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Old March 28, 2012, 05:21 PM   #1
thealex
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Shell Hangup in sizing die with Hornady lnl ap

Has anybody else experienced when the ram travels up more often than not the shell hits the side of the sizing die and hangs up.
I am loading .45 acp and .44 rem. It does it often with the .45 and more with the .44.
I called Hornady and they sent me a new shellplate no questions asked but that did not fix it.(only the .45 plate.)
Is it because I am using RCBS carbide dies???
It indexes properly.

Any thoughts would be great. The press works great other than this. Thanks. Alex
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Old March 28, 2012, 08:00 PM   #2
m&p45acp10+1
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I doubt it is the dies. I have no experience with progressive presses so I am sure some of the other folks here that do will chime in with some awnsers.
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Old March 28, 2012, 08:27 PM   #3
ScottRiqui
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Can you prevent it 100% by pressing the shell into the shell holder as you raise the ram? My Lee #4 shell holder (the one recommended for .380 ACP) seems a touch oversized for the .380 case, and the case will sometimes wiggle out of position a little bit while I'm raising the ram, causing it to bind up going into the sizing die.
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Old March 29, 2012, 07:04 AM   #4
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sounds like your pawl adjustment is off. I am very surprised the Hornady rep did not mention this when you called them. I am pretty sure there is a segment on the DvD which came with your machine that demonstrates this and how to correct it. The pawls wear with age and require adjustment every now and then
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Old March 29, 2012, 08:21 AM   #5
higgite
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Is it only hanging up on the sizing die and none of the other dies? Are you sure it's hanging up on the side of the die and not on a crooked decapping pin?
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Old March 29, 2012, 11:18 AM   #6
FlyFish
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This issue has been discussed several times on various forums. I have the same problem, as do many others. The problem appears to be when the retaining spring rises to push against the case rim as the shellplate moves to the resizing station, tipping the case mouth out (i.e., away from the hub) enough to allow the mouth to catch on the entrance to the sizing die.

The root cause(s) seem to be a combination of slightly more clearance under the shellplate than is necessary for the case rim to slide in/out, which is what leads to the tipping, combined with certain brands of dies that have less relief (radius) at their entrance. In my experience, RCBS dies in particular have this problem (great dies otherwise - just not optimal for the LnL AP).

One fix that I've read about, which I'd call more of a kludge, is to stretch the retaining spring so it doesn't press so much against the case rim. I've also heard of reloaders with lathes, and the knowledge to use them, who've taken a bit off the base of the shellholder so as to decrease the clearance where the shells fit in, but I don't know how well that works. Alternatively, I've found that I've gotten pretty good at keeping my left index finger ready to push misbehaving shells back into alignment as they enter the resizing die for those calibers that are particularly problematical for me.
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Old March 29, 2012, 11:36 AM   #7
thealex
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Yes the pawls are adjusted. I had to adjust 1 when i got it. This press is about 3 weeks old.
The lathe idea had crossed my mind as i do have one. My problem is the spring doesnt actually touch the case. It does seem that there isnt much chamfer on these dies either. But they only have a couple thousand rounds through them so i hate to buy new ones. Thanks for the info everybody.
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Old March 30, 2012, 07:02 AM   #8
FlyFish
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Quote:
My problem is the spring doesnt actually touch the case.
Are you sure you've got the right shellplate for the caliber(s) you're reloading? In the several calibers I reload on my LnL the spring always makes positive contact with the case - in some cases more positive than I like, as I mentioned earlier. If yours doesn't, and I don't know how that could be if you've got the right shellplate, there's no way to ensure that the case is properly positioned to enter the die(s) as the shellplate rotates, and that could be your problem right there.
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Old March 30, 2012, 08:14 AM   #9
hounddawg
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well if you have a lathe then a bit more chamfer on the case would probably cure it
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Old March 30, 2012, 05:24 PM   #10
thealex
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@ FlyFish

Yes I have the #45 die for .45 acp and #30 for the .44. Taking a few thousandths off the #45 will probably fix that issue. The #30 plate is the exact opposite problem. With over $500 into this I don't feel that I should have to machine or mess around with anything. Hornady is getting another call very soon hopefully we can resolve this.
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Old March 30, 2012, 08:10 PM   #11
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I agree with FlyFish . I Have a LnL AP and have had really good results with it. The priming system is a little tempermental but still a great machine , Try some Hornady dies and I bet your trouble will go away. Good luck .............LOUD
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Old March 31, 2012, 07:27 AM   #12
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You can also buy a Hornady depriming rod for you RCBS die that has a nice flare and may enter the case better. Sorry, not for pistol rounds.
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Old April 1, 2012, 09:59 PM   #13
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I have loaded thousands of .45 ACP on my press in the last few months and I have not had any problem like you describe. I do have the Hornady dies and everything clears fine. Let us know what you find. Thanx
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Old April 2, 2012, 07:16 AM   #14
243winxb
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Carbide FL dies have different amounts of bevel at the leading edge. At one time only Dillon & Redding had the bevel. Other may or may not have it now. Another problem can be the worn or sloppy linkage of the press letting the subplate/shell plate rotate. Move the handle so it parallel with the floor. Move it side to side. Does the ram rotate left & right? If so, linkage problem.
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Old April 2, 2012, 02:38 PM   #15
hounddawg
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not that this will do the OP a lot of good bur for whatever it is worth I have loaded somewhere between 1000 - 1500 45 ACP's on my LnL using Lee Carbide dies and never had any issues as he is describing. Just checked them and they seem to have a decent chamfer.


