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Old August 24, 2012, 09:47 PM   #1
presence
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1st AR... Sig556 or Sig M400

Cabelas has both of these on sale right now for 999.99. The original list of the m400 is 1100.00. The original list of the sig556 is 1700.00ish. Does that mean its a superior rifle? Don't know tons about ars yet but I'm excited to learn! All input would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!!
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Old August 24, 2012, 09:55 PM   #2
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It really boils down to... do you want a AR pattern direct gas impingement rifle, or do you want a gas piston operating system? I prefer DGI myself, but the 556 is a nice rifle, so... flip a coin.

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Old August 24, 2012, 10:13 PM   #3
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Thanks! Think I really want the traditional AR style DGI but the other seems like such a better deal...and I love deals!!

Could I put a quad rail on the m400? Can you pretty much swap all AR parts such as forearms, sights, buttstocks, etc?

Thanks again!!
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Old August 24, 2012, 11:47 PM   #4
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I'd be very surprised if Cabelas had the SIG 556 for 1K, that may be a mistake. The M400 seems like a good AR with nice extra features but I think you can do better for the price.
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Old August 25, 2012, 06:54 AM   #5
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Quote:
Could I put a quad rail on the m400? Can you pretty much swap all AR parts such as forearms, sights, buttstocks, etc?
Yes.

I just want to pass along a word of caution to you. My range buddy has a M400 that is simply the worst AR I've ever seen/shot. It can not get through a magazine without multiple failures. Different ammo/mags/ect... do not help and the malfunctions are inconsistent (fail to feed, fail to fire, fail to extract, ect..) so it's next to impossible to diagnose. It's on its' 3 trip to SIG currently---my guess is they'll just replace it. It may just be a lemon but man--I'll never buy a SIG AR after shooting that rifle.

To their credit---SIGs CS has apparently been great.

Just passing this story along for information purposes.
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Old August 25, 2012, 07:23 AM   #6
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Colt 6920 for $995
http://www.gtdist.com/ProductDetail....er=COLT-LE6920
I wouldn't take a SIG 556 for free
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Old August 25, 2012, 09:19 AM   #7
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While I wouldn't choose either of them given alternate choices. (See RT's post)

That being said, I would choose the AR pattern over the Sig 556 pattern if nothing else because the AR rifles lower receiver is the "firearm" which opens up tons of opportunities that just aren't available with other Evil Black Rifles.

If you decide you want something different in the future, caliber, barrel length, uber piston, etc, all you have to to is push out 2 pins and put a different upper on.

That completely leaves out the fact that most of the aftermarket "improvements" that are out there are geared towards the AR 1st.

I personally don't like the 556, even if it had an excellent quality record (which it doesn't) because it is very front heavy and the mag release is too far forward.
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Old August 25, 2012, 07:10 PM   #8
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sigs are typically a better, more rounded rifle... i would usually take a sig over an AR15... but the 556 i cant stand... the one thing it takes from the AR15 is its worst feature... that stupid straight magwell...

hmm.. try to find a sig 551-A1 if you can
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Old August 25, 2012, 07:28 PM   #9
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Quote:

hmm.. try to find a sig 551-A1 if you can
Umm...

Yeah.

Do you have access to one?

I have never even seen one in person.

You know, other than post dealer samples, they are one of the most rare rifles in the US.
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Old August 25, 2012, 07:31 PM   #10
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Not anymore, the A1 is the US market 551... about $1900 MSRP.

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Old August 25, 2012, 07:51 PM   #11
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i want a 551-A1... the sig as it was intended to be before they put that dumb magwell on it...

another rifle im anticipating coming out soon at a comparible price to mid-level AR15s is the CZ-805 bren which has a magwell, but its a curved magwell similar to the one on the G36 rifle... but the magwell can be removed to accept AK mags, AR15 mags, or G36 mags as well.. cant wait till it hits the US market...

and.. thats another option for the OP, save up and get something really cool like that.. but if i had to buy something now id get a 551-A1
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Old August 25, 2012, 07:55 PM   #12
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Not anymore, the A1 is the US market 551... about $1900 MSRP.
Oh.

I hope they do a better job on quality control than they did with the 556.

I haven't heard of the CZ gun before either.

