The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old April 1, 2012, 09:35 PM   #1
Logan9885
Member
 
Join Date: January 28, 2011
Posts: 81
Reloading for a bushmaster AR .223

Bought my first AR the other day and was wondering about reloading for it. I have been reloading for a while but never reloaded for a semiauto gun. Problems, Things to look for, things to do?? ....Other than full length resizing
**Im wanting to load up some 55 gr nosler balistic tips
Logan9885 is offline  
Old April 1, 2012, 10:05 PM   #2
dacaur
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 16, 2010
Posts: 733
Dont buy expensive brass is about all I can think of.... Probably a good idea to get a lee factory crimp die, at least, It couldnt hurt and they are cheap so why not?
dacaur is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 01:04 AM   #3
chris in va
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 26, 2004
Location: Louisville KY
Posts: 12,527
Need to inspect each case for excessive dents or cracks. Full length resize, buzz out the military crimp if necessary. Trim to 1.75. FCD is optional, not necessary but gives marginally more consistent groups. Make sure you seat the bullet so the rounds fit in your particular magazines.
chris in va is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 04:53 AM   #4
Tim R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2004
Location: God's side of Washington State
Posts: 1,601
Quote:
Probably a good idea to get a lee factory crimp die, at least, It couldnt hurt and they are cheap so why not?
Not even needed. I've got 1,000's of 223's down range without using a Lee FCD one time.

Might try 24.5 grs of Varget with a Hornaday V max 55gr bullet started with a Remington 7 1/2 and see what happens. No Federal brass.
__________________
God Bless our Troops especially our Snipers.
Tim R is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 05:43 AM   #5
Bamashooter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 12, 2010
Posts: 1,709
I get peace of mind at least with a lee factory crimp die plus I agree with chris in va. that from round to round the crimp makes the round shoot more consistently. I have also reloaded and shot thousands of rounds of .223 and a good bit of those were federal (FC) brass. I dont get what peoples gripe with federal is. I have reloaded some peices of federal brass at least 4 times without issue. I guess some folks just dont like them, dont know why. Its brass.
Bamashooter is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 09:14 AM   #6
Logan9885
Member
 
Join Date: January 28, 2011
Posts: 81
Im with bamashooter on the federal brass....I use it for 22-250, 243, 308, 30-06, 270 wsm, and 300 wsm with no problems at all. Is there some specific reason for no federal brass in an AR or personal opinion?
Logan9885 is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 02:24 PM   #7
Tim R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2004
Location: God's side of Washington State
Posts: 1,601
Federal 223 brass is soft and if you cut one apart you will see how thin it is at the primer pocket and web area. Federal brass is also very heavy. I have no issues with Federal brass in other calibers.

You can shoot it but Federal 223 brass cost me some points at Camp Perry in 2007. I have not used it since.

I am a careful reloader and when it comes to ammo for a match, I weigh each charge and depending on the distance to the target I might weigh the brass.

One thing to consider with your FCD, if you make a visible crimp to a match bullet with no place to crimp, you deform the jacket and disturb the bond with the lead in the bullet IMHO. Not a real problem with a slow moving bullet. There is too much hype with the FCD as the fix all die. I had one didn’t like it, didn’t need it some 20 years ago.
__________________
God Bless our Troops especially our Snipers.
Tim R is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 04:27 PM   #8
LarryFlew
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2009
Location: Minnesota CZ fan
Posts: 895
Work up a few loads if you are looking for extreme accuracy. Each gun likes a little different recipe. One of mine LOVES the recipe Tim mentioned but another does not at all. 2 brands but both 16 inch.
LarryFlew is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 08:50 PM   #9
Will Lee
Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2011
Location: North Texas
Posts: 99
You should full length resize all brass you cycle through your AR. Which model Bushy did you buy. I've got a Varminter and it love Ramshot X-Terminter under a Barnes or Hornady 55 grain bullet.
Will Lee is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 09:24 PM   #10
HJ857
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 9, 2007
Location: haslett, mi
Posts: 343
I'm no expert but I do know that if you shoot a bullet down the barrel of a rifle - the jacket gets deformed, it's even possible that you may disturb the bond between the lead core and the jacket. Just so you know before you ruin those perfect little pills by shooting them...
HJ857 is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 09:33 PM   #11
BLK RIFLE
Junior Member
 
Join Date: February 3, 2012
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 4
I get my brass from polygunbags.com. I just got 500 rounds of pulled military already primed and all I had to do was use a collet die to resize the neck. I've bought most of my rifle brass for my ARs and M1 Garand.
__________________
NRA LIFETIME MEMBER, RETIRED AF, RETIRED POSTAL. HANDLOADER SINCE 1960,
BLK RIFLE is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 10:00 PM   #12
dacaur
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 16, 2010
Posts: 733
Quote:
I'm no expert but I do know that if you shoot a bullet down the barrel of a rifle - the jacket gets deformed, it's even possible that you may disturb the bond between the lead core and the jacket. Just so you know before you ruin those perfect little pills by shooting them...

its no use trying to explain it, believe me..... To much talk about the FCD's and next thing you know someone will post that pic of a bunch of bullets that were "ruined" by a lee FCD that was obviously adjusted as tight as it would go and then some as "proof positive" that they are evil ....
dacaur is offline  
Old April 2, 2012, 11:29 PM   #13
Tim R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2004
Location: God's side of Washington State
Posts: 1,601
Quote:
I'm no expert but I do know that if you shoot a bullet down the barrel of a rifle - the jacket gets deformed, it's even possible that you may disturb the bond between the lead core and the jacket. Just so you know before you ruin those perfect little pills by shooting them...

