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Old June 18, 2012, 05:26 PM   #1
Kalashnikov7.62
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Working Affordable Luger Replica?

I am looking to buy a luger pistol, a real pistol not a non-firing one. Can anyone recommend one? I was looking at a luger called (this is how it's listed in google products) "LMTD Luger Replica" but I don't know if it's a real Pistol or not. Affordable will be around $300.
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Old June 18, 2012, 05:49 PM   #2
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Probably not a real gun, it is listed as a replica and the price is far below market value of even shooter Lugers. For a shooter Luger, you are looking at $600-ish, minimum.
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Old June 18, 2012, 07:07 PM   #3
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There have been a few Luger "repros" that are shootable, but they cost more than a fair condition original Luger which, as Scorch says, can be bought for $600 and up. At some recent gun shows, I have seen non-matching Lugers in so-so condition (no rust, but worn finish and grips) go for $800 or so, not cheap, but they are real Lugers, not repros or poor "copies" like the Stoeger Luger.

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Old June 18, 2012, 10:21 PM   #4
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Wow 600 for the real thing? Jesus I thought it would be around 3000. could someone post a link that sells them?
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Old June 18, 2012, 11:00 PM   #5
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If you spend $3000 on a Luger, you don't want to shoot it !

You can get a good shooter for $600-$900, if you want to go up to $1250 that will get you a very nice matching pistol from WWII era, not rare, with nice finish and function. More than that, you are in collectible territory and woe betide the uninitiated. In fact, woe betide the uninitiated looking for a decent shooter. Get some information online, visit gun shows, and chat up the dealers and Luger buyers, especially the buyers. Don't buy one for a while, unless some sweet deal drops in your lap, like a veterans' souvenir from the widow down the block, or something like that.

Don't even think about a replica, they are unsafe, worthless, junk.

The Stoeger Luger is a good pistol, having said that, but it's not a Luger. Just not the same, you will be disappointed in function, finish, and distinct lack of iconic status and history.
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Old June 19, 2012, 12:17 AM   #6
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The Stoeger Luger is a good pistol, having said that, but it's not a Luger. Just not the same, you will be disappointed in function, finish, and distinct lack of iconic status and history.
I would say it depends on which Stoeger Luger you are talking about.

I have a couple of the Stoeger .22 Lugers, and while they are Lugers (Stoeger owns the US rights to the name Luger, and has for generations) they are not true P.08 Parabellum pistols. The generally look like the Luger, and do have a toggle action, but are straight blowback in operation.

There is another Stoeger Luger out there, I bought one last fall at a gun show. Brand new, in the box with a spare mag. Made in the USA, marked Stoeger, and Luger, and its a lovely 9mm P.08 in stainless steel!

The wood is flawlessly checkered, seeming to grip your hand all on its own. The gun is a perfect, classic Luger with 4" barrel. They aren't ALL trash...

You'd like to pay $300 for a shooting Luger, and I'd like to pay $0.60 for a gallon of premium gasoline, again. You might find your goal before I find mine, but I doubt you'll beat me by much....
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Old June 19, 2012, 04:22 AM   #7
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Merely sayed it was a prefeable if it was around 300. never said I wouldn't go up.
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Old June 19, 2012, 01:44 PM   #8
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Actually, there are three "Stoeger Lugers." The first was the commercial Luger pistol, made in Germany and marketed in this country by Stoeger in the 1920's (when they registered the name "Luger" as a Stoeger trademark).

The second was a .22 pistol which Stoeger put the "Luger" name on but which had a totally different action and was not, IMHO, a very good pistol.

The third was an American-made stainless steel pistol, the one 44 Amp mentioned, also marketed by Stoeger and thus using their "Luger" trademark.

Only the first "Stoeger Luger" would be considered a "real" Luger by most collectors.

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Old June 19, 2012, 04:22 PM   #9
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In addition to the Stoeger blowback replicas, Erma also sold a line of similar pistols in the 1960s, IIRC in .22LR, .32ACP, and .380ACP.

They do not have a good reputation. I've only examined two; they had finish that can charitably be described only as fair, and they have obvious styling differences from the real thing when examined closely. Furthermore, owners on TFL and elsewhere generally report that these pistols only function consistently when they're clean and well oiled, and the moon and stars are aligned properly.
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You can get a good shooter for $600-$900, if you want to go up to $1250 that will get you a very nice matching pistol from WWII era, not rare, with nice finish and function. More than that, you are in collectible territory and woe betide the uninitiated. In fact, woe betide the uninitiated looking for a decent shooter. Get some information online, visit gun shows, and chat up the dealers and Luger buyers, especially the buyers. Don't buy one for a while, unless some sweet deal drops in your lap, like a veterans' souvenir from the widow down the block, or something like that.
+1; I am in this process right now. Also, be aware that many of the less expensive shooter-grade pistols are chambered in 7.65 Parabellum / .30 Luger. Fiocchi offers a load that is reasonably priced and usually available, but it still sells for about twice the price of 9mm and periodically goes on backorder. This is generally a handloader's cartridge.
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Old June 19, 2012, 06:01 PM   #10
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Most of the affordable 7.65 pistols in the U.S. are the so-called "1920" model, imported after WWI, when Germany needed hard cash desperately and wasn't allowed to make guns in the military 9mm caliber. They "cleaned" and rebarrelled thousands of surplus Lugers and sold them all over the world.

