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Old August 28, 2012, 10:42 AM   #1
silvrjeepr
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Cartridge explodes from squeezing

So I'm watching news channel 3 in Memphis this morning when I hear that a child has been sent to the hospital with burns and damage to his hand. The report says the child squeezed a cartridge and made it fire in his hand. Okay so I'm not buying that for a second, but I'm curious to know if anyone would know how something like this could happen.

Oh and of course the news reported that he squeezed a "bullet"...

Any thoughts?
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Old August 28, 2012, 11:01 AM   #2
BillCA
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Do you have a link to the story? I could not find it on Memphis Channel 3 news.

I'd call B.S. on the "headline" without some more information.
Metallic cartridges are stable and should not ignite when handled or even when crushed with a pair of pliers. And unless the "child" happens to lift serious weights I doubt he could actually crush a cartridge by hand (certainly not enough to cause ignition).

It's not impossible to occur, just very improbable. It would have to be an old cartridge, perhaps a corroded one or the child struck an blow to primer accidentally or intentionally without knowing what would happen.
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Old August 28, 2012, 11:03 AM   #3
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Was it Ironmans baby?
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Old August 28, 2012, 11:11 AM   #4
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The only way I can see a cartridge exploding when squeezed would be either:
Its a rimfire crushed in a tool or a vice.
Its a defective antique pinfire round.

Even then it probably wouldn't "explode" just pop the cap & burn strongly as there would be nothing to hold the pressure in & allow the burning rate to accelerate.

Do you have any more details, It sounds like either badly written with false info or utter hogwash so far?

A quick Google search found nothing on this BTW.
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Old August 28, 2012, 11:14 AM   #5
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Either it hasn't hit the Memphis Channel 3 website yet, or their search feature is horribly borked.
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Old August 28, 2012, 11:18 AM   #6
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http://frrole.com/o/more-information...nnews5-memphis

Yes I could but this is a though crowd, most of my experience with accidents happened before the Internet, and, always with help.

I shared an experience in the early development of the Internet, seems the forum I was participating on was socially dysfunctional, one of the members on the forum told me “it can not happen that way” I responded with “if I tell you a chicken dips snuff, do not argue, all you have to do is pick up its little wings to determine which side she carries her can on” .

This sent him into the curb.

I have no ideal the bullet pictured on the link is related, I suspect what ever got him also hit the bullet with the big dent, and a reloader with a very bad habit carried his bullets to the firing range in a plastic baggie, he dropped the baggier. he almost bled to death before they got the bleeding stopped.



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Old August 28, 2012, 12:11 PM   #7
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My experience with rounds going off outside of a firearm is that it isn't the bullet that causes the damage, but the brass rupturing (gas pushes through the route of least resistance, and usually that is the brass).

I've seen the pics of the aftermath of a 50BMG round going off in a Soldier's hand after using a live round as a hammer to "tap in the pintle mount." Wasn't pretty.

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Old August 28, 2012, 01:06 PM   #8
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Sounds like the kid's story is just C.Y.A. to keep him out of trouble. In my shooting career I've been handling all types of small arms ammo since 1969. "Antique" rimire, WWII surplus, handgun ammo of undetermined age, totally fuzzed corroded ammo, and most other cartridge ammo. I have never had the experience of any ammo detonating/firing outside a gun without the primer being struck in some way (excepting a handful of .22 lr tossed into a fire), and never read/heard of a trustworthy report of any "spontanious firings". The kid's in trouble and trying to make it easier on him ("I didn't do nuttin', it jes blowed up in my hand" )
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Old August 28, 2012, 01:56 PM   #9
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My guess is he or someone else was playing with a gun and he ended up getting shot in his hand.

How gullible would we be to believe that story as presented?
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Old August 28, 2012, 02:12 PM   #10
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Depends upon what the word "squeeze" means

Lunch says it depends upon what the word "squeeze" means

Maybe rapidly squeezed between the primer and the ground/a rock/ a hammer / other impacting/ squeezing device?
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Old August 28, 2012, 03:20 PM   #11
wogpotter
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Quote:
However, no weapon has been found. And there are still many details surrounding the incident that remain unknown.
But, but he squoze a "boolitt tip" & it went *bang* hurting him. Doesn't that make his 11 year old hand a weapon by definition?

