The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old March 15, 2012, 11:31 AM   #26
TheRoadWarrior
Member
 
Join Date: January 22, 2011
Posts: 35
I think my urge to put a light on the gun is simply because it has a rail to put stuff on it, I succumb to what many military guys call "tacticool" addiction, just have to have every single little accessory and high speed do-hicky on their gun even if its not doing anything but looking cool.

I will stick with my plan of barricading the daughter's room and having an escape plan.

Zombies on the other hand...they might be attracted to a flashlight
TheRoadWarrior is offline  
Old March 15, 2012, 02:27 PM   #27
ProShooter
Member
 
Join Date: September 11, 2009
Location: Richmond, Va.
Posts: 86
Usually when this type of question pops up on a gun forum, 12 pages of arguing will follow...

I always advise my students not to attach flashlights, lasers or bayonetes () to their defensive handguns. That's just my .02...your mileage may vary..

and yes, I said bayonets.....

__________________
NRA Certified Firearms Instructor
Utah Concealed Firearms Certified Instructor
SABRE Pepper Spray CSAP Instructor
www.ProactiveShooters.com
ProShooter is offline  
Old March 15, 2012, 10:39 PM   #28
TheRoadWarrior
Member
 
Join Date: January 22, 2011
Posts: 35
yeah, bayonets are tacticool, not tactical, unless of course it is zombies.

I think a large part of my urges to buy crap is from my peers in the service. Many of these guys just buy stuff to 1-up their buddy and show off.
TheRoadWarrior is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 03:06 AM   #29
WarWolf
Junior Member
 
Join Date: March 10, 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8
Oh how i've stayed at the gun range far to long talking about this subject.
I think it comes down to personal preference. For me i like the idea of both. But i actually have a TLR3 on my gun at home. and although it does show whatever you're aiming at it also will light up the whole room.
I like it But i do agree about the "bad guy" aiming at the light. But i also think he's going to be kind of stunned and eyes not adjusted.
also my TLR doesnt have the strobe on it. (because i'm always broke,haha)
And i think if you have that feature on the light thats even more time to identify the target. But on all of this i also don't have kids. and my feeling might be different on the whole thing then.
But as far as right now goes i could have 9mm or 00 buck and the only thing i could hurt is my walls.
WarWolf is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 09:04 AM   #30
garryc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2005
Posts: 2,314
This is one of my pet peeves.

1) A light on a gun is a target. It also removes independent mobility of the light. You cannot pan an area without moving your entire body. Learn to shoot one handed in the extended and tucked positions. Learn to shoot cross wrist and with your off hand held high. The light is also a weapon. Held in the had it is a strike weapon with a hammer blow. You can strike him with it if he jumps you at close range, then fire.

2) Use enough light! These cheap lights just don't get it. You want to blind him in a face on encounter. Also, it should be bright enough that if you pitch it to the ceiling it lights up the whole room. My Streamlight Stiron LED does that.

3) Screw house clearing!! That requires training. It also requires a partner to be done right. The only reason to cross that house is to protect your loved ones or get to the safe room. Your T.V. just isn't worth killing someone over, and especially putting yourself in the line of fire. (Besides, replacing floor because of a blood stain is likely more expensive) Leave house clearing to the pro's. Lets understand, he may fight you but when he sees those flashing lights outside the house and knows it some cops coming to get him he will likely give up.
garryc is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 09:15 AM   #31
.22lr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 14, 2007
Posts: 229
Re - bad guy shooting at the light:

I don't care! I will not fire a gun without being very sure of my target.

Iowan who wanted to surprise her fiance dies in accidental shooting

Shooting dark shapes just because they are in your home, seems like a bad idea.

RE
I like two flashlights, on eon th epistol, and one in my hand. This way I have fewer worries about batteries, pointing a gun at something I do not wish to destroy, or Not having the flsahlight where I was sure i left it.. Also, if I need a free hand, I can still see.


VR

Matt
.22lr is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 09:31 AM   #32
Edward429451
Junior member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2000
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 9,494
I like that idea of keeping a supply of lightsticks in the bedroom.

