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Old February 13, 2012, 05:23 PM   #1
PigFarmer
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Gun Safety

Did a quick search and didn't see anything on this so mods please close if this is a duplicate.

Two guys looking at gun, owner unloads the magazine but didn't check the chamber, accidental discharge, bullet went through the wall and struck a young women in the head.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...6pLid%3D135239

Tragic, but serves as a reminder, to check every time and then treat the gun as if it is loaded, even if you unloaded (or think you unloaded) it.
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Old February 13, 2012, 08:10 PM   #2
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...to check every time and then treat the gun as if it is loaded, even if you unloaded (or think you unloaded) it.
Sounds good, in theory.

How do you clean a gun? As was stated on another forum, what about Garands or Winchester 94's? And, how on earth would you disassemble one?

IMO, what is intended by Rule 1 is "All guns are loaded" ...until you have verified the gun in your hand is not. Maintain muzzle discipline (Rule 2) until you have verified unloaded status. Now that gun is safe. Until you set it down. As soon as it leaves your hand, you no longer know what is happening to it.

So that means you check each and every time you pick one up. And, for administrative handling (such as inspections), you lock the action back before passing it to someone else, so they know it is safe.

This protocol is followed in the better gun stores. It is in addition to the Four Rules, to handle actions not covered by them.

The problem is, this makes things more complex than many would like.
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Old February 14, 2012, 02:43 AM   #3
arentol
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I was in a gun store recently. A couple younger guys were putting some guns on layaway. The clerk says to them that a nice AR had just come into the store and he had put it on layaway. He asks if they would like to see it. They say sure. Clerk brings it out in its case. He lays the case down, opens it up, and says the two guys can pick it up and check it out. Clerk steps away to finish their paperwork....

About 5 people ended up handing that thing around to each other and not one person, including the clerk, checked the chamber at any time from when the case was opened until the case was closed again.

I watched it the whole time for fear some idiot would actually point it at me. Ultimately it only ended up being pointed at one person, the clerk, for a second or so while being passed between people. The guys handling it were at least smart enough not to aim it at anyone while actually trying out the ACOG sight. In retrospect I probably should have said something.

It scares me sometimes how casual some people get to this stuff. Clerk hands me a gun that he just cleared and guess what I do? I clear it. All the clerks in all the gunshops in the world will only make a mistake 1 time in 100 million, but if you don't clear the gun and your clerk is the 1 in 100 million, then you may just have your life farked forever over not taking 1 second to clear the gun. Is it really worth it?
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Old February 14, 2012, 07:21 AM   #4
dmazur
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I don't get to that many gun stores, so I can't offer any insight as to how many actually do the extra steps of locking the action open. I assumed it was the better gun stores. That assumption may not be valid.

Perhaps I should have said "...at some gun stores."

At any rate, the extra safety steps seem easy enough. Repeated a few hundred times a day, I'm sure it would get tedious.

When I first saw this, many years ago, I asked what it was all about. The salesman, who had quite a bit of patience, explained to me how you didn't know the loaded/unloaded status until you checked. It didn't matter that it was racked, behind the counter and it was almost impossible for it to accidentally get loaded. You checked anyway. When I asked, "But why lock the action open? Why not just check it and close the action again?", he said, "That's so the customer knows it's unloaded."

After inspecting a gun, I always lock the action open (or open the bolt) before handing it back. Some salesmen say thanks.
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Last edited by dmazur; February 14, 2012 at 12:39 PM.
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Old February 14, 2012, 08:45 AM   #5
jhenry
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I have seen more than a few guns come into a store and get handed to the employee who then pointed out the round in the chamber. All but one person was very embarrassed. The one who was not was a very elderly lady who was getting rid of her husbands guns after he passed away. She told the clerk "thank you honey" and handed over the rest, which were carefully checked. This was at the RPM Gunshop on James Island, SC. I don't know if that shop even exists anymore, but it was a good one.
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Old February 14, 2012, 12:50 PM   #6
Tom Servo
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Already under discussion here.
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