The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Hunt

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 4, 2012, 08:18 AM   #1
PTS1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2006
Posts: 246
Mountain Lion inside my city!

Local police shot and killed a mountain lion roaming the center of my city Friday night. I live in Del Rio, Texas, which is on the border of Mexico about 150 miles due west of San Antonio. Population is 40,000. Kinda scary. Here is the link and article:

http://delrionewsherald.com/news/art...9bb2963f4.html



Officers shoot mountain lion
Jennifer Killin | Posted: Sunday, September 2, 2012 12:59 am

A mountain lion that wandered into town overnight Friday was shot and killed by police at the Del Rio Freshman Campus.

The cat, also known as a cougar, panther, catamount or puma, was first spotted on 14th Street and Avenue D before midnight.

Witnesses told police the mountain lion (scientific name, puma concolor) jumped onto vehicles and pawed at houses before darting away.

Del Rio Police officers first caught up to the animal on 17th Street near the Dink Wardlaw Building. Fearing for the safety of the general public, officers took shots at the cat, which Interim Police Chief Fred Knoll said weighed between 125-140 pounds.

The cat then ran north and officers again tried to stop it near the North Heights Elementary campus on Main Street. The final shots were fired at the animal at the Freshman Campus, where it died. Knoll said the cat was shot about six times.

“Normally, when you shoot an animal like this they go down with the first shot, but this one kept running,” Knoll said. “Our concern is for the safety of the general public and having this cat in town is very unusual.”

Mountain lions are described as solitary animals that primarily reside in remote areas of West Texas, according to the Texas Parks and Wildlife website.

Game Warden Capt. Marco Alvizo said because the cat was not making an attempt to leave town the decision was made to kill the animal rather than tranquilize or trap it.

The drought could be to blame for the cat’s venture into city limits, said Christine Foley, a professor of biology at Southwest Texas Junior College.

“The extended drought is rough on the wildlife,” Foley said. “The lack of water in the area will bring the lions into town for an easy meal of dogs and cats.”

Because the animal did not attack, no tests are being conducted on the cat, which was disposed of at the city landfill, Alvizo said.

Knoll said there is no evidence that any more cats are lingering around town, but is urging residents to take precautions, and immediately report any sightings to police.

Mountain lion attacks are rare, according to the Parks and Wildlife website. Since 1980, only four attacks on humans have been reported in Texas, all of them in remote areas of West Texas.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 5042f5f676c2b_preview-300.jpg (17.9 KB, 86 views)
PTS1 is offline  
Old September 4, 2012, 11:45 AM   #2
Don H
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 8, 2000
Location: SLC,Utah
Posts: 2,705
Mountain lions are being seen in more and more metropolitan areas. Last year, several mountain lions were seen within the Sacramento, CA, city limits and Sacramento, with a population of just under half a million (just under 2 million for Greater Sacramento), is a fairly urban setting. Lions are following the undeveloped belts along the two rivers that run through the urban area. Just a matter of time before somebody or their pet becomes dinner.
Don H is offline  
Old September 4, 2012, 09:58 PM   #3
swopjan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 12, 2011
Posts: 156
Six shots? What were they shooting it with, their sidearms?
swopjan is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 06:25 AM   #4
mete
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 14, 2004
Location: NY State
Posts: 5,281
The cat recently caught in Reno was trying to get into the Harrahs Casino !
__________________
And Watson , bring your revolver !
mete is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 11:23 AM   #5
PTS1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2006
Posts: 246
Code:
Six shots? What were they shooting it with, their sidearms?

Yes they were and as the smoke had cleared with this story, the cat was shot at 6 times and hit twice.

Here is another pic of the cat.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg lion.jpg (225.5 KB, 104 views)
PTS1 is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 01:13 PM   #6
Grant D
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 14, 2011
Location: Brazos County, Texas
Posts: 756
A few years back,my wife and I were staying in downtown Sturgis at a friends house for the rally,and someone ran over a mountain lion on Lazzelle st. which is the main drag through town.
A million motorcycles around, and the wildlife would still come into town at night.
Every night when we came home, there was five or six deer in the yard by our tent,They came out of the hills at night to eat apples from the trees in the yard.
You could almost get close enough to touch them.
Grant D is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 04:56 PM   #7
twobit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 25, 2010
Location: Coyote Creak, SW Texas
Posts: 551
Del Rio area is surrounded by Mountain Lion country. It would not be that unusual for a Cougar to be in the town looking for an easy meal of a cat or dog. Not too far away, months ago, someone ran over a black bear near Brackettville east of Del Rio on the highway (US 90).
__________________
Twobit,
LEO, NRA member, Native Texan. Shooting and hunting for over 49 years!
twobit is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 07:36 PM   #8
swopjan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 12, 2011
Posts: 156
Quote:
Yes they were and as the smoke had cleared with this story, the cat was shot at 6 times and hit twice.
That makes me mad What sort of fool thinks a handgun (9mm or .40 I mean, as I suspect their sidearms are) is the way to put down a loose cougar? You have time to get a long arm, it's not like a cougar is shooting back at you I need an angrier smiley.