Clearing my own house sure would be easier with flashbangs.
Edward429451 is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 02:02 PM   #33
Blindjim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2012
Location: Sunburn State
Posts: 116
Reading again that having an extra light or one not on the weapon is a good idea is something I agree with now. Although I still will have a light on my primary and secondary weapons. All are capable of imtermittent or prolonged operation by my choice.

I did acquire a bit of the ‘tacticwild’ flu not long ago… it’s OK I’m better now and bought one of those itty bitty one inch wide barrel and six inches long flashlights that put out enough light to embarrass the sun. 400 lumens reputedly, when on HIGH or STROBE. Two CR 123A batteries, and boy does it eat batteries, but then I do use it often outside of the house when I hear something that isn’t normal or something that is out of place and suspicious enough for me to investigate it.. $70.

I’ll not trust my life to it by thinking I can use it to disrupt, blind, or some even say, immobolize an assailant. It’s sole purpose is to help me save my own life. By using it’s reflective lighting, or by using it as a stabbing or hitting with weapon as a last resort. Actually if it comes to that I must be fighting a T5000 terminator, as he’ll get ten 12ga 00 buck, and fifteen .45cal 185gr JHP. With any luck at all he’ll slip on the wet floor where I’ve already voided as he approached and I can run away.

I’ll not attempt to catch another’s eyes and hope to blind them with some flashlight! That’s ridiculous.

My circumstances are a bit different than all of you fathers and mothers, I’m a bachelor and have no inside pets routinely.

In my state there is a ‘Stand your ground’ statute.

I am in fact legally blind too.

I have an alarm system with redundancy set up as well as exterior motion controlled area lighting. Even if the BG pulls the meter out of its can on the power pole my alarm system operates and dispatches by it’s built in battery back up and cell phone component.

I’ve also endured 3 violent attempts to enter my home these past months. 3 others while I was away briefly shopping or at church.

I do not wish to kill anyone. Ever. But with my visual impairment, IF I have the displeasure of a late night intruder, my plan is to disarm the sirens, asap, and await whatever comes to me.

If the sirens weren’t enough to run him/her/them off, I’ll likely not go towards what sounds I hear. They’ll be defeated so I can hear.

I hear pretty well.and the house is not huge. Hopefully, all I should hear is them exiting given the sirens recent bursts.

I’ve thought about this a lot and figured to loudly direct the ‘guest’ to hit the deck or die! What if these folks aren’t into taking orders? What then?

Then I came up with this plan… Wait. Listen. Stay calm. Prepare. And if the threat then approaches my position, I’ll use my lights to acquire and shoot them till there is no more movement or sound coming from it/them.

I know full well what I’ve just said and wonder why some of the words Ive used weren’t said by others. I’m not shooting to maim. Distract. Or ward them off. I’m playing for keeps. If I have to use my gun (s) ever, as I must presume they are willing to go to those lengths as well especially if they’ve violently or even covertly entered my home unannounced or without permission to do so.

AS a matter of fact…. One officer recently tried to by pass my civil rights and tried forceably to gain entry to my home!

Completely unannounced at that time, he simply walked up to my kitchen door and tried to force the door knob several times. No knock. No cell call informaing he was at my home or my door. Just tried to walk in like he owned the place.

I picked up my pistol I had at the table, and yelled out asking who it was with no immediate answer coming back to me…. I removed the safety and took more cover… and prepared for the worst.
Then a yell came, “POLICE!”, and nothing more.

I stood up to unlock the door with my pistol at the ready for I’ve still a legitimate doubt, and replied, “You better be a cop!” and commenced to unlock the door.

That situation almost came to a dire end. All because some Hot Rod cop figured he could forego his training and my rights to fulfill his interests.

It gets even wackier after that tenuous moment but I’ll refrain. The deputy was clearly in the wrong.

Not being able to see well enough as so many others posting here puts things into a different ‘light’ for me. After a couple shots I’ll not hear too well either. Consequently, I’m forced into a real mess.

