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Old July 10, 2012, 04:59 PM   #1
William T. Watts
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Loading for 45/70

I gave my son a custom take down Marlin 45/70 Guide gun that I built, I've never loaded for a 45/70, is there anything unusally or unique to the caliber. Does this caliber require case trimming, I've given some thought to this question and think the case probably won't need it? I want to surprise him with some loaded ammo and let him know I'm set up to supply whatever he needs!! William

Last edited by William T. Watts; July 11, 2012 at 07:21 PM.
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Old July 10, 2012, 05:36 PM   #2
steveno
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very easy caliber to load for and you won't have to trim cases. start your loads on the low side that work up. the guide gun isn't recoil friendly
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Old July 10, 2012, 06:13 PM   #3
Jerry45
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Pretty much the same as loading for .45 ACP or .45 long colt only more powder and LRP. 45/70 doesn't use the same bullet as the pistols. .45 ACP takes .454 bullets. 45/70 takes .458 bullets. Hope that helps.
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Old July 10, 2012, 06:55 PM   #4
Howard31
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45/70

I shoot 59 grains of IMR 4895 behind a Rem 300 gr JFP in my 1884 Trapdoor.
Use a 458 bullet and yes you will have to trim.
68 Grains of FFg Black Powder with a 500 gr 459 cast bullet will also knock things down.
No offense but it's nothing like a 45LC
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Old July 10, 2012, 08:18 PM   #5
flashhole
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Loading for 45-70

You may find this helpful. Yes, you have to trim cases.


http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech...h_notes.htm/49
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Old July 10, 2012, 08:42 PM   #6
William T. Watts
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Taper or roll crimp, I believe I use a taper crimp for my 30/30, continuing that thought it would be appropriate for the 45/70? I normally would refer to some of my loading manuals to answer these questions, at the moment I'm repairing some water damage to my home so they are packed away until I'm finished with the renovation. Non the less thanks for the info shared!! William
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Old July 10, 2012, 08:44 PM   #7
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45/70 loads just like any other straight walled handgun or rifle round. Since it's so long and big around, it needs to be well lubed. Since it's so long and has limited taper, it doesn't grow in length too much.

Here's one of my loads/boolits;





These were dipped in lee liquid alox, then allowed to drain. They were then sized to .459.



Then loaded in starline nickel plated cases.



That's a lee special order group buy from over on the cast boolits forum. It weighs in at 420 grains and is downright accurate. I shoot these in my NEF buffalo classic.

Oh, there has never been a 45 acp with a bullet at .454. Some early colt SA revolver 45 colts were .454 diameter, now they're all ,452, just like the 45 acp.
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Old July 10, 2012, 08:56 PM   #8
William T. Watts
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I think I will go with Starline cases,I haven't decided if I will try lead or not, I'm leaning toward a 350gr RN jacketed projectile. As has been pointed out the rifle is going to have stout recoil, I've never shot this round before so I have no idea what to expect. It should be a interesting round to load, the only straight wall case I have loaded so far is the 45ACP which is/was a handful until I figured out I couldn't seat and crimp in the same operation.. Snuffy those pictures are awesome!! William
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Old July 11, 2012, 12:05 AM   #9
Edward429451
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You should trim the cases for uniformity. I have noticed that some of my brass actually grows shorter from firing. Guide Guns do like lead boolits and they like them sized fat. I size mine to .460 and have no leading probs to speak of.

The recoil of a 45/70 can be reasonable compared to 12 Ga 2-3/4" slugs. It can easily be loaded even stouter but I have not found loads of that level pleasant or needed for any animal up to and including Elk.