Oh and 243winxb the LNL uses belleville spring washers between the pin link pin, the toggles and links so there will always be some play there. But that could be the problem since that does allow for a bit of slop in the alignment between the plate and the die.
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Last edited by hounddawg; April 2, 2012 at 02:48 PM.
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Old April 2, 2012, 04:07 PM   #16
cryogenic419
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This is an indexing issue. I had the same issue with my setup, larger calibers it was a rare occurence but when you went to smaller calibers the problem really reared its ugly head.

When it hangs find where it is hitting and adjust the pawls accordingly. Tiny adjustments on the pawl screws can make a world of difference. It can be the difference between a machine with some hiccups and a smooth running machine. Sometimes all it takes is maybe a 1/32 or 1/16 of a turn on the pawl screw and everything is right with the world. One other thing I would check is make sure there is no debris between the subplate and the shellholder.

This post has helped me countless times on my machine.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=368171
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Old April 3, 2012, 05:06 PM   #17
thealex
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I am going to order a couple Hornady sizing dies and cross my fingers. I think from everything I read that should fix it.
I did have indexing problems when I bought it but a half of turn fixed that issue. Definatly a sizing/depriming issue. Thanks
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Old July 10, 2012, 10:15 PM   #18
mpk4949
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did the new dies work

thealex I am having the same problem you described in my brand new L-N-L AP progressive. Did the purchase of a new sizing die fix the problem? If so specifically what die did you purchase?

thanks!
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Old July 13, 2012, 07:38 PM   #19
thealex
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I ended up taking off 30 to 40 thousandths of the .45 shellplate which fixed the problem. I did about 5-7 thousandths at a time until it worked.
I have the same problem with 38 special using Hornady dies which I believe are from certain types of brass. (I acquired some range brass that I just plink with so I dont sort it by manufacture. Alex

Hornady also sent me another shellplate promptly no questions asked but it still did it.
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Old July 19, 2012, 12:56 PM   #20
jbrow117
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Sizing Die

There's a lot of good information here. I have the Hornady dies plus the #45 plate and mine has the same issue with .45 ACP which is all I reload (not jut your press). Everyone has covered the advancing of the plate etc. I had a really sloppy press when I pulled the handle as the arms had a big gap. I took off the pin locks on the large pins and threw about .100 shim and .05 at the bottom and it helped some but I still get this occationally (tolerancing could be better but than the price would go up). I think one guy hit on it that it's the deprimer punch is not hitting the hole in the center. I have all the usual problems that others have mentioned also. You just have to have a little mechanical apptitute.
Oh, mine still does not line up occtionally with the primer pocket and I'll have to wiggle it. YES I've adjusted and did all the things mentined. It's just something specific to Honady. I don't know if other presses have issues because Honady is all I've even owned. I had the single before the LNL.
Because I use the fifth station to seat and crimp I elongated the spring groove/channel so it enters and is lower than the plate sooner. I used my Foredom as the spring would tip the shell inboard. Now that the sping is below the shell plate this does not occur. I wonder if I can patent this idea and sell it back to Hornady?

Last edited by jbrow117; July 19, 2012 at 01:10 PM. Reason: Corrected spelling error
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Old July 19, 2012, 01:11 PM   #21
jbrow117
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Sizing Die

There's a lot of good information here. I have the Hornady dies plus the #45 plate and mine has the same issue with .45 ACP which is all I reload (not jut your press). Everyone has covered the advancing of the plate etc. I had a really sloppy press when I pulled the handle as the arms had a big gap. I took off the pin locks on the large pins and threw about .100 shim and .05 at the bottom and it helped some but I still get this occationally (tolerancing could be better but than the price would go up). I think one guy hit on it that it's the deprimer punch is not hitting the hole in the center. I have all the usual problems that others have mentioned also. You just have to have a little mechanical apptitute.
Oh, mine still does not line up occtionally with the primer pocket and I'll have to wiggle it. YES I've adjusted and did all the things mentined. It's just something specific to Honady. I don't know if other presses have issues because Honady is all I've even owned. I had the single before the LNL
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Old July 22, 2012, 10:08 AM   #22
cryogenic419
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It really does sound like it is a timing/pawl adjustment issue. All it takes is being a hair off to jam up. Even once you set it up for perfection, parts do wear and you will have to set it again eventually.

Just in case you had any questions on pawl adjustments, read the link here.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=368171

One other thing that just occured to me. I know there is a slight amount of wiggle room when a case is in the shellholder. How level is the surface your press is mounted to? If there was only a slight amount of tilt to one side, I could see that being enough to cause the case to lean to one side as well and have trouble entering the die.

Something else you may want to look into. Read the part about squaring up your dies. It may help.

http://www.sierrabullets.com/index.c...sue=1#loadtip1
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Old August 19, 2012, 11:48 AM   #23
Lef-T
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Definitely not a timing issue. I was having the same problem and the cause is the amount of pressure from the retaining spring.

Very easy to diagnose and fix:
If you have this issue with the case mouth hanging up on the sizing die,
1. Remove the retaining spring from around the shell plate.
2. Insert a case and cycle the press.
3. IF the case freely enters the die, then the cause of the malfunction is the spring.
4. Hold the retaining spring that you removed where the two ends come together and stretch the spring until it loses enough tension to not cause the issue. Be careful, there's a fine line between too much tension and not enough.
5. Enjoy!
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