There is a strong odur of stale cod about this tale & it's smelling more every minute. Either that or he's been doing something to massively increase the grasping & squeezing power beyond normal.
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Old August 28, 2012, 04:11 PM   #12
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Maybe it was one of those motar round bullets, they go off on revolutions.
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Old August 28, 2012, 06:13 PM   #13
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It would be interesting to know the extent of his injuries. That would reveal a lot about this incident.
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Old August 28, 2012, 06:26 PM   #14
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When I was in the sixth grade a local boy was killed while he was playing with a 30-06 round. According to his brother, he stood the round on it's base, on some concrete and hit the bullet with a hammer. The resulting shrapnel severed an artery and he bled out before the ambulance could get there. He said his brother had done this before with 22's, and they just went bang. I guess he figured it was safe because so far he had been lucky. So much for faulty reasoning and good parental supervision.
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Old August 28, 2012, 06:28 PM   #15
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Quote:
Maybe rapidly squeezed between the primer and the ground/a rock/ a hammer / other impacting/ squeezing device?
This!

Waving it around, pounding it on the ground or on other toys, yeah, I guess it could happen.
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Old August 28, 2012, 08:27 PM   #16
ky hunter
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Maybe he squeeze the trigger
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Old August 28, 2012, 08:44 PM   #17
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Sounds bogus to me--but a couple of years ago I would have said the same thing about hay squeezing and I have been educated about that now.................
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Old August 28, 2012, 08:51 PM   #18
BillCA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wogpotter
There is a strong odur of stale cod about this tale & it's smelling more every minute. Either that or he's been doing something to massively increase the grasping & squeezing power beyond normal.
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikld
The kid's in trouble and trying to make it easier on him ("I didn't do nuttin', it jes blowed up in my hand")
I have to concur. Whether it was a best friend showing off a gun or the kid pounded on a cartridge is almost irrelevant. I think it is more likely that we'll find some marks on the primer that indicate some kind of impact.

Also note, the story is on WMC TV-5 in Memphis, not channel 3.
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Old August 28, 2012, 09:45 PM   #19
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"Any thoughts? "

Yeah. BS. Squeezing simply won't do it, primers require an impact or heat and body temp sure won't do it either.

I've squeezed live primers in a vise to see if they will go off; didn't. (Yeah, I took proper safety precautions.) But no one will be able to see any marks on that primer, that thing will blow out and never be seen again.
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Old August 29, 2012, 02:49 AM   #20
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The News people reported cartridge detonated after a child squeezed it...hhuummm. Were these the same people who reported the gunman had a semiautomatic revolver?
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Old August 29, 2012, 04:00 AM   #21
Rich_73
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Here is a link with a video, primer is clearly hit with a firingpin like device. It looks as if even a nail would be hard to have been used so accurately centered.


http://www.wmctv.com/story/19399316/...ade-it-explode
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Old August 29, 2012, 05:31 AM   #22
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For the shell to fragment like that there must have been some serious pressure.
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Old August 29, 2012, 07:40 AM   #23
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I call B.S. Unless he was BAM BAM Rubble ; )
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Old August 29, 2012, 09:39 AM   #24
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Looking closely at the stills and video, it looks like:

there is clearly a firing pin dent on the primer;

there is clearly a dent on the bullet's nose that appears to have been from a substantial impact;

there are no rifling marks on the bullet;

the part of the bullet that was NOT inside the case appears to be slightly discolored;

the part of the bullet that was inside the case appears bright and shiny;

the inside of the case appears slightly discolored.

Conclusions:

The round was probably NOT fired by striking the primer. If it had been, then the primer would have in all likelihood blown out of the pocket in the case, and probably would have been pierced on the striking object if it was something like a nail.

The round may have been misfired and then ejected at some point in the past. It seems like the boy (or a friend) MIGHT have found it lying on the ground somewhere after it corroded a little. BUT, it is not clear how he could have set it off at a later time without a gun, and without getting enough pressure in the primer pocket to blow the primer out. PERHAPS striking the nose of the round on some hard object could have set the bullet back far and fast enough to set off the powder. But smokeless powder is not usually shock sensitive. And, a charge of black powder or a cartridge (remade) with a recovered bullet and a spent case using match heads should have left more residue. (But, maybe the shrapnell was washed for its photographic debute?) And, that does not explain the appearance of the bullet if it had been previously fired and recovered from a backstop.

OR, the round may have been dropped and corroded slightly, with or without having incurred the primer dent, then been found later by the boy. Then, the boy (and perhaps some of his friends) MIGHT have put the "old cartridge" in a gun to play with, pulled the trigger and gotten a HANG-FIRE, ejected the cartridge and picked it up before it blew. In that situation, it would probably have required a friend to hide the gun while the injured boy was dripping blood and easily tracked.

I am thinking that the second set of speculative events seems most probable.

The police need to keep looking for a gun, and probably another kid who has it, or at least had it at the time of the incident.

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Old August 29, 2012, 10:08 AM   #25
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It seems funny to me that the father still has the case and bullet! Wouldnt the police take it as evidence until they determined what happened to the boy?
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