From past expeirnces I’ll say this and shut up… IF a person is ‘dispatched’ let’s say… it sure ain’t like it is in the movies. They’ll be laying there for a while. A WHILE! Pics have to be taken, your statement, yada yada… THEN ‘they or them’ will get removed… along with you too… maybe. Usually not though, if the above scenario is the case.

Then you have to deal with the aftermath of it all… and that stinks just as much as did the event persipitating the shooting… but it lasts longer.

There’s been an immense amount of wisdom posted in just this thread. Enough to save lives. Or to not if one chooses to dismiss it.

I don’t care terribly for the idea of shooting to disable. I adhere to the notion if a gun is used do it in such a way as to entirely, completely and utterly halt whatever wrongfully intrusive thing that is there to cause you & you’rs harm.

then I'll juse my little tactical light so I don't stumble over the bodies... or the crooks might if I'm not quite so successful with my plan.

Nice thread.
__________________
Will Rogers said, "there's 3 sorts of people in this world, those who learn by books, those who learn by the experiences of others, and those who just have to pee on the electric fence every now and then."

.... for me, life becomes less and less shocking with every pull of the trigger.
Blindjim is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 09:46 PM   #34
GM1967
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 5, 2010
Location: Delaware - formerly NJ
Posts: 211
Quote:
I’ll not attempt to catch another’s eyes and hope to blind them with some flashlight! That’s ridiculous.
Why is that ridiculous? I guess you've never had a bright flashlight shined in your face. It's quite easy to do, many modern lights are VERY bright, and at night in a darkened house when eyes are adapted to the dark, they are especially vulnerable.

Quote:
I am in fact legally blind too.
Well, that might explain why it's ridiculous for you to try to blind someone, since you may not be able to see the person at all. But for those without a visual impairment, it's pretty easy and quick to guide a flashlight beam to their face. And with some lights, hitting their chest is enough to be painful and blinding.
GM1967 is offline  
Old March 16, 2012, 11:02 PM   #35
garryc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2005
Posts: 2,314
My Streamlight Strion LED has a strobe mode. I had my wife blast me with it in the dark from 35 feet away. It is absolutely disorienting. I've used that function several times in the prison, works great.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0Q3ywZZTUI
garryc is offline  
Old March 17, 2012, 02:06 PM   #36
Jim March
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 14, 1999
Location: Pittsburg, CA, USA
Posts: 7,292
I had to help clear an apartment complex parking lot of a really large Javalina a couple of nights ago, after full dark. More here:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=482715

The flashlight was critical in staying out of the critter's "personal space". I was able to herd it without scaring it into a charge. Decent backstops were few and far between. And with the light off the gun, I was able to leave the gun holstered, hand on it, flashlight in the other hand...didn't want to terrify any residents popping out who didn't yet know about the megapiggie.

I was by far the best equipped person present. I had the most potent gun (full-house 357) and a cheap dual-CR123-based flashlight with a "160 lumen" rating. Probably closer to 120 or 140 or so but it's good enough for my needs:

http://www.amazon.com/Duracell-Dayli.../dp/B002FU6KEI

It's been tough over a year's daily carry, effective, oversize by a bit but a solid "thwacker" at either end if needed. Nice recessed tailcap switch. The downside: the "width" control is a joke, it's going to be a narrow-beam no matter what. And I do NOT want crap like strobes or multi-intensity-whatever switches - in an emergency I want straight-up on/off thank you!
__________________
Jim March
Jim March is offline  
Old March 17, 2012, 09:02 PM   #37
Blindjim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2012
Location: Sunburn State
Posts: 116
GM1967


Well, there's that. Good point.

I often lose perspective as to how another with decent eyes can be influenced or distracted sheerly from the intensity of an immensely brillliant light. it does force one to turn away or hide their eyes somehow. Me too actually.

I've had the ability to fully use a very bright light as effectively as one probably could. So I have but a single train of thought as to the use of any light and that is to acquire and defeat an intruder with it.