I guess I'll try to reserve judgement (too late..), as I wasn't there, but I'm 99% sure this could have been handled better.
swopjan is offline  
Old September 5, 2012, 07:49 PM   #9
TheGoldenState
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 8, 2010
Posts: 1,191
Quote:
That makes me mad What sort of fool thinks a handgun (9mm or .40 I mean, as I suspect their sidearms are) is the way to put down a loose cougar? You have time to get a long arm, it's not like a cougar is shooting back at you I need an angrier smiley.
They were close to have used their sidearms. And 9mm or .40 is plenty fine for the thinned skin cat, esp. as small as that one.

It's the missing that's important.

Also, if a dog bites someone and is running around the town, it almost always gets shot (with whatever the officers have on them/in car), it's all too easy to assume the protocol there is the same, and a wild/dangerous mountain lion is put down at first opportunity, with whatever means the first officer has available.

There are times when the vehicle itself is used.
__________________
The Day You Get Comfortable Is The Day You Get Careless...
TheGoldenState is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 07:11 AM   #10
MJN77
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 27, 2009
Location: on a hill in West Virginia
Posts: 675
Quote:
That makes me mad What sort of fool thinks a handgun (9mm or .40 I mean, as I suspect their sidearms are) is the way to put down a loose cougar?
It's dead isn't it?
MJN77 is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 07:40 AM   #11
Skadoosh
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 13, 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,772
Quote:
Swopjan commented: What sort of fool thinks a handgun (9mm or .40 I mean, as I suspect their sidearms are) is the way to put down a loose cougar
A 9mm or 40 is enough to put down a human, and its enough to put down a mountain lion. Plenty of humans are shot with 9mm and 40's and live to tell about it. So just as it is with humans (and in this case, cougars), shot placement is paramount.
__________________
NRA Life Member (2003)
USN Retired
I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
Skadoosh is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 07:53 AM   #12
hogdogs
Staff In Memoriam
 
Join Date: October 31, 2007
Location: Western Florida panhandle
Posts: 11,071
I would gladly use my .22 Rem-Win-Sav-Lin repeater in a heartbeat against a puma...

Size of caliber doesn't bother me at all... It is the irresponsible use of firearms inaccurately I got issues with...

Do they teach, in LEO class, that their bullets are magic and will only do harm to the INTENDED TARGET and collateral damage isn't a risk for them???

A 30% success rate on slowing your payloads of lead is a dismal, frightening failure...

Someone needs to learn how to hit their target... That is, after all, Gun Control...

Brent
hogdogs is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 02:32 PM   #13
Wyoredman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 6, 2011
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 1,234
Here is a link to the Lion of Lander. Picture was taken in my hometown yesterday. The darn cat made his escape, people are worried about their dogs and kids!

http://county10.com/2012/09/05/polic...ted-in-lander/
__________________
Go Pokes!
Go Rams!
Wyoredman is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 02:41 PM   #14
armoredman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2007
Location: Arizona
Posts: 3,737
Considering the location, I'd rather have a lion than armed cartel members running loose! I heard old cougar hunters would use a 22lr on lions, but that was with treed cats and dogs. I'd use whatever I had on me, as well, to take care of a mountain lion - no patrol carbines or riot guns in squad cars in this town?
__________________
http://czfirearms.us/ same original CZForum, new location.
armoredman is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 02:44 PM   #15
Art Eatman
Staff Lead
 
Join Date: November 13, 1998
Location: Terlingua, TX, USA
Posts: 22,332
This seems odd to me: "Witnesses told police the mountain lion (scientific name, puma concolor) jumped onto vehicles and pawed at houses before darting away."

Without that, I don't really see much need to kill the cat. I'd normally expect it to move away from people, and head back to the boonies--or, at most, some park. Although, there aren't many parkland areas in Del Rio.

But that was seriously abnormal, odd-ball behavior...
__________________
You're from BATFE? Come right in! I use all your fine products!
Art Eatman is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 04:36 PM   #16
PTS1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2006
Posts: 246
To my knowledge, the cops only have their sidearms and a shotgun in the patrol car. I know for sure they have some ARs at the station, but not sure if they carry them on patrol. As to armed cartel members, there are plenty of them a couple of miles west of us on the other side of the river but Del Rio itself is very safe due to the big presence of Border Patrol and military (Laughlin AFB).
PTS1 is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 10:02 PM   #17
Willis
Member
 
Join Date: June 14, 2005
Location: Montana
Posts: 37
Mountain Lion

Last month I bought a trail camera. I wanted to test it so I set it up behind my house and on the fourth or fifth night I got a picture of a mountain lion. It was outside of the flash range so it was gust an outline, but it was a lion. He was about 60 feet from my back door. I still have the camera out there, if I get a good picture I will post it.

