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Old September 27, 2012, 01:50 AM   #26
ronz
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Would like to give pan lubing another shot if anyone knows a recipe that should work good with this round and I can get the ingredients locally or recommend one to buy
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Old September 27, 2012, 04:41 PM   #27
Gerry
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ronz, I can do pan lubing more than twice, maybe 3 times as fast as I can lube-size with a Lyman 4500. I posted the procedure of how I do pan lubing somewhere here and I'll see if I can find it later and follow up on this thread.

The recipe I use is about half and half by weight bees wax and moly high-pressure black grease. If bees wax isn't in your area, you can buy it from the person on eBay who sells it as "triple filtered" one pound blocks. $50 worth of blocks (12 blocks if I remember right) gives you a lifetime supply. The grease you might have already in your own garage.

There are a lot of silly hokey things people put into their bullet lube cauldrons, like eyes of newts, and toes of frogs, wool of bats, and tongue of dogs. I suggest keeping it simple and save your wife's Crisco shortening for making pies with.
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Old September 27, 2012, 05:03 PM   #28
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Ordered my casting stuff from Natchez Monday, it arrived this afternoon. Really quick service and good prices. And, they had everything in stock.
I got the Lee 4-20 pot, the 358/125/RF mold, the TL452-230-TC mold and the 357 and 452 sizing kits. Still have some misc tools, etc to pick up, but pretty much there. It will be a week or two before I can get to casting though as my wife is going into the hospital Monday morning early.
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Old September 27, 2012, 09:13 PM   #29
ronz
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Thanks Gerry found a lot of good info on how to do it but no idea witch recipe would be a good one to try
Was out looking for the ingredients for one today but all I got was strange looks when I asked where the wild boar tallow and sperm whale oil was (I really did ask for the sperm whale oil)
Wife has to go to a safety class for the range tonight so hopefully there will be enough time to get to a craft store for the bees wax yet tonight
Oops didn’t hit post but have the bees wax 1lb and some black wheel bearing grease in the garage so should be able to make up some more lube to try tomorrow
Dick are you using ww or have lead if not can pm you where I got mine from
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Old September 27, 2012, 10:10 PM   #30
dickttx
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I recently got about 30# of range lead that a guy has been mining at our range, smelting, and pouring into ingots. He said it running 10/12 bn.
I also have about 20# of #2 alloy ingots from about 40 years ago, and about 25# of linotype from the same era. I haven't made a big effort yet to acquire any. I thought I would go ahead and get my equipment and start with the range lead. It is nice and clean, so I don't have to worry about smelting equipment yet. I also have been mining range lead from my pond dam and have several pounds so far.
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Old October 2, 2012, 02:25 AM   #31
ronz
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The bees wax and grease didn’t work
The ad .357 are over 2 weeks old now going to make up some the same as the tok bullets and give them a try pretty sure they will work fine
I’m going to try a pan lube of 2 oz paraffin 2 oz bees wax 4 oz petroleum jelly 2 oz lee liquid alox & 2 tablespoons jpw size to .309/.357 then tumble with 45-45-10
Hope this works been spending most of my time at the range testing and doing load work ups
Really need to just go just to have fun so if this don’t work going to take a break for a while
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Old October 2, 2012, 04:01 PM   #32
Gerry
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ronz, what do you mean the beeswax and grease didn't work? I'm curious because this is a pretty basic recipe. Not much can go wrong I thought...
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Old October 2, 2012, 04:32 PM   #33
Mike / Tx
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Ronz,

I'm not trying to rain on your parade, but looking at what you are planning to mix up, well it seems like way more work than is necessary.

If you are going to pan lube, and want something that is plenty easy to use and not overly expensive and will work right off the bat, I highly suggest looking up White Label Lubes. Either contact Glen first and explain what your looking at doing and ask what they recommend, or read through the different descriptions on his site and pick either Carnuba Red or BAC. Either one will cover your velocity range as well as probably one or two more.