Reloading the 45/70 is a breeze and can loosely be compared to loading a 44 Mag or 45 Colt, figuratively speaking. Be careful reloading the 45/70, if you drop a case, it will need resized, if you drop a boolit, its almost always ruined with a big dent in the base or nose. My GG likes Reloader 7 powder with Cast lead slugs. 3031 gave good results also. Be warned not to buy lead bullet cartridges for your GG. Most are .457 for the old guns and will leave your barrel leaded beyond frustration.
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Old July 11, 2012, 01:06 AM   #10
Jerry45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard31
No offense but it's nothing like a 45LC
Nothing like? Let me see. It's longer, takes LR primers rather the LP primers and takes .458 bullets rather than .454. However its a straight walled case same as .45 Long Colt, is primed in the same manner as .45 Long Colt, primers are presses in, powder is dumped in the same as .45 Long Colt and the bullet is pressed into the case same as .45 Long Colt but I guess your right, 45/70 is nothing like .45 Long Colt.
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Old July 11, 2012, 06:05 AM   #11
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Just to be clear, the 45-70 is a taperd case. Not a lot of taper but it is tapered, not straight.

The 350 grain Round Nose is a good choice. Several powders work well. H-4895 kicks it up a notch compared to Varget. 3031 and Reloader #7 have a sharp raport whereas the other powders have more of a push than a crack. You can tell the difference in felt recoil. None of them are fun to shoot off a bench if you are burning through a couple boxes of ammo. The factory 405 grain loads are down-loaded for Springfield type rifles and are mild to shoot compared to what you can do with your handloads.

Snuffy, great pics, thanks for sharing.
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Old July 11, 2012, 06:45 AM   #12
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I shoot 405 grain lead bullets in mine, loaded with IMR 4895 to trapdoor velocities. It works plenty good for the smallish whitetail deer around here.
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Old July 11, 2012, 04:17 PM   #13
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The round was originally designed for black powder. If you down load your ammo you may have some problems with certain powders being position sensitive. The 45-70 still has quite a following and the powder companies have provided several powders that will perform quite well in this old large round. I have a Marlin 1895 and all I use are cast bullets in it. 99% are my own cast bullets. I have had the greatest success with 405 gr cast bullets using Accurate 5744 or H4198 in it. If you don't load barn burner loads the brass will last a looooooooooong time. I'm still using the original brass that I purchased when I acquired the gun in 2006.
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Old July 11, 2012, 05:44 PM   #14
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+1

Accurate 5744 is one of the most "positionally insensitive" powders I have ever encountered.
Running 425 Lead/GasChecked bullets at 1250fps over 24.5gr/5744 at 45% case fill, I was getting
standard deviations of ± 5 (yes, five) fps
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Old July 11, 2012, 06:09 PM   #15
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Cary - I bought my Guide Gun in 1998, mine is the ported version. The next year I purchased 1500 Hornady 350 grain RN bullets from Midway (bulk closeout) delivered to my door for $75. I have about 400 left and I am still on the original 50 pieces of brass.
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Old July 11, 2012, 08:25 PM   #16
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I shot a big raccoon last night with a 45/70 with a body shot.

1 gr Red Dot 155 button bullet, and steel filler in the case with a long flash hole ~ 400 fps and sounds like a BB gun if the bullet hits something soft.
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Old July 11, 2012, 08:36 PM   #17
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And ........ what was left of the racoon? A bit overkill but opportunists can't be picky! I once shot a crow with my 7mm Rem Mag. I was amazed at how long the black feathers floated in the air.
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Old July 11, 2012, 10:01 PM   #18
Clark
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I could not find it today.
I borrowed the neighbor's dog to find it in the brush, but the dog would not go in the brush.


But this the 45/70 and this is what small ones look like.
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Old July 12, 2012, 11:55 AM   #19
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Mine is small too.

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Old July 12, 2012, 08:48 PM   #20
William T. Watts
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Dies, 350gr RN Hornadys, shell holder, Starline brass have been order, I will start load developement when it starts to cool. I hope to find a good loading for my son's 45/70 plus purchase another Marlin 45/70 to replace the rifle I let get away. Thanks for the ideas and suggestions!! William

Last edited by William T. Watts; July 12, 2012 at 09:37 PM.
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