My handheld is a Jetbeam... 400 lumens... lots of fill with an utterly intense beam on its highest setting. On it's lowest setting you could use it in a theater to look for your keys or something you dropped and not bother anyone else from it's spill. It has 4 levels. Tail button sw, with memory for the last used setting, or by using just the function sw a full on strobe which if held for a few seconds will then remain on until you switch it off. Aircraft aluminum and water proof. Got it from here

http://www.longhorntactical.com/JETBeam_s/159.htm

They don't show my model though. Guess lights are as quickly outdated as are i Pads.

Saw a review today saying many things about bulb replacements for Surefire and Streamlight, and dealextreme for the Ultrafire 501b and Hugsby flashlights.... at around $20 for 250 lumen you can mount or hold. I didn't save the link but it should be easy enough to Google for if 'Hugsby & review' are in the search terms.

Anyhow the fella at Longhorn Tac is very helpful and paitient... though some of thier offerings aren't too cheap. I'll vouch for the one I got is first quality though. its bounced off the floor more than a few times from a counter, table, bed, etc. and works flawlessly. usually you can wind up with 10 - 20% off and free shipping.

With loops, you can attach this light to a long gun... or shot gun too as you can with many of the Jetbeams.
__________________
Will Rogers said, "there's 3 sorts of people in this world, those who learn by books, those who learn by the experiences of others, and those who just have to pee on the electric fence every now and then."

.... for me, life becomes less and less shocking with every pull of the trigger.
Blindjim is offline  
Old March 18, 2012, 05:12 PM   #38
moxie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 17, 2006
Location: TX
Posts: 513
Best advice I've heard here is to stay barricaded up, calling 911, with weapons at the ready.

If you MUST leave your barricade, I think it's a good idea to have low intensity nightlights throughout the house that come on when it gets dark. While these give you enough light to shoot by, they still might not provide enough to ID the target, which you must do before shooting. Once you've got the target covered, if necessary a quick flash from a bright flashlight held out by the weakside hand should take care of that problem. I agree that a weapon-mounted light makes you a brightly lit target.

A decent alarm system, like ADT, might obviate the need for any of these measures, and doesn't cost much more than some of the ultra-tactical lights now available. Defense in depth...
__________________
If you want to shoot...shoot...don't talk! Tuco

USAF Munitions 1969-1992
RVN 1972-1973
moxie is offline  
Old March 19, 2012, 01:03 PM   #39
Blindjim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2012
Location: Sunburn State
Posts: 116
Good stuff... really.

I live in one of the 17 states that have a “Stand your ground” law. So, inside or outside of your home, or off your property (with a CCL), one has but to feel they are being put in jepordy of injury or loss of life and deadly force can be used to dispel whatever perceived danger

I’d submit unless the intruder is a skilled professional criminal, and perhaps even then, anyone breaking into a house has their nerves on edge already, pulse pounding, blood pressure soaring, and definitely on edge. Surprising someone with a light but not firing at them immediately is taking a chance I’d as soon allow someone else to take.

Usually, they’re there to take things outside of the home, tools, boats, or your car. Ordinarily, seeing a car tips ‘em off someone might be inside. Seeing that someone very well is inside and still desiring to enter should be enough info to indicate perhaps, they’re there for something considerably graver.

Too many things could happen and there’s absolutely no way of knowing what some junkie, crack head, or plain ol’ B&E fella will do once they know they are discovered!

Therefore I'd submit another perspective. IF you have instituted a monitored alarm system, or merely one which alarms you, or not. If you choose to figure you can just unveil a burglar with an off hand held light by flashing it briefly in the general direction of the invader and in that instance decidedly tell they are armed, or not with no further course of action in mind but to contain or hold for the police? Good luck with that.

Now that you’ve shone your light, well, now what?

But then, that’s taking a really big chance, isn’t it?

I’d say it is a dicey proposition at best to attempt to overcome or yikes! detain a threat that is now inside your home in the middle of the night.

If you can see a person without a light being cast into a suspect’s direction, there’s no need to display your light at all, except to acquire and dispatch them with it. No need to reveal your locale by yelling commands at them either.