As for the 45/45/10, I am really surprised that it isn't working on it's own, but could be several things which are keeping it from it.

I haven't topped 1800fps with it yet, but I have breached a solid 1750 using it through my Raging Bull in 454. While I don't normally run my loads that fast, I tested it simply to be sure that I wasn't going to have any issues if I did. I didn't want to find myself out in the middle of BFE in the country shooting up the hogs and have my barrel fill up with lead I wouldn't be able to get out until I got home.

Anyway, if you want to try out some of the lubes that White Label sells, you can also ask them to send you a sample. While it won't be enough to do a bunch of bullets, it is enough to find out if it works or not. I think they sent me a piece of a stick of CR which was about 2-3" long, and the same with the BAC. Both worked really well but I liked how the CR was more or less dry to the touch rather than tacky feeling. I tried it in a couple of loads through my 454 and then purchased probably enough to last me several years. (especially since I haven't used it on anything yet) My plan is to use it for some cast bullets in my Contender's. I have a 7x30 Waters, several .357's, a 44 mag, and a 30-30 AI that I am doing a bit of research on to decide which mold I want to get for it.

So I guess the jest of all this is the KISS theory, or the more basic it is the easier it is to use.
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Old October 2, 2012, 07:15 PM   #34
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I'm going to guess that the leading is coming from the bullets being too small. Once I got several of my custum molds that dropped bigger bullets(so I could size plenty over my barrels) all my leading went away.The lube is just helping it out. You never said where the leading is in the barrel, this last time,near the chamber or the muzzle?
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Old October 2, 2012, 09:35 PM   #35
ronz
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Gerry I might have used the wrong grease I had a can of black wheel bearing grease so mixed that 50/50 by weight with bees wax it leaded worse than with just lla
Mike don’t know why I didn’t think to look at WLL checked cabalas grafs midway & widens seemed everything was made for lube sizers only pan lube I could find was for black powder
For some reason I almost never start out the easy way if I did I definitely wouldn’t have started casting for a tokerav I knew it was one of the more difficult rounds before I started
think the 45-45-10 didn’t work because the bullet has to be cast smaller than the barrel it did work gooped on to fill the lube groves but also gunked up the dies real quick I was even pulling out bullets to wipe off some of the excess lube between seating and crimping
I picked this lube because it had the ingredients that are used in 45-45-10
made up a batch of it today and have 30 bullets lubed and ready to be sized also going to tl them with 45-45-10 going for over kill when the tumble lube wears off will have something close in the lube groves to take over hopefully it will work that way
I didn’t follow the recipe exactly and goofed up and put in too much lla so added more wax to make up for that used 7oz bees wax 4oz paraffin 4 oz petroleum jelly 4oz of lla and 2 tablespoons of cooked down jpw
I got a lube recipe from someone that casts for tokarevs at cb its 50% beeswax, 40% crisco, 10% lanolin
Hopefully I won’t need to try it the one I made today seems pretty good it’s kind of hard but still elastic probably won’t be able to test it until Thursday
Sidewinder for some reason tokeravs wont chamber a properly sized round
The leading was the worst by the muzzle but also started sooner with grease /bees wax
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Old October 2, 2012, 09:56 PM   #36
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You can just melt the "lubrisizer" lubes in a pan and use them for pan lubing also. Just don't cook'em to much. I found Caranuba Red and Lymans Moly lube + Johnson Paste Wax(used to soften) mix worked good , it kept the CR from being too hard. I added other stuff, just to see what it did
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Old October 4, 2012, 10:54 PM   #37
ronz
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Lube & 45-45-10 worked only a little leading with the tokarev and almost none with the 9mm
Ran 20 through each they functioned fine just need to do a load work up to find what works best for the tokarev was using a similar bullet I bought at a lgs for the 9 but get a lot less leading with my bullets
Have a bunch of 45-45-10 only ready to load and test for the 9 but still might lube them the same as the tok I know that it’s enough lube but just looks so wrong not having anything in the grease grove
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