Willis
Willis is offline  
Old September 6, 2012, 10:07 PM   #18
fatwhiteboy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 3, 2011
Posts: 301
Mountain Lion? Or Jaguar? Do you still have the picture?
__________________
Fat White
So Cal
fatwhiteboy is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 06:56 AM   #19
swopjan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 12, 2011
Posts: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by hogdogs
I would gladly use my .22 Rem-Win-Sav-Lin repeater in a heartbeat against a puma...

Size of caliber doesn't bother me at all... It is the irresponsible use of firearms inaccurately I got issues with...
This is what I have the biggest problem with also. As for size of caliber, the cougar was shot in the chest, not the head, in which case I think caliber would be a bit more important as well.

How many of you would hunt deer with a 9mm or .40? How many places is it legal? There are reasons most handgun hunting is done with larger caliber, longer-barreled pistols than the typical service pistol. They hit harder and are easier to hit with for most people. If they had a rifle or shotgun it should have been the go-to weapon, instead of sending 4 superfluous rounds into who knows what places. If they only had service pistols, well, I can only assume their training regime isn't as thorough as I would like for a person who straps on a gun every day, especially as the cougar was not reported to be shooting back or otherwise mauling anybody. Then again, maybe the first shot was good, the next four missed a running cougar, and the last bullet hit and did the trick, I don't know. But somehow I doubt that was the case.
swopjan is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 12:33 PM   #20
Art Eatman
Staff Lead
 
Join Date: November 13, 1998
Location: Terlingua, TX, USA
Posts: 22,332
Look: The cat was behaving oddly, and the idea--as near as I can tell from the article--was to kill it ASAP. We don't know if anything was readily available besides normal-carry handguns. Folks in a hurry don't always stop to think things through. To speculate, maybe all that was available to any officer was a shotgun and he didn't stop to go back to retrieve it from the car.

Worrying about "What gun (cartridge)" is beating a dead horse. Forum members here are supposed to be at least partly clued-in.

Shame it went to the garbage pit, and that nobody popped for the taxidermist fee. Cougar hides make nice rugs. Mine's draped over the back of the couch.
__________________
You're from BATFE? Come right in! I use all your fine products!
Art Eatman is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 03:24 PM   #21
hogdogs
Staff In Memoriam
 
Join Date: October 31, 2007
Location: Western Florida panhandle
Posts: 11,071
Yeah, I was surprised how many feel a 9mm, .40 or even the .45acp isn't adequate but have no issues with all the lead missing the target...

Brent
hogdogs is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 04:55 PM   #22
scrubcedar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 3, 2012
Location: Southwestern Colorado
Posts: 478
I carried a Single Six with the .22mag cyl in for protection against cougars(and snakes) for years.

Hung around out in the scrub land, where cougar encounters were fairly normal, with a bunch of ranchers kids. These kids had quite a bit of knowledge about the cats having been around them all of their lives and no one (including me) felt I was undergunned.
This actually would have been an issue because of how frequently we were in the arroyo's where they love to hunt from above and had to protect each others backs. People and livestock were routinely stalked by these cats. You would be walking back to the truck or house and run across the tracks where one was stalking you, hoping one of you ended up alone. It gave you the shivers sometimes when the tracks indicated a big one you knew could take you down.
The officers side arms were more than adequate. The problem was almost certainly that this turned into a persuit type fight.
When we encountered cougars they always seemed to want a clear path to attack you and we saw them at that point. Head shots with a .22mag from that distance while they were still, no problem. Once they realized that we were aware of them they just weren't interested in a fight.
This cat was probably just trying to get away. What a shame they didn't have time to tranquilize it, rehab it, and release it. I don't really like cougars, but its kind of a shame to see one of my old enemies starving then dying scared to death in city. It's a tough old world sometimes
__________________
Gaily bedight, A gallant knight In sunshine and in shadow, Had journeyed long, Singing a song, In search of El Dorado
scrubcedar is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 08:19 PM   #23
sc928porsche
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 29, 2008
Location: now living in alabama
Posts: 2,433
Those cats have been found in Sacramento more than once. There was a woman who was attacked by one on the American river access. She was jogging in the park.
__________________
No such thing as a stupid question. What is stupid is not asking it.
sc928porsche is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 09:10 PM   #24
scrubcedar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 3, 2012
Location: Southwestern Colorado
Posts: 478
Sc928, we used to have that happen fairly regularly in a suburb of the Denver area called Roxborough park. Ritzy neighborhood that extended up into the foothills. Prime cougar territory. Some 120lb trophy wife would jog past a hidden cougar and surprise surprise they would be attacked. Like pulling a shoelace past a house cat, geez. We called these women by their correct title VOLUNTEERS! If you are going to build your house in the woods what do you expect?
__________________
Gaily bedight, A gallant knight In sunshine and in shadow, Had journeyed long, Singing a song, In search of El Dorado
scrubcedar is offline  
Old September 7, 2012, 09:33 PM   #25
Pilot
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 21, 2000
Posts: 3,622
Lots of them just outside of Boulder, CO in the foothills. They've had lots of scrapes with bikers, joggers, hikers, etc.
__________________
Pilot
Pilot is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:43 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.13515 seconds with 8 queries