a big fan of polymer when it comes to carry guns. Aluminum is pricy and does not hold up nearly as well as polymer. With steel slides on aluminum frames you have to be careful about constantly keeping the rails greased or lubed. Also aluminum has been known to have problems with high round counts and cracked frames

Quote:
This is just a range gun. Maybe an occasional club steel match. With that in mind why would anyone buy a Glock?
I agree, if I was going to pick up a range gun I wouldn't go with a polymer framed striker fired pistol. The CZ, Beretta, or Sig would be a much better option for target shooting.
Dragline45 is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:17 PM   #4
Creeper
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 9, 2008
Location: Woooooshington
Posts: 1,797
I'm not a big fan of polymer guns either... saying that, there are many that you really can't fault other than they don't meet your or my personal preferences.
My latest polymer "hearts desires" are the Steyr M9 and Caracal F. I own lots of metal handguns, and these two poly guns have my undivided attention for numerous reasons.

My personal inclination is to steer your friend into test firing as many guns as he is willing and can afford to try out. Metal or polymer... if it feels good and shoots well, that's the end of the story.

C
__________________
Shoulder Drive Nicholson Club
Creeper is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:26 PM   #5
sigcurious
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 25, 2011
Posts: 1,755
Has he been able to shoot any of the pistols in question or at least fondle a bunch before the purchase day? Or will all the fondling happen on the purchase day? If he has shot or fondled already, what's he say?

Personally, I think the opposite could be asked, why not a Glock over the others?

For any model, metal or plastic, maybe he likes the ergos and trigger or looks better. I would say there is some benefit to the Glock in it's simplicity for a first pistol. However that feature is not unique to Glocks.

I think my g34 is a great range pistol, but so are my 1911 and 226.
sigcurious is online now  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:28 PM   #6
TunnelRat
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2011
Posts: 4,681
Quote:
Not a versus thread.
Right...
__________________
Guns don't kill people. Apes with guns kill people! - Robin Williams
TunnelRat is online now  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:44 PM   #7
MonsterB
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2010
Posts: 347
Quote:
Right...
Thats what I was thinking. I think, if you base a gun on what its made of, and stuff you read on the internet, you may not end up with the best gun for you. If you however shoot said guns you are interested in first, see how they perform first hand, get some rounds downrange, you will make your own mind up what works best for you.
I myself am doing ok these days, and am currently carrying a Sig229 Exteme, which is roughly 3x the price of a Glock. However when i comes to just plain shooting, neighther is more reliable than the other. I think the Sig has a better trigger, which helps with accuracy, but its not far and above the cheaper Glock. If the poop hit the fan, I would probably grab the glock first, just because I have 10's of thousands of rounds through them, but if I had to make one shot to save my life, it would be the 229. Guns are one thing that you should never listen to another person telling you what is best. Its different for everyone, and the only way to figure it out is to do some shooting.
MonsterB is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 05:39 PM   #8
farmerboy
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 16, 2009
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 1,343
you may like something and your friend may like the same or totally opposite. Who knows he/she may like a wheelgun? I own all also and shoot them all but Lately Ive been real fond of my Glock 22. But yes all guns will do the same just different designs and some feel different , point different, etc, etc, etc,
farmerboy is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 05:40 PM   #9
drail
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2008
Posts: 3,150
It's a simple question of balance and center of gravity. A polymer gun will have a higher center of gravity (not good) and generate more muzzle flip (also not good). Some people don't care about these things and are willing to compensate (work harder) to shoot it just to save some carry weight. I prefer an all steel gun. No polymer and no aluminum alloys in my safe.
drail is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 05:43 PM   #10
BoogieMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 4, 2012
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,287
Quote:
Has he been able to shoot any of the pistols in question or at least fondle a bunch before the purchase day? Or will all the fondling happen on the purchase day? If he has shot or fondled already, what's he say?
In recent time he has fired Kimber 1911 (9mm Target), Ruger 22/45, Colt 1903 and a classic S&W 38 special revolver. I may be stering him in the direction of guns I would likely want to own. But I think the Glock-Heads have done the same. Just want to make sure he goes for him. He probably ont buy the night he finds the gun he wants.
__________________
Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it.
Milton Freidman
BoogieMan is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 06:19 PM   #11
marine6680
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 24, 2012
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1,513
Nothing wrong with Glocks... I am just not a fan of the ergonomics of them...

Nothing wrong with polymer framed guns in general. I had a Springfield XD in 40 that I loved.

I own two CZ 75s, that I love!

As far as a range toy... larger all metal pistols tend to have less felt recoil and muzzle flip. They can be more comfortable to hold. They also tend to be more accurate... (so long as they are quality made)

If all the gun will be is a range toy... it really negates the advantages that polymer framed guns give... lighter weight for day to day carry, either CC or open.

