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Old November 30, 2000, 08:20 PM   #1
charlesfmason
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Currently considering these two guns. Any opinions?
Thanks.
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Old November 30, 2000, 09:29 PM   #2
oktagon
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P5 or P5 compact?

P5 is a close relative of P38.
Very nice guns. Although Wlather P5s are usually more expenssive than Sig P225, I see no effective difference wetween them. Walther might be slightly lighter and smaller.
Both are DA/SA with no manual safety. Walther has rather unique deckocking lever.
Buy one you like better. Any would be an exellent choice.
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Old December 1, 2000, 07:31 PM   #3
Jeff OTMG
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I like the P225 better because the grip feels better in my hand, it seems thinner. You will have to decide which one fits your hand better, they are both fine pistols.
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Old December 1, 2000, 08:30 PM   #4
Tecolote
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SIG SAUER P225
Specifications
Caliber, 9mm Parabellum
Length, overall 7.1"
Height, overall 5.2"
Width, overall 1.3"
Barrel length 3.9"
Weight, w/o magazine 26.1 oz.
Weight, empty magazine 2.8 oz.
Trigger pull DA 12 lbs., SA 4.5 lbs.
Magazine capacity 8 rounds



Model, P5
Specifications
Caliber, 9mm Parabellum
Capacity, 8+1
Barrel Length, 3.62"
Overall Length, 7.10"
Height, 5.10"
Width, 1.26"
Finish, Blue
Weight, 28 oz.
Weight, empty magazine NA
Trigger pulls, NA

Congratulations, you've isolated your choice to two underrated in the US but popular pistols in Europe. Both were desgined in response to the West German police trials that came after the PLO terrorist attacks at the 1972 Munich Olympics. The SIG Sauer proved the more popular of the two, but Walther sold 40,000 units German and Dutch police.

I favor the P225 because it fits better in my hand and it has better balance. I've only handled a P5 but I've never fired one. I did notice that the triggers pulls were smoother on the P225, but I can't say whether this is charateristic or only a result of the one I handled.





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Old December 1, 2000, 10:52 PM   #5
Sierra
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As has been posted earlier, the Sig 225 has proven the most popular but there is absolutely no way you can go wrong with either pistol. In my case, the ergonomics of the Sig fit my hand better and a better grip is attained when I draw.
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Old December 2, 2000, 01:21 AM   #6
parabellum
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I have copies of both, and love them both, but my experience is that the P5 is much more ammo sensitive than the 225. The P5 will eat fmj all day long, but does choke on some hollowpoints. I have actually owned three P5s of various vintage over the years, and this has been the case with all three.
The 225, OTOH, eats anything. It also feels better in my hand than any other revolver or pistol. The P5 is super neato, but my choice between the two would be the 225, hands down.
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Old April 20, 2001, 09:14 PM   #7
twin Sigs
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P225
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Old April 20, 2001, 09:23 PM   #8
GunreviewWebmaster
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I like the Walther's LOOKS better (sleek); however, I think the Sig Sauer P225 is a MUCH BETTER BUY. The Sig Sauer P225 is one of the best Sig Sauer models and I highly recommend it.

Walther P5:



Sig P225: (this is the best quality picture I could find, if anyone can find a better 225 picture please post them.....)



[Edited by GunreviewWebmaster on 04-20-2001 at 10:56 PM]
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Old April 20, 2001, 09:51 PM   #9
ar-180
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That looks like a 226....
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Old April 20, 2001, 09:57 PM   #10
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Your right, I think it was a 226. I think I copied the wrong link. I apologize for the inconvenience.
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Old April 20, 2001, 10:03 PM   #11
Stephen A. Camp
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Hello. The Walther P5 is certainly more elegant in appearance, but the P225 is utterly reliable and accurate.
I am not a particular fan of SIG-Sauer pistols. Nothing against them, just that I prefer other makes. However, I've owned and shot several; I kept two: P225 and P220. The P225 is now my wife's pistol. I admit to not having fired over a thousand rounds in this pistol over a 5 year period, but it has never malfunctioned and the sights are on, although my wife's shooting will have to improve a tad before she will know any difference between well-regulated sights and those that are not!

I'd go with the P225 in this case. You will want to shoot more than ball and these little thingys do. I've owned three of the things over the years and all worked with anything you put in them.

Best.
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Old April 20, 2001, 11:22 PM   #12
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Don't own a P5.

Don't need to.

Because I own a P225.

I've already got the best single stack compact 9 there is.

And I'm a Walther fan...
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Old April 21, 2001, 07:55 AM   #13
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Some would also argue that the HK P7M8 is the best single stack 9MM going. I would have to submit its one of the most accurate and safe to carry. I like the P-5 and 225 a lot. As others have said, you can't go wrong with either. If you want something a bit different and probably in the price range of the P-5, look at the HK P7M8. The best value though is the 225, hands down.