If you do shine one even very briefly, it seems then too the opponent has an area or point of aim. Out of sheer surprise they could fire in your genral direction. Probably quite wildly and often! I’d as soon not be shot at generally or directly.

They may even shoot at your orders to drop to the ground…. Don’t move! Freeze! You’re covered! Or the sorts we’ve all heard one way or another.

Shine your light to discover only? Then, who's got who covered?

I'd submit using which ever tactic of displaying a bright light to 'identify' only, is sheer folly.

Be a light stuck onto my pistol and held away from my body entirely ready to fire, or one operated by my off hand makes no diff if you have no intention to fire in that moment.

I’d much rather have my light bearing weapon under control and when I light up the now aptly discovered ‘position discovered’ bad guy, pull the trigger almost immediately.

Nope. In a home or personal defense situation, lights or lasers are for acquiring and immediately disposing of your threat! I’m not Roy Rodgers, The Lone Ranger, or Batman.

No actions I or anyone should take with an intruder inside of their home should involve giving the ‘bad guy’ another chance… nope. They rolled the dice when they decided to enter your abode unlawfully, stealthily and perhaps violently.

As for me or someone else shooting a first responder, LEO, neighbor, or friend, doesn’t it seem logical that any of these people will be avidly, vociferously, and very likely enthusiastically announcing themselves so as to both alarm you and identify themselves as no threat??

If your home is in jepordy from flood or on fire, it should be first responders duty to assume they are at risk in such a scenario…. And should do everything they can to both alarm the home owner and protect themselves. So demonstrably identifying themselves seems a no brainer!

Bad guys, last time I checked don’t make a habit of doing that. The really really bad guys won’t be announcing themselves. Only the good guys will.

In such cases, law enforcement is not always going to be the ‘first responder’, most likely you will be it.

Naturally, my comments depend on prior knowledge of the whereabouts of your family, room mate (s), or guests. Under conditions where you know full well the current spots of those listed above when a home invasion takes place, following the above prescribed actions appear as a matter of course for insuring one’s safety and maintaining the integrity of your property.

True, there’s a time and place for brandishing blinding lights into faces of people without taking measures including the use of deadly force… just not in admittedly desperate situations.
__________________
Will Rogers said, "there's 3 sorts of people in this world, those who learn by books, those who learn by the experiences of others, and those who just have to pee on the electric fence every now and then."

.... for me, life becomes less and less shocking with every pull of the trigger.
Blindjim is offline  
Old March 19, 2012, 01:36 PM   #40
.22lr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 14, 2007
Posts: 229
Tragedy: Florida Man Shoots, Kills Fiancee Day Before Wedding

Quote:
I'd submit using which ever tactic of displaying a bright light to 'identify' only, is sheer folly.
Identifying your target is pretty silly. How else would you accidentally shoot your fiancee the day before your wedding?

Abrogation of one's duty to identify what / who they are shooting at, based on the target's loaction, is folly.

~Matt
.22lr is offline  
Old March 19, 2012, 08:58 PM   #41
Blindjim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2012
Location: Sunburn State
Posts: 116
Hi Matt

PERHAPS READING A BIT FURTHER INTO MY POST WOULD HAVE PREVENTED YOU FROM MAKING SUCH A MISTAKEN ASSUMPTION OF MY statement and it's INTENT.

I don't expect any family member, fiance, friend etc, to be breaking into my house... things might be different for others or yourself.

Give your fiannce a key!

Knowing what is being said is important if an intelligent response is to be made.

Taking pot shots at something out of context is both 'pure folly' and says something about whomever breaks in unprepared and pops off a drive by posting.

every situation is different... I expressed my own circumstances.... AND my feelings about exposing yourself and how little one can actually find out about some burgalar in a split seconds burst of light... not only that but a strong light will affect your eyes too..

The mere presence of a stranger in ones home yields the pressence of a possible threat, and in the case of a home which is alarmed and monitored as well, as so many are and is my own, and they are still on the premises informs me the likelyhood of things going south fast is a viable assumption.