OK, so bullets were made to go one way. Maybe I did not explain my theory well but in an effort to be smart you subverted what I was saying. Still I have never needed a FCD. Owned one gave it away. I don't shoot steel; I shoot paper and like to put as many bullets as I can through the same hole. This is my goal, nothing more. What works for you has not worked for me. It could be because of the difference in equipment.

How many guys setting National records use a FCD? None.
__________________
God Bless our Troops especially our Snipers.

Last edited by Tim R; April 2, 2012 at 11:42 PM.
Tim R is offline  
Old April 3, 2012, 12:17 AM   #14
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,510
Quote:
Problems, Things to look for, things to do??
Is it a Bushmaster 223 or a 5.56? I have one of each, it makes a difference in case prep.

Jim
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Jim243 is offline  
Old April 3, 2012, 06:49 AM   #15
10 acre woods
Member
 
Join Date: December 1, 2011
Location: the commie state of il
Posts: 73
lube your cases good. I only have had stuck cases reloading the .223/5.56.
I don't reload any other rifle but lots of handgun loads.
__________________
9 out of 10 armed robbers agree that you should not own guns or conceal them. The other 10% stole the survey.
Some times heaven is knowing you can send someone straight to hell.
10 acre woods is offline  
Old April 3, 2012, 07:20 AM   #16
rebs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 10, 2012
Posts: 2,228
I read on AR15.com that it is not necessary to crimp 223 other than a taper crimp, do you guys feel this is true or false ?
rebs is offline  
Old April 3, 2012, 08:21 AM   #17
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,510
Quote:
that it is not necessary to crimp 223 other than a taper crimp, do you guys feel this is true or false ?
This is a personal opinion, but I think a taper crimp is worse than no crimp at all. Personal feeling is that a taper crimp lossens the bullet from the neck. I use a Factory crimp die for 223 and put on a very light crimp.

But that is just me.
Jim
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Jim243 is offline  
Old April 3, 2012, 03:55 PM   #18
HJ857
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 9, 2007
Location: haslett, mi
Posts: 343
In all seriousness, there's only one way to know if a crimp of any sort is good or bad for you, and your load, is to test it both ways and see. There is no one-size-fits-all answer.
HJ857 is offline  
Old April 3, 2012, 08:59 PM   #19
Tim R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2004
Location: God's side of Washington State
Posts: 1,601
Quote:
I read on AR15.com that it is not necessary to crimp 223 other than a taper crimp, do you guys feel this is true or false ?
It depends. I load 223 SMK's and hold the bullet in place with neck tension. By using a bushing die, I can make adjustments if need be by changing bushing size. This has worked for me thus far.

Here is the deal. I shoot High Power. If the top shooters are using a crimp, everyone follows. If a top shooter is using case such & such which weights 61.24 grains, everyone will find such & such cases weighing 61.24 grs or as close to it as possible. If the top shooters eat a corn dog 15 minutes before going to the line, you will have point hunrgy shooters eating corn dogs 15 minutes before they report to the line.

Remember when moly was the hot deal? Don’t hear so much about it today. We are back to shooting naked bullets with the exception of a few die hards. Why? Copper is easier than cleaning moly with copper in between layers of moly fouling.

If you are shooting military ball type bullets with a crimp groove then a crimp would be or could be in order. But if you are loading for the next match, no crimp. My 2 cents.

Quote:
In all seriousness, there's only one way to know if a crimp of any sort is good or bad for you, and your load, is to test it both ways and see. There is no one-size-fits-all answer.
!00% in agreement.
__________________
God Bless our Troops especially our Snipers.
Tim R is offline  
Old April 5, 2012, 12:07 PM   #20
Logan9885
Member
 
Join Date: January 28, 2011
Posts: 81
Its a 223 and a carbon AR-15.......SO LIGHT
Logan9885 is offline  
Old April 5, 2012, 12:15 PM   #21
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,510
Quote:
Its a 223 and a carbon AR-15.......SO LIGHT
Light yes, but sturdy. Interesting, mine's in 5.56 (C15 Ultra Lite)

Jim

__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Jim243 is offline  
Old April 5, 2012, 12:16 PM   #22
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,510
Oh, back to your question.

If 223 then get an RCBS X-Small Base die to resize those cases.

Jim
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Jim243 is offline  
Old April 5, 2012, 02:39 PM   #23
m&p45acp10+1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 3, 2009
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 3,310
I would say get a good quality case lube. Lube all of the cases outside, and inside the mouth. Also save the trouble and agony just buy a stuck case removal kit now. If you end up needing it, and have it right there it is worth its weight in gold. If you end up having to buy one later it leads to real painful experience when trying to find one when the stores are sold out, and you have to order it from online sources.

With .223 there are 3 camps.

1 Those who have stuck at least one case.
2 Those who eventualy stick one some how.
3 Those who LIE.
__________________
No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.
m&p45acp10+1 is offline  
Old April 5, 2012, 04:41 PM   #24
Striker1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2004
Location: TX
Posts: 635
I like the LFCD with mine also. If your bullets have no cannelure it can be adjusted to however light a crimp you need. I would bet most of us here aren't shooting high power at Camp Perry or even compete so it probably won't be necessary to load as if we are. Using Hornady 55 gr FMJ and H335 I can get groups slightly under an inch out of my 16" Bushmaster (on a good day).

IMHO, if all you want t do is have fun, loading .223 with equipment from any of the well known manufacturers will easily get you there.

TimR,

I'd be interested to know how Federal brass caused your problems in competition?

Last edited by Striker1; April 6, 2012 at 04:00 PM.
Striker1 is offline  
Old April 6, 2012, 12:28 AM   #25
medalguy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 31, 2009
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 1,017
I've used Imperial sizing lube for a good many years and never stuck a single case. Oh, I also use a Lee FCD with a very light crimp. Works for me.
medalguy is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.11757 seconds with 7 queries