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Old April 21, 2001, 08:10 AM   #14
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I'm so glad to see the extent of enthusiasm for these fine pistols. I own a P225 and P5C. I must echo the thoughts of others that the P225 is, in addition to being by far the better buy, more suited to serious defensive use. This is chiefly do to its feeding reliability. The P5 design is very impressive and the pistols are a joy to shoot but I'd reach for the P225 first if looking to carry. The truth is, however, that when I carry, it is a P7M8 that finds its way onto my hip.

No bad choices here.
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Old April 21, 2001, 08:58 AM   #15
Phillip
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From looking at the magazine floorplate on the SIG, it is a 225.
It would be hard to choose between the two, but I would probably go with the SIG given the price and my familiarity with them.
If I could find the Walther in the same price range as a NIB 225 (about $425 in my neck of the woods) I would try the Walther. The last time I saw a P5C was in a used gun case for $575, and I seriously considered buying it.
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Old April 21, 2001, 10:23 AM   #16
cocojo
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Hands down the Walther P-5 is the better made pistol. I own and shoot the P-5 a lot and just love this gun. I had made a mistake many years ago and traded the P-5 I owned. Boy what a mistake, I bought another one and this one shoots on the money and feeds anything. I use Range 127+P+ in my gun without any problems. I have never a malfunction of any kind with many thousands of rounds. If you want a class act gun bar none buy the Walther. If you just want a very good gun which has a stamp slide buy the Sig. I like sig guns the 228 was one of my fav guns but for quality of workmanship the walther is it. I own a lot of handguns Glocks, Beretta's, Smiths, Maks and Sigs cheap and expensive this is my all time Fav gun you can't go wrong with either gun but this is my choice.
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Old April 21, 2001, 01:23 PM   #17
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I whole heartedly agree with Cocogo. The Walther is not made from any cheap stamp sheet metal parts. Few people are aware of the fact that the Sig slide is actually a soft sheet metal stamping. The muzzle end of the slide is enclosed with a plate that is welded in and then the weld is ground down to blend in with the slide. If you look at the rear end of the slide you will see that the pistol as a forged breach block set inside the slide. There is good reason for the use of this part. The soft slide could not stand up to the recoil of the 9mm cartridge so this is the reason for the insertion of a forged breach block.
There is good reason that the Dutch adopted the Walther. The sig simply does not last as long as the Walther. A good many of them give up the ghost after about 10,000 rounds. Walthers have been known to go 50,000 rounds or more. Admittedly the average Joe will probably never wear either pistol out because he will probably never shoot that many rounds through either pistol. There are though a few people who will (like myself) and I have greater confindence in the longevity of the Walther brand with its superior forged (not stamped) parts.
Although I own several of these pistols and I admit the sig is definetley cheaper to buy and has a better trigger. I personally would never use one in a serious situation. Why? A pistol must be kept mechanically simple for use in a crisis situation. The sig has two levers on the right side of the pistol. One is for the slide release and the other is for the hammer drop. I have seen to many people in a panic situation (myself included) hit the larger of the levers (the hammer drop lever) when trying to release the slide after insterting a magazine. Walther purposely used only one lever. The first stroke of the lever closes the slide and if you decide not to shoot you simply hit the lever a second time and drop the hammer. It is mechanically a far better system for a crisis situation.
I like the high quality materials, the racy look and the magic of the Walther name. Cost of course will unfortunately prevent most people from ever owning this fine pistol. By the way I have never had any type of ammuntion jam up in my Walther. W.R.
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Old April 21, 2001, 02:16 PM   #18
Tecolote
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Oh brother

Big deal that the Dutch went with the Walther. Good for them. The SIG Sauer P225 was at one time the most issued police pistol in all of Europe. So if yout want to make adoption by agencies an issue, the P225 winds hands down.

"The sig simply does not last as long as the Walther. A good many of them give up the ghost after about 10,000 rounds."

That's sheer nonsense. Can you provide verifiable proof?

"The sig has two levers on the right side of the pistol. One is for the slide release and the other is for the hammer drop."

And? Why is this an issue?

"I have seen to many people in a panic situation (myself included) hit the larger of the levers (the hammer drop lever) when trying to release the slide after insterting a magazine."

This is a training issue. Poor training will cause all types of problems, this one included. The SIG Sauer setup appranetly isn't a problem for a lot of people, since you brought up the Dutch--their Royal Marine use the P226, as folks like the British Army. If the levers were the problem that you claim the SIG Sauer design would've been relegated to obscurity.

Get whichever fits your hand better and whichever one you're most accurate with.
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Old April 21, 2001, 02:57 PM   #19
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HK P7


I would go with P7. You haven't asked about it, but out of Walther, Sig and HK choices, I would go with P7-M8, it is about the same size as others, but probably more accurate and very quick to get into action and easy first shot as it is single action. Keep in mind the first shot is often the most important one. I shot the full sized model M13 and it is nice.