Lights flashing and sirens screaming, and some person hasn't headed for the highway yet?... sounds like someone wants more than money jewelry electronics, drugs or guns to me.

BTW.... any known persons would have contacted me by cell, phone, and or just tapping or beating on my bedroom window most likely. Close ones too. Family members would all have access keys... and I'd know where my loved ones are... I suppose some remote circumstances could change things but it's doubtful.

True too, those who know how I feel about such matters, and know me, also know I own weapons... and am not afraid to use them. trust me, they all either knock loudly or call me from the driveway on their cells... that is of course, if I'm not already outside awaiting them.

Perhaps knowledge is key... identification is knowledge... and as I said, the displayed light determines or supports your belief the intruder is indeed a stranger.... OK. Then what... and naturally, the "then what" only applies IF they don't shoot you.... or their partners don't shoot you.

There's no time for all the supposed rhetoric being jotted down here to be filtered thru!

Capturing is better left to the pros...

keeping myself and my loved ones breathing is my duty.

Here's one other scenario for ya... what if the interloper very closely resemgbles one of your friends and you make such a mistake?

NOpe. There's always someone which will interject some wierd ... just won't happen... situation to attempt to poke holes in someone else' notions.

But then, you've probably not experienced someone kicking in your door or busting in your window... and not responding to your cries for them to ID themselves... or to leave.

Once you have.. you may change your mind. I have. Recently. several times and its why I own guns again. Even though law enforcement says I can shoot thru the door I still want to hesitate... and that too is wrong in that case. I should have shot. there was established precidence.

I take no pleasure in this... for me it's all just too real and I aim to be standing in the aftermath. Let other's take chances of misidentifying someone, or identifying the person whose shooting first... not me. My gun's light will be the next to last one they'll see depending on their religious beliefs.

However ... anyone can proceed whcih way they choose. I've no problem there. I simply feel there's contingencies some folks here might have missed or overlooked and why I posted as I did.

Good luck...
__________________
Will Rogers said, "there's 3 sorts of people in this world, those who learn by books, those who learn by the experiences of others, and those who just have to pee on the electric fence every now and then."

.... for me, life becomes less and less shocking with every pull of the trigger.
Blindjim is offline  
Old March 19, 2012, 11:22 PM   #42
Frank Ettin
Staff
 
Join Date: November 23, 2005
Location: California - San Francisco
Posts: 6,530
All the foregoing flummery aside, if one is considering shooting someone, he needs to identify his target. One might rationalize it however he wishes, and he might be sure that whoever he is going to shoot deserves it; but people have been wrong about such things before.
Frank Ettin is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 04:59 AM   #43
Blindjim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2012
Location: Sunburn State
Posts: 116
true enough... identification begins way before some incident takes place. it begins with planning, security, and having all on board actively participating in the plan.

Despite all of this .. despite everyone practicing together various scenarios... things can indeed turn out poorly.

We all have our very best efforts and ideas laid out in our minds, and prayerfully, all will turn out great and no one will encounter anything dramatic, but if so, the home owner, renter, etc, will prevail by sticking to his or her plans..

I have my own, and for me... its a good plan. I live alone, no pets, no kids, and some plants that won't make September.

the thing is this, RESULTS WILL ALWAYS VARY!! No matter what the plan likely is when stuff hits the fan.

Regardless, thinking ahead as is being done here by tossing around different perspectives and ideas is always a good thing to do in advance, no matter the path one winds up subscribing too.
__________________
Will Rogers said, "there's 3 sorts of people in this world, those who learn by books, those who learn by the experiences of others, and those who just have to pee on the electric fence every now and then."

.... for me, life becomes less and less shocking with every pull of the trigger.
Blindjim is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 06:55 AM   #44
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague County, Texas
Posts: 10,341
Quote:
My Streamlight Strion LED has a strobe mode. I had my wife blast me with it in the dark from 35 feet away. It is absolutely disorienting. I've used that function several times in the prison, works great.
Several of my lights have strobes. While they may be disorienting to some (including the person behind the gun), some folks aren't really bothered by them. My kids like to use the strobe lights for dancing and running around stop action antics.