Has it been combat tested or is it another looks really good on paper rifles?
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Old August 25, 2012, 08:02 PM   #13
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CZ-805 beat out the SCAR-L in czech military trials (but they could have been biased).. it has a reciprocating charger that could be switched to either side, monolothic rail system, short-stroke piston, folding/telescoping stock.. you know, all features typical to the modern family of rifles..

but the CZ-805 differs in the magwell actually comes off for complete caliber conversions including alternative magwells for different magazines... but instead of copying the AR almost entirely like these other rifles did, they looked at how they could make it better, so the standard magwell does allow for a fully curved magazine with fewer feeding issues than AR mags to be used.. however, for compatibility they sell a STANAG magwell as well

i have a lot of respect for czech engineering... theyre as cutting edge as any other company out there, makes some amazing handguns, and their stuff seems to be on par with H&K in features and quality but CZ cares about the civilian market as well and tends to sell all their stuff to civilians here, and in their own countries (gun laws in CZ are very american-like, and people can buy these, AKs, AR15s, etc there)

so.. if the OP was willing to wait.. id give this rifle a shot.. i cant wait to get my hands on one myself and am even setting aside some money for when it comes out for civilians
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Old August 26, 2012, 06:16 PM   #14
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Quote:
CZ-805 beat out the SCAR-L in czech military trials (but they could have been biased).. it has a reciprocating charger that could be switched to either side, monolothic rail system, short-stroke piston, folding/telescoping stock.. you know, all features typical to the modern family of rifles..
Wow. Jason, you have an ETA?

OP I just went to Cabelas online and I was unable to find that SIG 556 on their website for sale.
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Old August 26, 2012, 06:25 PM   #15
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I'm with the flip a coin philosophy on these two. Whichever you buy you will be getting a good rifle.

The CZ 805 look nice till I read the words polymer lower. I am going to let history be the judge on that for a while I have seen some broken ones and some that work just fine. This design could be just fine and could have some problems.
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Old August 26, 2012, 06:53 PM   #16
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Both of the choices you mentioned are good rifles, but I slightly favor the M400 because it is the traditional AR platform in DGI.
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Old August 26, 2012, 10:47 PM   #17
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Presence, if you really want an "AR-type" rifle, the SIG 556 (and 551), should not be on your list. Both are based on the Kalashnikov. Think of them as "Civilized AKs", and not ARs. If it were ME, I'd get one of each, as I like both gas/bolt systems

Each has different advantages and weaknesses (which have been debated at length in many forums), but both are a hoot to shoot! AK-type is easier to clean after shooting.
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Old August 27, 2012, 04:20 AM   #18
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I been eyeing that CZ 805 as well. Looks similar to the SCAR... but I would bet it sells for under $2000.

I love my CZ pistols, and would not hesitate in buying the 805. I am even eyeing the 527 carbine bolt action in 7.62x39 as a general purpose bolt gun.

I just need to know when they are going to bring out the 805.

CZ has a history of outstanding firearm designs and manufacturing.
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Old August 27, 2012, 10:30 AM   #19
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the CZ805 is sort of a SCAR mixed with a G36.. and like the G36 (unlike the SCAR) has interchangable magwells, so when you convert one to lets say 7.62x39mm, you can swap the magwell and use AK magazines as well

as for the polymer lower though.. its not new, and plenty of battle-proven rifles do it... the HK G3 rifles had a polymer lower for a while... the lower does little more than hold onto the trigger group and magazine, all the actions in the upper

---

but... for something out there now id look into the 551-A1
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Old August 27, 2012, 02:16 PM   #20
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The SIG 556 is a great gun, a bit front heavy but many pistol guns are front heavy. It is a little harder to find accessories and you spend a little extra money "AR-ING" it up but its well worth it if you ask me.

The M400 is also a good gun, I've read very few bad things about it. If you ask me though they are a little overpriced right now. A year ago I could get a basic M400 for $800.00. Now I am talking more like $910-920, for the $180.00 extra I can go buy a colt LE6920.
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Old August 27, 2012, 04:12 PM   #21
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As others have stated I'd look at something else. If you want something "different" than the standard AR platform you have a lot of choices. Some may be a bit pricey - but in this world you get what you pay for.
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Old August 28, 2012, 07:56 AM   #22
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The CZ 805 look nice till I read the words polymer lower. I am going to let history be the judge on that for a while I have seen some broken ones and some that work just fine. This design could be just fine and could have some problems.
There is a big difference between firearms that were designed from the start to have polymer lower recievers (H&K G36, FN SCAR) and those "budget" polymer lowers you can buy for an AR-15.
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Old August 28, 2012, 04:16 PM   #23
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Try this...

http://www.cabelas.com/semiautomatic...rifles-3.shtml

I guess it's not that great of a deal, saw one at a local gun store for 1100.

Thanks for all the info. I really don't know what direction I'll go in!
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Old August 29, 2012, 03:12 PM   #24
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First Question: Is 5.56 really the caliber you want in a semi-auto military style rifle?

Second Question: If you had to buy a motorcycle, would you want a Harley over most other motorcycles.

If you answered "no" to #1, then don't buy an AR - keep looking.
If you answered "yes" to #1, and "yes" to #2, then buy an AR.
If you answered "yes" to #1 and "heck no" to #2, then buy a Scar-15, Sig 556, MSAR or Aug style rifle, or Mini-14.
If you answered "yes" to #1 and "yes" to #2 - buy an AR-15.
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