If I personally had to choose between the two -- well, I don't know. I would probably choose Walther based on what I see in this thread.
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Old April 21, 2001, 05:56 PM   #20
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I have owned both and both are great pistols, but I sold the Sig P225. The Walther P5 I still and will always have. This P5 is much better made than the Sig and is the more accurate of the two.

You can also get this pistol in .30 Luger and 9x21 if you are interested.

By the way, it was over 50,000 to the Dutch and is
probably closer to 60K. Walther's police contracts are close to being fulfilled with the P5, and the P99 is already in use in many overseas law enforcement agencies

The P5 feels the best in my hand out of all of the Walthers that I own, including the P99. I have factory Walther wood
on mine which widens the grip very slightly, but fits great.

If you are looking for price, both are very nearly the same depending where you shop. If you want quality and reliability, then you would have to choose the Walther.
This is not a Sig slam, I still own a '228, it's a great pistol.

Tecolote, don't take this thread so personally. They are all just opinions with several well-known facts for anyone into the German handgun scene. It sounds as if you've had your feelings hurt because so many folks recommended the Walther over your Sig-Sauer P225.
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Old April 21, 2001, 10:09 PM   #21
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Walther P5 vs. Sig P225

This is in response to the question of how can I prove the Sig will give up the ghost after 10,000 rounds. The answer is in two parts. The first response it to read, read, read. There have been several articles published on Sig failers down throurgh the years but I have also had first had experience with Sig failures. I have had two hi-cap sig magaizines come apart at the criss cross joining pattern located on the back of the magazine. Since I do not own a sig 225 I do not know if it is joined at the back like the sig 226 is. I have a close friend who suffered a slide crack after 5,000 rounds and he did not shot any plus p loads through his gun , ever. I have also had problems with the slide take down lever binding up and refusing to rotate. If it ever happens to your sig put a little upward pressure on the recoil guide rod when the slide is in the rearward position and it will usually enable the take down lever to rotate into the down position. The sig is not a bad gun by any means but it is not indestructable or perfect either. I do like the excellent trigger pull of the sigs and their accuracy is not bad either although it varies from weapon to weapon. My sig 220 .45 acp outshoots my sig 226 quite easily. Unfortuantely the Sig 220 will not work with sharp shouldered semi-wad cutter bullets like the very popular Hensley and Gibbs no. 68. Due to its short feed ramp the empty case that is being ejected actually drags over the loaded round underneath it. As the empty case is withdrawn out of the chamber the rim of the empty case will plow a channel through the sharp shoulder of the lead semi-wad -cutter bullet , it then comes in contact with the case mouth of the loaded round underneath it and peals it back like a banana peel resulting in an interesting jam up. My l911 with its steeper feed ramp had plenty of room between the ejecting empty and the loaded round beneath it and has no problems with the type of super accurate bullet. I like my sig 220 but you just cannot use any type of bullet in it. W.R.
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Old April 21, 2001, 11:40 PM   #22
IZZY
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I would take a little while to search out a used german police ( with mill mark, this should make it cheaper) H&K p-7.... its all steel and has a better trigger(Use NO +p ammo)

I had a p-5, and I loved it, no I really had an affinity twords it. I loved how when you took out the inner parts of the slide, and flicked the body of the slde, it would ring like a tunning fork ( it was not a gun it was a symphonic insrament dangnabet!). I loved it's accuracy..oh yah. I loved it's ability to shoot whole mags, as fast as I could pull the trigger and put in all in the black at seven yards. After experiancing mag releases with my FM-hi power ( just a little so the mag was not actualy in the gun...) I started to apreciate its Heal-clip mag release... I love the safety on the Walther( all of them seem to be very safe, I refer to the internal safety...I dont use manual safeties on DA guns). I liked the hammer drop placement.

I did have a problem with hollow-points, got a good smith to do a ramp-job. I wish it was all sthal and not Al framed. Oh yes I forgot to mention the gun was born to fire "+P" and machine-gun ammo, plus the extra slide rails of the breech block p-38 desighn kinda make up for the aluminum frame.

I was forced to sell it...foolish me, at least it was a good cause, should have raised the money some how else!
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Old April 22, 2001, 01:34 AM   #23
ar-180
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Why is it that you claim that the HK P7 cannot shoot
+P ammunition?
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Old April 22, 2001, 06:35 AM   #24
cocojo
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If you want to buy a Walther P-5 Earl Repair Service in MA has them for about $695.00 He also has a web site at carlwalther.com
He has used P-5's also, for cheaper money. He has British Special Forces model P-5C's, which were made for the Elite British Forces. You may want to look on GunsAmerica.com, they have new P-5's for less money, but Earl's Repair stands behind all his products. To get a handle on the cost of guns try GunsAmerica.com, so you know the price for either the Sig or the Walther before you buy.
By the way P-5's can be purchased with one, two or three barrels with same serial number in 9mm 9x19, 30 Luger and 9x21 but you better bring your wallet.
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Old April 22, 2001, 09:09 AM   #25
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Personally?

Herr Walther,

I never take threads personally. I just like to see credible evidence.
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