Who knows? Maybe you will get lucky and your bad guy will suffer a photosensitive epileptic seizure.

Quote:
true enough... identification begins way before some incident takes place. it begins with planning, security, and having all on board actively participating in the plan.
I don't think 'identification' means what you think it means.
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher."
-- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 07:01 AM   #45
garryc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2005
Posts: 2,314
I don't have to worry about the dark too much, I have motion sensor light switches in my hallway.
garryc is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 07:48 AM   #46
rha600
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 4, 2006
Posts: 338
I agree and disagree with both sides. One thing that someone pointed out is that it doesn't hurt to have two lights. one in your hand, and one on the gun. You don't HAVE to use the one on the gun but it's nice to have it just in case.

the way my house is laid out it's like a "V" my master bedroom is at the bottom of that "V" so anyone that might have come in through a bedroom window will need to come down the hallway from the right, and anyone from the living area will come from the left.

Sitting in the bedroom, behind the bed, on the phone with 911 will allow me a perfect view of the door to the master bedroom. I also keep at least one or two lights on in the house even at night. small lights, but enough that I can easily see at night. I have a revolver and a LED maglite in my nightstand. I also have the benefit of having hurricane windows. Ask anyone in Florida, the chances of someone breaking in through those is VERY slim. Fire departments don't like them because even they can't get into a house through them without some extreme measures.

In the living room I have a PX4 with a streamlight on it as the patio on the back of the house is off that room and the backyard is not very well lit. yet. We live on a lake so in case something comes up out there I have, again, both a handheld and a gun light. If I did identify someone, regardless of what light, I could easily flip on the gun light, drop the handheld and use that hand to then dial 911. Now if I've only got a handheld light, how am I supposed to dial 911 while holding the gun and the flashlight? Or do I drop the gun to dial? do I drop the hand held flashlight so I'm now in the dark again?

And before anyone says it, no, I'm not calling 911 on every sound I hear in the backyard just for them to come out because of a big bad raccoon or opossum that wants to eat one of my tomatoes. haha.


Basically though, it's like having the gun itself. Just because you have it, doesn't mean you have to use it. But in that one scenario that you do need it, it's damn nice to have.
rha600 is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 08:30 AM   #47
TheRoadWarrior
Member
 
Join Date: January 22, 2011
Posts: 35
I started quite the debate on this topic.

I have to thank many of you for helping me revamp my tactics and think of alternative ways to make my home safer!
TheRoadWarrior is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 12:15 PM   #48
Frank Ettin
Staff
 
Join Date: November 23, 2005
Location: California - San Francisco
Posts: 6,530
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindjim
...true enough... identification begins way before some incident takes place. it begins with planning, security, and having all on board actively participating in the plan....
Nope. It means simply looking at, and seeing, the person.
Frank Ettin is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 01:57 PM   #49
Twycross
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2005
Location: Montana
Posts: 1,187
Quote:
identification begins way before some incident takes place. it begins with planning, security, and having all on board actively participating in the plan.
Nonsense. At best, all that gives you a vague idea of what you might be able to expect. It does not relieve you of the responsibility to ensure that you are not shooting a nonthreatening or completely innocent person.
__________________
The test of character is not 'hanging in' when you expect light at the end of the tunnel, but performance of duty, and persistence of example when you know no light is coming.
- Vice Admiral James Stockdale, USN (ret.)
Twycross is offline  
Old March 20, 2012, 06:48 PM   #50
rha600
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 4, 2006
Posts: 338
while I agree 10000%, I think I know what he was getting at.

could be things like, call your husband/wife before coming home at 2:00am.
having a plan that is a noise is heard everyone meets in a certain place in the house?
leaving certain lights on in the house to help easily ID the person making the sound. Or thing, it might be something that just fell over when an AC or heater vent blew on it...

Last edited by rha600; March 21, 2012 at 06:02 AM.
rha600 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.14744 seconds with 7 queries