That being said... there is nothing wrong with getting a poly gun as a range toy either.
marine6680 is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 06:43 PM   #12
mrbentley57
Member
 
Join Date: February 9, 2012
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 57
My preference would be a full size all steel gun as well. 1911, CZ57, SW5906, Sig 229 ..but to be fair my 1st ever gun I bought was a polymer S&W M&P .45 that I loved. As I got more into shooting I gradually sold it and gravitated to the all metal guns for range work. But as a 1st gun he really can't go wrong no matter what he buys. He will be happy he has a gun.
mrbentley57 is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 08:32 PM   #13
Crow Hunter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 27, 2012
Posts: 1,078
I am a Glock guy and I have been since 1998 or so.

Glocks make much better carry guns than target guns. They can be particularly difficult for some people to master.

Although one advantage with the Glock he might like is he can join the Glock Shooting Sports Foundation (GSSF) if they have local matches. You can shoot and win prizes, sometimes even a gun and get a Glock armorer to check/update/fix his Glocks for free. It is great low intensity way to get his feet wet in competition shooting.

If I were going to get a gun just to shoot at the range, I would go revolver. Specifically a single action revolver. They are my favorite gun by far to shoot for fun.

But since this is a Semiauto question, my personal favorite auto ever was a Walther P5 that I got years ago. Very sweet shooting gun, the hammer drop and slide release were combined into one lever and it ejected to the LEFT. And it looked really cool too. They are pretty hard to find now though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walther_P5

Other than that, I would have to say either a Beretta 92 if his hand fits the grip, or a Browning High Power if he doesn't like the grip on the Beretta. Those were my 2 favorite handguns to shoot back when I had a varied collection.

The only autos that I have now are Glocks.
__________________
I am no longer participating in gun forums.

Good luck.
Crow Hunter is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 09:14 PM   #14
Nathan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 1, 2001
Posts: 2,056
I love these...discussions.

I would suggest a S&W M&P, SA XD, Glock, then 1911 in that order. I like the M&P because you can get a thumb safety, modern mags, and a decent trigger. It's negatives are trigger and weird grip that most other people like.

I really like the XD, grip, trigger, XDM option, grip safety, proven reliability, modern mags...all good. Negatives...really none, maybe width??

Glock also is a superb choice. Great mags, proven reliability, rail as do the above guns.

So, up to this point, these are all pretty similar advanced modern guns.

1911....super choice. Can be better than the above guns, depending on the specific gun. Do it all 1911's can be pretty expensive, especially whe a used serviceable Glock can be $350ish. No matter the price, mag and recoil springs need more replacement. Feed it all reliability is possible, but often requires someone who knows 1911 actions to make it work. Mags hold 7-8 rounds. Still, the 1911 is the fastest way to get super accurate rounds from holster to on target.

As for Beretta's, Sig's, Cz's, etc....these are all fine guns surely, but I have no use for DA/SA actions.
Nathan is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 09:17 PM   #15
Kreyzhorse
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 12, 2006
Location: NKY
Posts: 11,520
Nothing wrong with Glock or any other of the suggested guns. Your buddy should buy what he likes and what feels the best to him. It is his gun after all.
__________________
"He who laughs last, laughs dead." Homer Simpson
Kreyzhorse is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 09:52 PM   #16
Dashunde
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 22, 2004
Posts: 1,711
Quote:
...no issues that I know of with Glocks I just don't see any reason to buy one over say a CZ 75, Beretta 92, 1911, or a Sig P226.....
Top pick for a indoor range only pistol would be a 9mm 1911... But I want more versatility for my money and I rarely shoot indoors. I've always struggled with spending the cash on a 9mm 1911.

I'd go with a Glock instead of any pistol listed in post one - they're better all-purpose all-weather options for less money than most. They also have more capacity, less weight, and are plenty durable. I like them fine for the range too. The parts are inexpensive, simple, drop-in, available all over, and the triggers are easily improved.

But yea, I think metal makes a better heirloom piece and range toy.
Dashunde is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 10:59 PM   #17
vyse.04
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 10, 2011
Location: Illinois
Posts: 538
I prefer metal frames to polymer, but I do own both types. I don't think Glocks are anywhere near as hard to shoot as people make them out to be. Every model I have fired (only four) have been as accurate as I can shoot, and they ranged from 9mm to .45 ACP & GAP... subcompact to full-sized.
vyse.04 is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 11:42 PM   #18
MBRookie
Junior Member
 
Join Date: April 8, 2012
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Posts: 3
After thirty years with Glock, I don't think you have to choose based on the polymer or metal frame. All pistols you named are proven good a reliable. I think the decision should be based on grip, trigger and confidence. You may no carry, but may be same day you'll have to use it for self defense at home.
MBRookie is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 12:01 AM   #19
JohnKSa
Staff
 
Join Date: February 12, 2001
Location: DFW Area
Posts: 18,568
Honestly, the only times I stop to consider frame material when contemplating a purchase are as follows:

If the gun is likely to be shot a LOT, I tend to shy away from aluminum frames a little.

