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Old August 8, 2012, 09:05 PM   #1
tpcollins
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How much seating pressure do you use?

I really like shooting BH209. I took a force gauge with a modified ramrod and a Spinjag to seat the sabots on the powder around 80-90 pounds. I read somewhere awhile back the BH209 "likes pressure" but I wonder how much is too much? Can overpacking it be an issue? Thanks.
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Old August 9, 2012, 05:38 AM   #2
arcticap
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I'm not sure but I don't think that a high amount of compression would hurt ignition or performance at all.
I thought that the important factor to be aware of with BH 209 was that it required a very tight seal which means using a sabot that fits tight in the bore.
With respect to that I would think that extra compression would help.
But performance would provide an indication as to whether extra compression is problematic at all.
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Old August 9, 2012, 06:42 AM   #3
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I don't think any of us can answer your question. You are the only person I've ever heard of that actually measured the force used in seating a load.
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Old August 9, 2012, 07:22 AM   #4
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Quote:
I don't think any of us can answer your question. You are the only person I've ever heard of that actually measured the force used in seating a load.
Well, well, finally I'm first at something. I hear all the advice about doing everything the same for muzzleloaders to ensure accuracy - including seating pressure.

But if you don't have a means to measure the actual force being used, how do you know if you're being consistent from load to load?

I have handles that screw into the sides that makes it easy to use.

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Old August 9, 2012, 08:09 AM   #5
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Yep, definitely OCPD.........



.
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Old August 9, 2012, 08:37 AM   #6
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Quote:
But if you don't have a means to measure the actual force being used, how do you know if you're being consistent from load to load?
Easy!.... one ragged hole!
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Old August 9, 2012, 09:36 AM   #7
arcticap
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A ramrod can also have a stop in place for the chosen compression depth which would seat the projectile at a fixed depth in the bore when rammed.
Another method is to simply mark the ramrod for the desired ramming depth.
These methods can promote a consistent ramming depth for a particular load,
but may not be quite as exact as when using a force gauge.

Last edited by arcticap; August 9, 2012 at 09:45 AM.
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Old August 9, 2012, 10:10 AM   #8
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I like the way you think !!

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Well, well, finally I'm first at something.
Well, I'll give you credit for being first, "Lately" and for doing your best to be consistant. I recall, back in the 80's, some folks at Frienship, using a loading tool called a Kadooty, that was used for this purpose. I mark my range-rod but only refer to it as a confirmation. I mostly go by feel and technique and feel I am failry consistant. Some folks like to bounce their rods which reaslly doesn't tell you much. ....
These days I mostly shoot for fun and hunting and not a big concern. ....

Be Safe !!!
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Old August 9, 2012, 10:38 AM   #9
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Do it long enough you get a feel for it.
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Old August 9, 2012, 10:43 AM   #10
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I use an external loader for my cylinders and when I lever down the ball/bullet into the chamber, I just press enough so that I know I am putting pressure on the lever, but not straining my arm muscles.

There is a region of pressure where you know you are exerting force, but your arm muscles are not shaking/tightening, a sign that you are REALLY exerting pressure.

I always load the bullet in that region. Never more. Compression does not really help in power and accuracy, and the only time I compress the ball a little more than extra is if I am using a full power charge in a .31 pistol.
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Old August 9, 2012, 01:25 PM   #11
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Years ago I built a spring loaded device out of PVC pipe that fit over my
ramrod and had a 35 lb. mark on it so I would know when I had excatcly
35 lbs of pressure on the powder. After a few years of use, I could tell by
feel when I reached that mark. So, didn't need it anymore. That was the era
when I was shooting rifle in National competition.
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Old August 9, 2012, 01:43 PM   #12
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A bit anal retentive maybe but not OCPD . . . yet.
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Old August 9, 2012, 03:33 PM   #13
arcticap
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Inquiring minds want to know...

Where did you get the complete gauge set-up from?
Did you make any of it yourself or was it all pre-made?
Did you need to make the threads for the handles and rod to fit and work properly?
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Old August 9, 2012, 09:57 PM   #14
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Quote:
Where did you get the complete gauge set-up from?
Did you make any of it yourself or was it all pre-made?
Did you need to make the threads for the handles and rod to fit and work properly?
It's a Chatillon force gauge that I bought it on Ebay a few years ago for about $25. It's threaded on both ends and I can push or pull on either end. It came in a nice wooded box with numerous attachments and 2 handles that screw into the sides. I think it would cost about $200 now days. I had an old bow stabilizer made out of nylon that I tapped and that end screws onto the gauge. And that is epoxied onto a T/C ramrod that I bought at Walmart after the season for $11 and I put a Spinjag on the bottom of it.

I convert BH209 volume to weight in grains which runs about 68 gr on my beam scale for 100 grains by volume and I weight every charge then. So I try to be repetitive in everything with my ML and a consistent seating pressure is just one. I wish I could acquire "the feel" to enable me to seat the sabot the exactly the same amount that you guys do but I'm not that good. So I cheat - I use a gauge.
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Old August 10, 2012, 07:44 AM   #15
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LOL - I also don't think I've ever heard of anyone going to this degree. Now it's got me wondering . . . . what's next? Perhaps the pressure used to place a cap on a nipple. . . .how many of you use "thumb pressure" as opposed to seating the cap with a claw hammer? The important thing is to make sure your ball/sabot/minie is seated on the powder charge . . . that' why I have my ramrod marked as a double check.
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Old August 10, 2012, 10:23 AM   #16
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Quote:
LOL - I also don't think I've ever heard of anyone going to this degree. Now it's got me wondering . . . . what's next? Perhaps the pressure used to place a cap on a nipple. .

With all the posts I read about two strikes for the hammer to set a charge off maybe that should be a requirement.
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Old August 10, 2012, 02:25 PM   #17
tpcollins
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If I gave my gauge and ramrod setup to anyone to keep, do you think they'd use it or just let it collect dust in the closet?

If some of you have such a great touch, do you measure out your powder charges or just pour the correct amount needed into the palm of your hand? After all, I would think if you do it long enough, you would know the exact amount every time.
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Old August 10, 2012, 03:13 PM   #18
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Quote:
If I gave my gauge and ramrod setup to anyone to keep, do you think they'd use it or just let it collect dust in the closet?

If some of you have such a great touch, do you measure out your powder charges or just pour the correct amount needed into the palm of your hand? After all, I would think if you do it long enough, you would know the exact amount every time.
It would sit in the closet.
If you saw the full powder charge every time it wouldn't be a big deal to get it within a few grains every time but seeing it in the open end of a powder measure doesn't give you much to go by.
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Old August 10, 2012, 04:24 PM   #19
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Attitude and Effort

Quote:
If I gave my gauge and ramrod setup to anyone to keep, do you think they'd use it or just let it collect dust in the closet?
There is nothing wrong with your set up and there would be more uses for it. I can't tell what the range is but I have a simular instrument that I use, for checking trigger pulls on SA and DA firearms. ..

It's been said that an idea, is only as good as the time it takes for someone to tell you otherwize. If you feel comfortable with it and like it, ignore those that would not use it. ...

Quote:
If some of you have such a great touch,
Far from perfect or great but pretty darn close and comes from experience and perhaps, you are not very confident in your technique. As far as responding to the rest, you already know the answer. ....

Give yourself some credit and;
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Old August 10, 2012, 08:34 PM   #20
tpcollins
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Thanks Pahoo, I'm probably going to order a cooling rod to minimize time between shots but I'll just keep that to myself . . .
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Old August 11, 2012, 03:41 PM   #21
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Quote:
let it collect dust in the closet
Best idea I've heard all day.
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