They are now considered collectible and have gone up in price, but still are lower than the 9mm pistols.

Most of the other Lugers in 7.65 are the early guns, and those generally are more costly (in some cases a LOT more costly) than the average German millitary pistol in 9mm.

FWIW, the 7.65 (.30 Luger) pistols are a delight to shoot. The recoil is moderate, the cartridge is very accurate and feeding problems are non-existent.

Jim
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Old June 19, 2012, 08:10 PM   #11
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I was under the impression that the stainless steel Stoeger 9mm "Lugers" were more or less a "takeover" of the older Mitchell stainless Lugers.

Having had the misfortune of owning a Mitchell gun, I found it to be very unreliable. I had two mags, and couldn't get either to feed more than two or three rounds in a row. BTW, the Mitchell mags were 7 rounds, not 8, and the gun would not accept original German type mags, whether actual or aftermarket.

Look around on Gunbroker and you should find some pretty decent shooters for under a grand. Just be patient and keep looking.
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Old June 19, 2012, 09:25 PM   #12
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Well I have three years to look so might as well make good use of it.
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Old June 20, 2012, 05:40 PM   #13
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Hi, gyvel,

That is my belief also, but I wasn't sure, so I didn't say it. I think Mitchell had production and marketing problems and also trademark problems as he called his repro a Luger, a no-no as Stoeger owns that name. (Note that Mauser, when they "resumed production" of the Luger with Interarms backing used the name "Parabellum", not "Luger" for the same reason.)

I didn't mention those pistols because the OP is looking for a Luger at a reasonable price, and those Interarms guns are bringing right good prices these days. You can get a very decent original Luger for what one of those brings and it would have historical value which the Interarms guns don't have.

That whole story was a lesson in not believing market surveys. Every survey Interarms ran showed enthusiasm for a "new" Luger; but when the guns proved to cost as much as original guns (naturally, they were literally "made the old-fashioned way"), all that enthusiasm for a modern Luger dried up. Sales were not bad but the investment never paid off and all concerned took a hit.

Jim
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Old June 20, 2012, 07:35 PM   #14
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FWIW, the 7.65 (.30 Luger) pistols are a delight to shoot. The recoil is moderate, the cartridge is very accurate and feeding problems are non-existent.

I have heard this before, there are few complaints with .30 Luger except the price of ammo and that some current production is underloaded.
This does not square with the Common Wisdom that the same model in 9mm needs some sort of Secret European "Hot" ammunition.
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Old June 20, 2012, 09:51 PM   #15
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That whole story was a lesson in not believing market surveys. Every survey Interarms ran showed enthusiasm for a "new" Luger; but when the guns proved to cost as much as original guns (naturally, they were literally "made the old-fashioned way"), all that enthusiasm for a modern Luger dried up. Sales were not bad but the investment never paid off and all concerned took a hit.
You left out one important thing. Mauser made the wrong Luger! What they gave us was the long barreled Swiss pattern. THis model does not have the "lump" at the front bottom of the grip. It has a different look than the P.08 that everyone (besides Luger enthusiasts) recognises as the "Luger". It looked...funny...

SO, a funny looking Luger at a stiff market price just missed the mark of what people wanted. The market for Lugers is basically three different segments, and none of them is mainstream defensive handgun.

Luger collectors. Real Luger fans, who are buying real history. Many would buy a new Luger just to have, and compare with. Others would scoff, and stay with their collectables.

Shooters who always wanted a Luger, just to check it out, and a new one will do as well as a refinished one. Availability and price are big factors here.

And those who would find an interest in a Luger sparked by the availabilty of new ones, price would be big here also.

All niche markets. The biggest potential market back in the 70s when Mauser made them was WWII Vets, who always wanted to get a Luger in the war, and never got one. Trouble was, Mauser's gun didn't look right. It wasn't the one they fought against back then. And it was expensive. So sales were...slow. And that particular market is long gone today.

Lugers are a design from the dawn of the auto pistol age. They are one of the world's most recognized firearms. There is always a commercial interest in them, but as curios, not mainstream handguns. Not these days.
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Old June 21, 2012, 01:46 PM   #16
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Mauser first made the Swiss pattern for the simple reason that they were using the Swiss machinery, their own having been destroyed. After hearing the same complaint, they modified the tooling to make the German style gun, supposedly what the market was demanding. That market proved not to be there, either. (I have both versions; IMHO, neither is as good as the "real thing.")

The simple fact is that no one is going to buy a "new" or "repro" gun when he can buy the original for only a little more. Does anyone suppose that percussion revolver repros would sell if original guns cost $300 and there were enough to supply the market?

Jim
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Old June 26, 2012, 04:00 PM   #17
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FYI-Ive got some recent mfg Lapua .30 luger and it doesn't even come close to cycling my 1920 commercial model luger.
Gunbroker has a lot of Lugers for sale...
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Old June 26, 2012, 05:24 PM   #18
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Last i paid for a Russian reblued was $300,but that was back in 1998.For some reason, locally sold shooters are commanding $800 and up.
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