If the gun is intended for carry, I tend to shy away from steel frames unless the gun is very small.

The rest of the time, I'm much more concerned with other aspects of the firearm* and don't really care about the frame material at all.

*Things like how the gun feels in my hand, how well I shoot it, how easy it is to clean, durability, available accessories and expense of accessories, ease of diassembly, manual of arms, accuracy, reliability, etc., etc.
__________________
Did you know that there is a TEXAS State Rifle Association?
JohnKSa is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 12:01 AM   #20
sigcurious
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 25, 2011
Posts: 1,755
Quote:
In recent time he has fired Kimber 1911 (9mm Target), Ruger 22/45, Colt 1903 and a classic S&W 38 special revolver. I may be stering him in the direction of guns I would likely want to own. But I think the Glock-Heads have done the same. Just want to make sure he goes for him. He probably ont buy the night he finds the gun he wants.
I'd say get him to the range again to rent a bit more variety, regardless of what you like or others like, your friend will be happiest if he gets something that fits his hand well and has trigger mechanics he likes, whether it is a poly or metal semi, or a revolver.

He may not want to/be able to spend to try all the variations, but you can help him pick a few that cover the general bases between trigger types and grip ergos(size and angle) to get him an idea of what works for him and then help him do a final round of rentals or fondling.
sigcurious is online now  
Old September 6, 2012, 02:11 AM   #21
marine6680
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 24, 2012
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1,513
What feels best in hand and is enjoyed the most when shooting is the best choice.

Because you do not have to consider the possibility of CC, then you do not have to compromise things for the sake of concealability. So whatever he shoots best and likes best in hand and under recoil is the best choice for him.


As far as my choices:

For a range toy and self defense in the home... My two CZs are my go to... I love those pistols. The only pistol I have ever enjoyed shooting more is a smooth running 1911 with a really good trigger. (though I have shot and enjoyed a great many pistols... don't think I disliked any I fired )

As far as carry... I like the small single stack 9mm pistols. (like the LC9, or PPS) The new XDs looks good as well. I wear light shirts all the time, even in winter I wear t-shirts almost exclusively, so they work best for me. Though in winter, I have a jacket, so a small Sub-compact XD would work as a carry piece.
marine6680 is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 04:42 AM   #22
youngunz4life
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2010
Location: United States of America
Posts: 1,877
metal
__________________
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" -Admiral Farragut @ Battle of Mobile Bay 05AUG1864
youngunz4life is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 06:18 AM   #23
4V50 Gary
Staff
 
Join Date: November 2, 1998
Location: Colorado
Posts: 17,071
Quote:
What feels best in hand and is enjoyed the most when shooting is the best choice.
I agree. It's up to the individual.
__________________
Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. Molon Labe!
4V50 Gary is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 08:22 AM   #24
dgludwig
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 12, 2005
Location: North central Ohio
Posts: 5,182
I told him, no issues that I know of with Glocks I just dont see any reason to buy one over say a CZ 75, Beretta 92, 1911, or a Sig P226.....or a Smith&Wesson Model 5906...
__________________
ONLY AN ARMED PEOPLE CAN BE TRULY FREE ; ONLY AN UNARMED PEOPLE CAN EVER BE ENSLAVED
...Aristotle
NRA Benefactor Life Member
dgludwig is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 10:32 AM   #25
Constantine
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 5, 2010
Location: Miami, Florida
Posts: 5,235
lol @ this not being a versus thread.

They're both great..the only reason why lately I'm carrying a G19 more is cause it holds more rounds and it's lighter.

It's a recent thing that I carry a gun this small..Yes...I said it, small. I've always been a full sized carrying guy.

Bought the Kahr CW9 but it's not for me. Might even sell it soon. o.O

Love my all steel guns. I CAN and do carry my 1911's and SIG. But lately I don't go out as much. Not a big deal to me anymore.

Both are great. Just depends on the person. Everyone has their own individual reasoning and liking's.

This is a pretty civil versus thread so far.
__________________
Sáncte Míchael Archángele, defénde nos in proélio, cóntra nequítiam et insídias diáboli ésto præsídium. Ímperet ílli Déus, súpplices deprecámur: tuque, prínceps milítiæ cæléstis, Sátanam aliósque spíritus malígnos, qui ad perditiónem animárum pervagántur in múndo, divína virtúte, in inférnum detrúde. Ámen
Constantine is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:22 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.13629 seconds with 9 queries